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Madden NFL 19 Patch 1.21 Available - Addresses Falling Forward Issue

Madden NFL 19

Madden NFL 19 Patch 1.21 Available - Addresses Falling Forward Issue

Madden NFL 19 game update 1.21 is available now, weighing in at about 200MB. The small patch mainly addresses the issue with offensive players falling forward too often, when momentum, more often than not, is on the defensive side of the ball.

The issue was noticed in Madden NFL 19  patch 1.19, released a couple of weeks ago. The team mentioned it was being investigated last week, after releasing patch 1.20.

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  1. cdcool
    It's working, slider adjustments needed

    Did they fix it by finding a solution somewhere in the middle of what we had before and the crazy falling forward animations that were introduced in the last patch? Or did they just revert it back to how it was before where ball carriers always get stood up and stopped in their tracks by defenders?
    I ran each play of my 60 play gameplan a couple of times. All in all, I put in about an hour and a half of playing in. The game appears to be playing almost exactly as it did before tackle animation issue. I did not experience even one bizzaro animation sequence.
    One slight improvement that I did notice was that if a defensive lineman only got a hand on me, I was able to experience forward momentum. Also, if I split 2 defenders coming in for a tackle, I would gain an additional 2 or 3 yards. However, this appeared to be a realistic outcome.
    Nowhere did I see the "force field wall" the defender was hitting and then moving backwards slightly before the collision animation. Thankfully, I don't think I'll be running for 200 yards per game any longer. Perhaps most importantly, I did not see any bugs rear their ugly heads as a result of this patch.
    It looks like they fixed what they promised, the falling forward memento looks fixed in my opinion. I'm testing my sliders now, again doesn't look like they screwed too much up. I just have to revert/change the sliders that I changed to compensate for the bug, I don't think they will revert back 100%, adjustments will be needed but I'm not seeing anything too crazy.
    This is what I'm seeing on the PC CPU vs CPU
    cdcool
    They falling backwards now..LOL!

    Ah, now I know who you are in Twitter. lol
    Anyway, I played a quarter, and everything looked real nice.
    roadman
    Ah, now I know who you are in Twitter. lol
    Anyway, I played a quarter, and everything looked real nice.

    I aint got nothing to hide..LOL
    Make sure you got the right guy tho, I'm never on Twitter, use to be. I'm not Carl Cook either, he got the name before I did, I just googled cdcool
    It's possible that they reverted things exactly back to how they were pre 1.19, but IMO there is still better momentum for offensive players than there was before, The contextual appropriateness of when struggling for extra yardage animations sequences occur is better i.e. happens with realistic regularity. This with slider adjustments on All-Madden.
    Can't speak for online play, because that space has it's own weirdness that goes on, but it seems like nothing else has been broken on the User vs CPU front.
    Just finished up a franchise game and for the first time I ran for less than 100 yards. Before the fix, I was breaking off several big runs per-game with Ezekiel Elliott and hitting 200 yards wasn't much of a struggle. I'm playing on All Pro with user defeated only sliders.
    Game played really well. Felt abit tighter and I got my butt kicked by the Giants. Noticed that sacks and TFL's are once again being properly awarded. The one new thing that came to light is that the spin move is harder to pull off as it should be. The defender closing just a tick faster now.
    Does anyone know if you are playing someone online and can the person you are playing have the defense strafe, ball hawk, etc... on and you don’t have those items on?
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
    jfsolo
    It's possible that they reverted things exactly back to how they were pre 1.19, but IMO there is still better momentum for offensive players than there was before, The contextual appropriateness of when struggling for extra yardage animations sequences occur is better i.e. happens with realistic regularity. This with slider adjustments on All-Madden.
    Can't speak for online play, because that space has it's own weirdness that goes on, but it seems like nothing else has been broken on the User vs CPU front.

    About a week ago, I put out a statement on Twitter regarding balancing the momentum issue and out of left field, yesterday, a new Madden person liked my post. mmm, I went to her profile and it said Rolltide fan, software, Madden Director, Launching Director for Madden 20. Perhaps she was giving me a heads up about the title update. lol Coincidence? Probably.
    Played two games. Neither time did I rush for 100 yards. 91 and 74. But one game with the 91 was because I was behind and abandoned the run but averaged over 6 ypc. Under 3 ypc in the other game.
    Not sure it's balanced between fall forward and stone walled but it is better. Didn't notice much falling forward at all but got tackled for a loss many times in the first game that I only got 74 yards. Only maybe a couple times the fall forward happened between both games.
    roadman
    About a week ago, I put out a statement on Twitter regarding balancing the momentum issue and out of left field, yesterday, a new Madden person liked my post. mmm, I went to her profile and it said Rolltide fan, software, Madden Director, Launching Director for Madden 20. Perhaps she was giving me a heads up about the title update. lol Coincidence? Probably.

    Feels good when they give you that way down the road like on twitter. They watch that stuff a lot closer than people on here give credit. They don’t comment much, but if they like a comment, it means something. They’re just collecting reactions on twitter and acknowledging good advice with likes way down the road. Good stuff.
    tommycoa
    Feels good when they give you that way down the road like on twitter. They watch that stuff a lot closer than people on here give credit. They don’t comment much, but if they like a comment, it means something. They’re just collecting reactions on twitter and acknowledging good advice with likes way down the road. Good stuff.

    And I just received another like from the same person.
    Someone complained that the update took too long and we should be compensated by EA.
    I agree, it was a frustrating issue, but to have it out in 2.5 weeks with perhaps 7 to 10 days in certification, that isn't bad. If they rush things out the door, with all the legacy coding in place, there could be a tendency to break something else in the game and we all know that is based on past history.
    It shouldn't have happened in the first place, either.
    I cant believe yall made madden do this. We will never have a realistic madden if as soon as they have players falling realistic, people panic because the cpu is getting 2 more yards then before. Madden finally for the first time was using momentum and power RBs played amazing. This needed to be fixed for years and they managed it in an update and people freaked out. Wtf is wrong with you guys
    83evans
    I cant believe yall made madden do this. We will never have a realistic madden if as soon as they have players falling realistic, people panic because the cpu is getting 2 more yards then before. Madden finally for the first time was using momentum and power RBs played amazing. This needed to be fixed for years and they managed it in an update and people freaked out. Wtf is wrong with you guys

    People were happy, not panicking, because the AI RB got a couple more yards when running into single tacklers, but they were upset that:
    (1) Even WRs and (non-scrambling) QBs were blowing through LBs (or even DEs) at times that made no sense visually.
    (2) The animation trigger was messing up stats (TFL and sacks).
    (3) Multiple times in most games, the fall away from the tackler animation would trigger in completely illogical situations (such as a QB being hit in the pocket, or an WR being tackled from the side or behind), leading to silly results.
    83evans
    I cant believe yall made madden do this. We will never have a realistic madden if as soon as they have players falling realistic, people panic because the cpu is getting 2 more yards then before. Madden finally for the first time was using momentum and power RBs played amazing. This needed to be fixed for years and they managed it in an update and people freaked out. Wtf is wrong with you guys

    Realistic? WTF is wrong with YOU?
    I could have lived with it but it wasn't right. In what realistic NFL does Baker Mayfield truck LBs?
    NimitsTexan
    People were happy, not panicking, because the AI RB got a couple more yards when running into single tacklers, but they were upset that:
    (1) Even WRs and (non-scrambling) QBs were blowing through LBs (or even DEs) at times that made no sense visually.
    (2) The animation trigger was messing up stats (TFL and sacks).
    (3) Multiple times in most games, the fall away from the tackler animation would trigger in completely illogical situations (such as a QB being hit in the pocket, or an WR being tackled from the side or behind), leading to silly results.

    Most of the animations were fight for extra yards and appeared that way. Finesse players werent plowing through defenders, they were triggering the animations such as the sidestep and fall forward or the spin one. That was way more realistic. And yes panicking is the perfect word. Yall panicked because yall havent seen madden put together fully live RBs before and it was causing people to lose some games.
    The idea of Baker lowering his shoulder and getting 2 yards vs a LB is WAY more realistic than every single power RB, or TE getting driven backwards after running into a DB with full momentum and being 5 8 175. One of these happens time to time and the other doesnt. Almost every QB in the nfl has lowered his shoulder a few times vs players bigger then them go get yards
    83evans
    The idea of Baker lowering his shoulder and getting 2 yards vs a LB is WAY more realistic than every single power RB, or TE getting driven backwards after running into a DB with full momentum and being 5 8 175. One of these happens time to time and the other doesnt. Almost every QB in the nfl has lowered his shoulder a few times vs players bigger then them go get yards

    Is was more like 4 yards. And no, not every QB can or will do that.
    I just wanted I blend of both and I don't think it is back to where it was before but I've played two games. Need more time with it.
    Rayzaa
    Is was more like 4 yards. And no, not every QB can or will do that.
    It isn't back to where it was.

    Yes it is. Im playing cpu vs cpu. Every player i have has fight extra yards on. And its 44 tackling. Out of 10 tackles, 8 have been the push back animation. Frank gore is getting smashed every play.
    I would rather see my player fight for a few yards. In my games players were still only averaging 3-5 ypc. For the first time in history i saw a RB race untouched to be confronted by a safety. Instead of being knocked back and carried, he lowered his shoulder and got a TD. It was so real
    Rayzaa
    I don't play CPU vs CPU. I play User vs CPU

    Yeah. Im seeing it play out like im watching it on tv. The last patch actually looked like a real game. Even the bad plays looked like a player trying to get yards. Also therr was more variation
    This goes back to what ppl & I've been wanting for yrs. Give the choice to the user of what patch they want to play on. If ppl play online well then there going to have to all be on the same patch, but for offline users why does it matter.
    There definitely needed a balance there. I wasn't really happy with what we had yesterday ( it was cool seeing a power backs having more success, but seeing a QB flung 4 yards up the middle on a sack, ugly) or what we have today tbh. Madden should already be respecting the law of physics, weight, & momentum. So in my mind these instances & situations on the field should of been playing out with these three factors in mind in a realistic manner a long time ago.
    83evans
    It just shows we will never have a realistic madden with people getting outraged over them fixing a huge mess up.

    Realistic???? Lolololololol I would have the falling forward animation or fight for extra yards animation trigger even if I hit the ball carrier while his momentum was carrying him away from my defender trying to avoid the hit, they would still fall forward. I was constantly slacking the QB while they were running AWAY from the pressure only for them to somehow push forward to get 3 or 4 yards back. Then even worse when that happened the sack wouldn't get recorded.
    I was sick of guys online taking off with the QB way more, even with non athletic QBs because they knew they were always going to plow through my defender for an extra few yards. Especially in the red zone this became the strategy for some guys, just take off with the QB up the middle because even if I stopped him he was still going to push right through my defender for another few yards, often times right into the endzone.
    It was producing some really weird looking results that defied physics. Don't get mad at those on here who wanted it fixed, get mad at EA for pretty much reverting back to close to what we had before rather than trying to find some solution in the middle. I've gotten my RB to fight for a couple of extra yards a few times in the two games I've played since the patch. I will agree though that a lot if times it is now to easy for the defender to bring a ball carrier down.
    Rayzaa
    Is was more like 4 yards. And no, not every QB can or will do that.
    I just wanted I blend of both and I don't think it is back to where it was before but I've played two games. Need more time with it.

    Everytime, it was always an extra 3 or 4 yards if not more. It was getting ridiculous to to the point where guys online were running way more often with their QB because they knew they would get those extra yards.
    I'm with you, I wanted something in the middle of the two extremes that we've had.
    I watched 3 cpu vs cpu games yesterday and have never seen a more realistic looking Madden. They did a nice job making the fall forward more contextual...they did not eliminate it, but balanced things out so that the "over the top" wonkiness that was very real and prevalent before is gone. Nice job.
    C
    83evans
    I cant believe yall made madden do this. We will never have a realistic madden if as soon as they have players falling realistic, people panic because the cpu is getting 2 more yards then before. Madden finally for the first time was using momentum and power RBs played amazing. This needed to be fixed for years and they managed it in an update and people freaked out. Wtf is wrong with you guys

    There was NOTHING realistic about that. Had a qb nearly stationary, a d-linemen coming at him full speed, and he falls forward the opposite direction of the d-linemen.
    83evans
    Yeah. Im seeing it play out like im watching it on tv. The last patch actually looked like a real game. Even the bad plays looked like a player trying to get yards. Also therr was more variation

    When have you seen a qb fall in the opposite vector direction he was hit from?
    Yes, some of the animations looked good, but the PHYSICS was absolutely wonky.
    Shosum13
    Realistic???? Lolololololol I would have the falling forward animation or fight for extra yards animation trigger even if I hit the ball carrier while his momentum was carrying him away from my defender trying to avoid the hit, they would still fall forward. I was constantly slacking the QB while they were running AWAY from the pressure only for them to somehow push forward to get 3 or 4 yards back. Then even worse when that happened the sack wouldn't get recorded.
    I was sick of guys online taking off with the QB way more, even with non athletic QBs because they knew they were always going to plow through my defender for an extra few yards. Especially in the red zone this became the strategy for some guys, just take off with the QB up the middle because even if I stopped him he was still going to push right through my defender for another few yards, often times right into the endzone.
    It was producing some really weird looking results that defied physics. Don't get mad at those on here who wanted it fixed, get mad at EA for pretty much reverting back to close to what we had before rather than trying to find some solution in the middle. I've gotten my RB to fight for a couple of extra yards a few times in the two games I've played since the patch. I will agree though that a lot if times it is now to easy for the defender to bring a ball carrier down.

    They should add Madden 2017 tackles back and most in here will be happy. Far better tackling than is now. Go back to physics and move away from scripted tackles :)
    Rayzaa
    Realistic? WTF is wrong with YOU?
    I could have lived with it but it wasn't right. In what realistic NFL does Baker Mayfield truck LBs?

    100%! Anyone who thought it was realistic must not play against others! Just watching the cpu vs. cpu people have no idea how horrible this problem was!
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
    booker21
    They should add Madden 2017 tackles back and most in here will be happy. Far better tackling than is now. Go back to physics and move away from scripted tackles :)

    I really liked what they did in Madden 17 from a tackling perspective. According to Rex Dickson, the ignite engine was still running a partially based physics engine, which was how they added ball physics to that game.
    Whether there was some semblance of physics remaining or not in the area of tackling, by holding the left stick forward during contact, I could feel forward momentum when it made sense for that to take place. Also, more than 2 defenders affected the outcome of tackles, whereas in Madden 19 I am only seeing 1 or 2 actually have an impact.
    I did not expect a simple patch to "fix" tackling. However, in my humble opinion through my eyes, tackling was the worst I've ever experienced in any edition of Madden as a result of the previous patch. While the tackling isn't where I'd like it to be, I thought they did a good job of making the game playable again.
    The one thing I think we can all agree upon is that the tackling bug that occurred certainly brought to light the need for EA to put significant effort into getting tackling that right going forward. After all, almost every play ends with a tackle doesn't it?.....
    asantead22
    100%! Anyone who thought it was realistic must not play against others! Just watching the cpu vs. cpu people have no idea how horrible this problem was!
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

    Playing against the CPU I thought it was better last week than now....but I don't play online so I will have to take your word for it. For my experience I was hoping they would just fix a couple of the weird animations....or take into account real body weight and momentum. After playing a few games it feels like we are right back to the suction tackles stopping everyone dead in their tracks.
    stinkubus
    If you like the animations better then say so, but M17 did NOT have a physics engine. Stop gas lighting the forum.

    Booker did not claim Madden 2017 had a physics engine. He claimed the tackling was better in that game and that he would like to see EA go back to phsyics based tackling. According to Rex Dickson, Madden 17's Ignite engine was still a functioning partial physics engine, which is how they added ball physics to that edition.
    Gas lighting a forum usually occurs when one poster personally attacks another's opinion personally, especially if it's backed up by misinformation.
    Rhudey
    Playing against the CPU I thought it was better last week than now....but I don't play online so I will have to take your word for it. For my experience I was hoping they would just fix a couple of the weird animations....or take into account real body weight and momentum. After playing a few games it feels like we are right back to the suction tackles stopping everyone dead in their tracks.

    The suction animations unfortunately are embedded into this engine! I have always said they need to scrap it. Again until this company has competition and someone else makes a game without these issues EA will never make a quality game!!!
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
    This is why the animation was more realistic. The animation we see now has never happened to Elliot, Lynch, or Peterson. Gronk should never be slammed backwards with full momentum going against a 5 8 DB.
    You cant even squint your eyes to make it seem right, it physically is IMPOSSIBLE. At least the fight for extra yards you can squint your eyes and view it as a QB fighting for every yard. Also i had not seen this animation the way yall are saying it happens. It happens like maybe once a game. Probably more for players because they are slamming the joy stick up every play to get more yards which i assume triggers this animation more. But the CPU on all pro is realistic with the ammount it is triggered. They should at least leave it on patch 20 for sim players and yall can have your mega tackling so its "fair" online. But sim fans deserve to have running backs playing "live"
    edgevoice
    Booker did not claim Madden 2017 had a physics engine. He claimed the tackling was better in that game and that he would like to see EA go back to phsyics based tackling. According to Rex Dickson, Madden 17's Ignite engine was still a functioning partial physics engine, which is how they added ball physics to that edition.
    Gas lighting a forum usually occurs when one poster personally attacks another's opinion personally, especially if it's backed up by misinformation.

    I'm not attacking anyone's opinion. He made a statement (M17 had physics based tackling) which is simply untrue. What the devs told you about ball physics has no bearing on that discussion.
    asantead22
    100%! Anyone who thought it was realistic must not play against others! Just watching the cpu vs. cpu people have no idea how horrible this problem was!
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

    True. The game don't play the same in CPU vs CPU mode.
    Yeah im starting to realize there is a difference in what we play. The cpu vs cpu fans are watching the game play out the way it should with no user input so the animations come out smooth and realistic
    User players have a tendency to smash the joystick up when getting tackled so this probably had a lot to do with the over use of this animation appearing
    83evans
    Yeah im starting to realize there is a difference in what we play. The cpu vs cpu fans are watching the game play out the way it should with no user input so the animations come out smooth and realistic
    User players have a tendency to smash the joystick up when getting tackled so this probably had a lot to do with the over use of this animation appearing

    There needs to be a balance between both. Users just want realism and cpu vs cpu guys get more realistic animations because the cpu doesn’t have to create imbalance against itself. Bottom line EA has never made a realistic running game or passing game. Fight for yards was great idea but never implemented correctly. In real football any offense players can attempt to gain extra yards even though it may not work out that way!!!
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
    83evans
    Yeah im starting to realize there is a difference in what we play. The cpu vs cpu fans are watching the game play out the way it should with no user input so the animations come out smooth and realistic
    User players have a tendency to smash the joystick up when getting tackled so this probably had a lot to do with the over use of this animation appearing
    Might be easier to get the convo going without the pointless self righteous, holier than though attitude. Watching cpu v cpu games doesnt make you a "sim" player and everyone else an online joystick smashing non sim player. There are plenty of people who like to play against the cpu or another person and "gasp!" Play online, that also want a sim experience.
    Your opinion is not the "right" and "realistic" one just because you watch the games and consider yourself sim. Most of the people, including myself, want a sim game and I thought the fall forward glitch was bad. It made it unplayable for me, for all the reasons already given in this forum.
    The game needs real physics. It needs to respect size, speed, and momentum. It doesn't. Adding a ,everyone falls forward no matter the size or direction the guy is going glitch, is not more realistic than if they never fall forward. Neither way respects physics or momentum.
    Most of us on here want the same thing. Presenting your frustrations that way and alienating people doesn't help.
    Sent from my SM-G930VL using Tapatalk
    So, I’ve only played one game, now, after this fix, and I’m extremely happy. I happened to be at the start of a new season. I always play 1 preseason game to see any starting rookies and to see backup rookies in the 2nd to 4th qtr. I often user the 1st qtr and some of the 2nd. Then, I watch the rest of the game because I want to see how the rookies play without any user control and see if a cb gets his own INT or a rb breaks tackles, etc. After watching this game, I’m seeing pretty good tackle animations, in general. I’m seeing sticks when they should be sticks. I’m seeing proper momentum tackling, and stop of momentum tackling by big hitters. I’m also seeing some players fall forward WHEN APPROPRIATE. lol. My team gave up a TD to a wr who caught the ball on the 5, stepped toward the end zone, got hit from the side on the 3, and kept going forward, got hit from another tackler near the 1, but fell into the end zone appropriately based on the direction of the tacklers.
    So, I’m seeing everything right now as a user and as a watcher. I have not seen a single ‘reverse momentum’ tackle that we were seeing during the fall forward glitch days, so I’m extremely happy about that. Madden still doesn’t do physics all correctly, but I think this update didn’t just revert back to prior, I think they overall tweaked tackling/momentum appropriately. I give madden team a thumbs up for this update for both quickness and quality.
    I’m still watching the game and just saw a great catch over the middle, then a step upfield giving some momentum, hit from the left side, squirming forward, hit from the right side, still squirming forward, and finally tackled by a a third. He gained an extra 2-3 yards on what looked like context appropriate hits/tackling. Yeah, I’m thinking this update is solid.
    @83evans. Give this update a chance, I’m def still seeing some falling forward when appropriate, but not seeing the horrible wonkiness of physics in the patch that u liked.
    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    83evans
    Most of the animations were fight for extra yards and appeared that way. Finesse players werent plowing through defenders, they were triggering the animations such as the sidestep and fall forward or the spin one. That was way more realistic. And yes panicking is the perfect word. Yall panicked because yall havent seen madden put together fully live RBs before and it was causing people to lose some games.

    I too were seeing the same things as you and thought it was realistic except for some quirky outcomes that as stated have always been in the game..I agree with your opinion but also realize that others have different opinions and see the game differently.. I could have lived with how it was playing with the patch as opposed to what is was before and what i t is now..I respect everyone's opinion but like you disagree with the way Madden went with this patch..I said watch what you wish for ..this essentially gives the greenlight for ea to continue doing what they are doing.. Again no one is right or wrong in this it's just a matter of opinion.. I too have realized that true realistic football is not wanted despite cries for it..That's the divide in our community..it all depends on how you look at the game of football..I didn't even notice the stats tackling tracker and tell you the truth could care less about it I was more enthusiastic about the new direction with tackling and overall rb play..did it need slider adjustments yea..but it was an easy fix..again my opinion my man but I agree with ya..I just keep it moving and hope for a better game next release..I respect the developers and those who work on the game they are essentially in a no win situation unless you get those modes working riht..just calling it like I see it..momba out!!!
    edaddy
    I too were seeing the same things as you and thought it was realistic except for some quirky outcomes that as stated have always been in the game..I agree with your opinion but also realize that others have different opinions and see the game differently.. I could have lived with how it was playing with the patch as opposed to what is was before and what i t is now..I respect everyone's opinion but like you disagree with the way Madden went with this patch..I said watch what you wish for ..this essentially gives the greenlight for ea to continue doing what they are doing.. Again no one is right or wrong in this it's just a matter of opinion.. I too have realized that true realistic football is not wanted despite cries for it..That's the divide in our community..it all depends on how you look at the game of football..I didn't even notice the stats tackling tracker and tell you the truth could care less about it I was more enthusiastic about the new direction with tackling and overall rb play..did it need slider adjustments yea..but it was an easy fix..again my opinion my man but I agree with ya..I just keep it moving and hope for a better game next release..I respect the developers and those who work on the game they are essentially in a no win situation unless you get those modes working riht..just calling it like I see it..momba out!!!

    Well again if you are just playing CPU vs CPU it plays different. It's not that we don't want realistic football, because it isn't when you are playing the game before this patch.
    Play a game as a user to see how different it is.
    Not sure why some just like to watch but to each their own.
    83evans
    Yeah im starting to realize there is a difference in what we play. The cpu vs cpu fans are watching the game play out the way it should with no user input so the animations come out smooth and realistic
    User players have a tendency to smash the joystick up when getting tackled so this probably had a lot to do with the over use of this animation appearing

    I'm a CPU vs CPU player, I watch and control all 32 Teams, so you as a User Player will have different issues from me. It's two games in one.
    Rayzaa
    Well again if you are just playing CPU vs CPU it plays different. It's not that we don't want realistic football, because it isn't when you are playing the game before this patch.
    Play a game as a user to see how different it is.
    Not sure why some just like to watch but to each their own.

    My man I never ever have played the game CPU vs CPU strictly payer vs CPU..again I adjusted sliders and had realistic tackling outcomes...were some quirky yes sir but that,s been in since release..again its my opinion I thought the game played great and I dealt with whatever quirks came up but for the most part it wasn't an every down situation and I just didn't see it... It's back to what it was which was never realistic to me..I would much rather see a rb fall forward than getting blown up by 180 lb dbs..but again that me..you are entitled to yours and I respect everyone's opinion..I just have been this road too many times when people complain about PI, DH, aggressive wr animations and the list goes on..and I know the outcome will be that they get a reason to be nerfed..I am not a stats person especially with videogames because they arent realistic and you can manipulate any way you want..again my opinion my man..I hope this patch has satisfied those that didn't like the last patch..out
    Rayzaa
    Well again if you are just playing CPU vs CPU it plays different. It's not that we don't want realistic football, because it isn't when you are playing the game before this patch.
    Play a game as a user to see how different it is.
    Not sure why some just like to watch but to each their own.

    You are not sure why? Why is it allowed in the game?
    The bug that no one I can see is talking about that should've been fixed, is the accuracy of the curl route over the middle of the field.
    It is almost always an inaccurate, or intercepted pass straight to the defender.
    I first noticed it when they dropped one of the previous patches, and hasn't been addressed, or fixed yet. How can you have a route in the game, that is un-usable/throwable?
    Edit: Also, playing a game right now, and just ran into the CPU RB getting thrown down by one of my defenders and the play wasn't whistled dead. RB gets back up, and I have to tackle him again. Wasn't this supposed to be fixed!?
    83evans
    This is why the animation was more realistic. The animation we see now has never happened to Elliot, Lynch, or Peterson. Gronk should never be slammed backwards with full momentum going against a 5 8 DB.
    You cant even squint your eyes to make it seem right, it physically is IMPOSSIBLE. At least the fight for extra yards you can squint your eyes and view it as a QB fighting for every yard. Also i had not seen this animation the way yall are saying it happens. It happens like maybe once a game. Probably more for players because they are slamming the joy stick up every play to get more yards which i assume triggers this animation more. But the CPU on all pro is realistic with the ammount it is triggered. They should at least leave it on patch 20 for sim players and yall can have your mega tackling so its "fair" online. But sim fans deserve to have running backs playing "live"

    This game is so awful it’s dividing the community even further. So many valid points on both sides. I’m not sure this game/company can generate realistic collisions. Which is bizarre because the older games had problems but not to this degree.
    I use the Seahawks primarily and before the patch players like Chris Carson were useless. Getting flattened by cornerbacks and flat footed lineman is unbelievably frustrating. Wtf happened you used to be able to run on 3rd and 3? There’s no push and then add the diving shoestring tackles and you have to go untouched to gain any rushing yards. Man this game gets me hot. If you enjoy no disrespect but it’s not fun to me.
    Sent from my iPad using Operation Sports
    stinkubus
    If you like the animations better then say so, but M17 did NOT have a physics engine. Stop gas lighting the forum.

    I. It had rag doll. That’s what I call physics.
    It was removed. If you can’t see the difference not my problem.
    See how the ball carrier react to the 2nd and 3rd tackle And 2019 once the animation trigger there are no new reaction.
    https://youtu.be/EFXjxsImhKc
    https://youtu.be/awGdARrA3zw
    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Played 4 games now.
    I think it's balanced better now. Yes your RB gets stonewalled at times but you also get a push forward other times so I think it's an improvement.
    Frankly it was too easy to run the ball with the always fall forward happening so I'm good with this.
    Now to fix the all too often blocked kicks and terrible pass blocking
    booker21
    I. It had rag doll. That’s what I call physics.
    It was removed. If you can’t see the difference not my problem.
    See how the ball carrier react to the 2nd and 3rd tackle And 2019 once the animation trigger there are no new reaction.
    https://youtu.be/EFXjxsImhKc
    https://youtu.be/awGdARrA3zw
    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

    Good and fair comparison to the difference in tackling here. I have yet to see more than 2 defenders affect the ballcarrier when colliding in Madden 19. Also, during the attempted tackle animation in Madden 17, the play wasn't always necessarily "over", as the user still had control of player rather than being locked into an animation. It is rare in Madden 19 that once my player is somewhat wrapped up, that I am able to break free.
    Really appreciative of the patch. I did not anticipate that it would include any sort of major overall at this late stage. Again, hopefully tackling will be a priority in M20. Thanks again for the videos Book.
    edgevoice
    Good and fair comparison to the difference in tackling here. I have yet to see more than 2 defenders affect the ballcarrier when colliding in Madden 19. Also, during the attempted tackle animation in Madden 17, the play wasn't always necessarily "over", as the user still had control of player rather than being locked into an animation. It is rare in Madden 19 that once my player is somewhat wrapped up, that I am able to break free.
    Really appreciative of the patch. I did not anticipate that it would include any sort of major overall at this late stage. Again, hopefully tackling will be a priority in M20. Thanks again for the videos Book.

    Kinda off the path here, but I believe this is part of the reason why your not seeing more players engaging on tackles. Here is how EA has it set. I have both of these values set at higher values and I'm seeing 3 sometimes even 4 (rare) guys on tackles. These values seem to work like timers. Were they have it set it seems like it doesn't allow enough time for other defenders to get over for gang like tackling.
    DaReal Milticket
    Kinda off the path here, but I believe this is part of the reason why your not seeing more players engaging on tackles. Here is how EA has it set. I have both of these values set at higher values and I'm seeing 3 sometimes even 4 (rare) guys on tackles. These values seem to work like timers. Were they have it set it seems like it doesn't allow enough time for other defenders to get over for gang like tackling.

    Not off path at all and thanks for sharing Mil. You must be having quite a time with the PC version. I envy you with some of the adjustments you're able to make.
    I see 3 or 4 defenders converging on the ballcarrier, but when I view the replay, on 2 players at a time appear to be involved in the tackle.
    Again, no way I expected EA to attempt to remedy this with a title update. They did a nice job cleaning up the wonkiness without breaking anything else.
    stinkubus
    If you are using terms like "vector direction" then EA isn't the only one with physics issues...

    I could have said "unit vector" but how many people know what that means? Don't talk to me about math son I've taken Intro to Abstract Algebra, Intro to Analysis, and Intro to Topology, among the undergraduate courses not limited to: Transition to Higher Mathematics, Differential Equations I and II, Linear Algebra, Calculus I, II, and III, and of course Mathematical Methods of Physics I and II. I also take money to do people's math homework.
    ForUntoOblivionSoar∞
    I could have said "unit vector" but how many people know what that means? Don't talk to me about math son I've taken Intro to Abstract Algebra, Intro to Analysis, and Intro to Topology, among the undergraduate courses not limited to: Transition to Higher Mathematics, Differential Equations I and II, Linear Algebra, Calculus I, II, and III, and of course Mathematical Methods of Physics I and II. I also take money to do people's math homework.

    It’s not your fault Will Hunting.
    Sent from my iPad using Operation Sports
    Anyway, moving on from stinkubus' erroneous assumption that I don't know anything about math because I tried to state something in lay terms instead of talking about unit vectors and magnitudes, here's some videos that happened after the patch. Better or worse?




    (Pettis went forward while being gang tackled in the first one, so I don't think people are getting thrown back as frequently as before the patch.)
    DaReal Milticket
    Kinda off the path here, but I believe this is part of the reason why your not seeing more players engaging on tackles. Here is how EA has it set. I have both of these values set at higher values and I'm seeing 3 sometimes even 4 (rare) guys on tackles. These values seem to work like timers. Were they have it set it seems like it doesn't allow enough time for other defenders to get over for gang like tackling.

    Yes, but they are still scripted tackles. Still not rag doll effect as it was in 2017. What i'm saying is that if the ball carrier is engaged with 2 players and you are the 3rd one that come to help, if you are not in the right position to trigger the scripted 3 player tackle animation your player would
    1.-Not engage at all, (never pressed dive and your player does not react?)
    2.-React but hit a rock solid mountain causing no effect what so ever with your defender falling down.
    3.-react causing the rock solid mountain to break and create a completely new animation (this usually happens when the player is engaged with 1 defender, not two).
    booker21
    Yes, but they are still scripted tackles. Still not rag doll effect as it was in 2017. What i'm saying is that if the ball carrier is engaged with 2 players and you are the 3rd one that come to help, if you are not in the right position to trigger the scripted 3 player tackle animation your player would
    1.-Not engage at all, (never pressed dive and your player does not react?)
    2.-React but hit a rock solid mountain causing no effect what so ever with your defender falling down.
    3.-react causing the rock solid mountain to break and create a completely new animation (this usually happens when the player is engaged with 1 defender, not two).

    I wasn't comparing it to 17, totally different game.
    edgevoice
    Not off path at all and thanks for sharing Mil. You must be having quite a time with the PC version. I envy you with some of the adjustments you're able to make.
    I see 3 or 4 defenders converging on the ballcarrier, but when I view the replay, on 2 players at a time appear to be involved in the tackle.
    Again, no way I expected EA to attempt to remedy this with a title update. They did a nice job cleaning up the wonkiness without breaking anything else.

    Yeah, just observations after messing around with the editor the past 3 -4 months. Alot of trial & error on things, which is a pain. I'm loving 19 for what it is and the things I can change. Working on giving offense players a little bit more momentum as we speak.
    asantead22
    100%! Anyone who thought it was realistic must not play against others! Just watching the cpu vs. cpu people have no idea how horrible this problem was!
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

    I don't play Arcade games, you will have different issues, Madden 19 as a simulation CPU vs CPU works very well.
    cdcool
    I don't play Arcade games, you will have different issues, Madden 19 as a simulation CPU vs CPU works very well.

    That maybe true for cpu vs cpu but for guys that play against others experience the game totally different from you guys. Is it too much to ask EA for a good quality product for everyone that spend their hard earned money on Madden?
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
    asantead22
    That maybe true for cpu vs cpu but for guys that play against others experience the game totally different from you guys. Is it too much to ask EA for a good quality product for everyone that spend their hard earned money on Madden?
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

    It's difficult, they should just make two versions of the game, trying to do both in the same game aint working.
    cdcool
    It's difficult, they should just make two versions of the game, trying to do both in the same game aint working.

    I agree but we both know the only fix is another NFL game from another company will force them to either shape up or shape out!!!
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
    ForUntoOblivionSoar∞
    Anyway, moving on from stinkubus' erroneous assumption that I don't know anything about math because I tried to state something in lay terms instead of talking about unit vectors and magnitudes, here's some videos that happened after the patch. Better or worse?
    (Pettis went forward while being gang tackled in the first one, so I don't think people are getting thrown back as frequently as before the patch.)

    Thanks for posting the videos, but I am somewhat angry with you that you wouldn't sit next to me in math class....:y7:
    At first, the patch appeared to have returned tackling to it's previous state. However, after playing a couple of franchise games, I am seeing a bit more momentum interactions at times. I hit my TE on a post between cover 2 safeties and was able to drag them 3 or 4 yards afterwards. There was a slight hitch at the beginning of the tackle interaction, but the result played out within reason.
    I also like that I can play Tampa 2 again in that I can close with my LB's and blast receivers as the ball is coming in, since the "force field" has been removed.
    ForUntoOblivionSoar∞
    Anyway, moving on from stinkubus' erroneous assumption that I don't know anything about math because I tried to state something in lay terms instead of talking about unit vectors and magnitudes, here's some videos that happened after the patch. Better or worse?




    (Pettis went forward while being gang tackled in the first one, so I don't think people are getting thrown back as frequently as before the patch.)

    Except you are cherry picking highlights, the blow up the ball carrier backwards tackle occurs almost every second tackle and it's awful. I'm sick of running full speed at getting knocked completely backwards, where's the realism in that?
    Rhudey
    Except you are cherry picking highlights, the blow up the ball carrier backwards tackle occurs almost every second tackle and it's awful. I'm sick of running full speed at getting knocked completely backwards, where's the realism in that?

    Cherry picking implies intent. I just noticed cool tackles and recorded. However, I did not notice a lot of being knocked backwards at all. Maybe twice, and that was with multiple defenders hititng me. What I DID notice is THIS:
    Players being knocked PARALLEL TO THE GOAL LINE when they should have been knocked at an angle based on how the collision appeared to look right before impact (e.g., offensive player running parallel to the sideline, defender coming in at 2*pi/3 radians from the offensive player’s coordinate origin, which mathematically speaking, if their speeds and weights were similar, should have resulted in the player being knocked somewhere less than pi/2 and greater than 0, say pi/4 radians, but instead the ball carrier is knocked dead to the right).
    asantead22
    I agree but we both know the only fix is another NFL game from another company will force them to either shape up or shape out!!!
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

    I play text based Football games also, Front Office Football for one to add some variety. CPU vs CPU Franchise is fine, that’s the only feature I care about. :-)
    I'd much, much rather overpowered falling forward than overpowered forcing back. The latter is much more jarring visually and is not in line with the modern day NFL, where tough physical D like that is just not as common as it used to be.
    Based on my post title observations, I feel the game is playing better than before in user vs CPU mode. I only see the WWE type tackles every once in awhile.
    If your experiencing it more often, to each their own. I'm seeing enough forward progress plays on 3rd and short and gl plays. Huge plus on this end.
    I would like all the WWE type tackles out of the game, because when it does happen, it's a eye sore.
    roadman
    Based on my post title observations, I feel the game is playing better than before in user vs CPU mode. I only see the WWE type tackles every once in awhile.
    If your experiencing it more often, to each their own. I'm seeing enough forward progress plays on 3rd and short and gl plays. Huge plus on this end.
    I would like all the WWE type tackles out of the game, because when it does happen, it's a eye sore.

    I'm with you on this one, I enjoy the way that it is playing right now. I was hoping for a solution more in the middle of the two extremes but I still do see ball carriers get extra yards from time to time. It's better than all of the weird animations we were getting before. I got tired of guys taking off with their QB up the middle all of the time when they were inside my 5 because they new even if my DT stopped them they were still going to push forward for another 3 to 5 yards in user vs user games.
    I feel like a lot of the people that were happy with the falling forward animations play User vs CPU with sliders because you could cut down on the frequency of the awkward animations with some slider adjustments. The problem is you also have user vs user players and even CPU vs CPU guys, more than I would of thought there were after reading some of these forum responses. I personally play both User vs User and User vs CPU. I have a couple of solo franchises that I bounce between playing but also am in a 32 man user franchise and play the occasional online head to head game. The problem is while some people may have had sliders that made the falling forward animation bearable in head to head there are no sliders and most online user leagues play with default sliders because everyone plays the game different so it would be hard to find slider adjustments that work for everyone.
    I think the bigger issue with the game is the need to really work on making the sim and competitive game modes play differently. Give the competitive guys the freedom they want so "stick skills" matter. But for sim make momentum and size matter more, and bring back the foot planting and tougher change of direction. I play on sim and I want to be punished for being out of position and not see my opponent usering the MLB out of position only to be able to easily change direction and cover a route downfield.
    I haven't played this game since August... Why is this issue finally being addressed now? I appreciate the continued support of the game this long after release. But true momentum and physics were never truly in this game to begin with -- it's all just predetermined animations playing out. And always has been.
    iLLWiLL
    I haven't played this game since August... Why is this issue finally being addressed now? I appreciate the continued support of the game this long after release. But true momentum and physics were never truly in this game to begin with -- it's all just predetermined animations playing out. And always has been.

    Probably testing for madden 20 and getting consumers to react and give feedback. Didnt take long at all to fix. They did a march patch last year that kinda tightened the game up as well.
    Nza
    I'd much, much rather overpowered falling forward than overpowered forcing back. The latter is much more jarring visually and is not in line with the modern day NFL, where tough physical D like that is just not as common as it used to be.

    If I had to choose, I am not so sure I wouldn't agree with you. However, why can't we have the middle ground? nearly completely eliminate the stupid 100% reverse momentum tackles, and then make the falling forward thing happen only when moment dictates it.
    I am happy with the running game, but sideline/endzone (staying in bounds) and receiver aggressiveness are still not what they used to be. Disappointed it hasn't been addressed. If it had been addressed this year, it would take a lot to keep me from playing it through next cycle, unless next cycle is all of that and better. Patches have improved the game greatly otherwise, but does this bother anyone else?
    l8knight1
    I am happy with the running game, but sideline/endzone (staying in bounds) and receiver aggressiveness are still not what they used to be. Disappointed it hasn't been addressed. If it had been addressed this year, it would take a lot to keep me from playing it through next cycle, unless next cycle is all of that and better. Patches have improved the game greatly otherwise, but does this bother anyone else?

    Those are definitely weaknesses that I'm disappointed in, especially the receiver aggressiveness. I feel like that was a tuning decision made for the competitive community to force or "reward" User catching on 50/50 balls, but doing so destroyed the natural ball skills of all receivers, especially if you play no switch.
    jfsolo
    Those are definitely weaknesses that I'm disappointed in, especially the receiver aggressiveness. I feel like that was a tuning decision made for the competitive community to force or "reward" User catching on 50/50 balls, but doing so destroyed the natural ball skills of all receivers, especially if you play no switch.

    The WR/DB interactions especially in 50/50 ball situations is one of my biggest complaints of this game. Even user catching on 50/50 balls doesn't help, the defender wins the battle a majority of the time. Playing user vs user if you use aggressive catch and the other user initiates a user pick animation your WR won't even turn around and try to high point the ball, they just awkwardly put their hands in the air and watch the DB go up and pick it. If you don't user the WR and just rely on the CPU then forget it, the ball will more than likely be picked. I want to see organic looking interactions where both the DB and WR go up for a ball and the result of the interaction is determined by ratings combined with a little bit of randomness.
    Plus to your point of the WR interactions being tuned for the competitive crowd, I thought that was the reason we had a sim and competitive game mode. I thought competitive was supposed to play more in to ratings and be less about "stick skills" and competitive be more driven by "stick skills." The way they play now there is not that much of a difference.
    One of my other big complaints is suction blocking and just the OL/DL interaction as a whole. Once you get sucked in a block it feels like you are suctioned to that OL until you are able to shed it. It's frustrating to have a good pursuit angle on a RB only to get suctioned in to a blocking animation even though the OL wasn't even in a good position to initiate it. Especially with the way in user vs user people love to call an inside run and almost IMMEDIATELY bounce it to the outside because of the CPU defenders tendencies to over pursue based on the original run that was called. That strategy is so weak and I have 0 respect for any user that uses it. Finding a cut back lane is one thing but I'm talking when they immediately bounce it all the way outside. I don't get how people find any enjoyment winning a game by taking advantage of the CPU logic.
    Fyi all, it was interesting after 1.21 patch when playing a game, I saw an animation that looked very much like the quick fall-fwd one, an RB tackled solo by CB. I checked stats after the play and there was no recorded tackle for him, neither a banner notification that he got a tackle. After game I confirmed, no solo tackles for him. So perhaps the fall-fwd animation is still remotely possible w/o the tackling recording being fixed. But in my handful of games, that was the only tackle I saw like that. And thankfully, it was with proper fwd momentum of bigger RB vs lighter DB, and not the reverse-momentum version. Definitely don't mind the proper fwd-momentum animation still being there, but a little disappointed it doesn't record the tackle when it happens.
    Fyi also, Player vs CPU Xbox, and I tuned tackling down slightly for CPU and on both sides, I'm seeing satisfactory momentum tackling, sometimes stuffed, sometimes bowling through a little or a lot when head-on, and some good angle momentum tackles. Very rare with the WWE blowup, not even once per game.
    EP
    The strength of strength is grace.
    xlivelove
    Fyi all, it was interesting after 1.21 patch when playing a game, I saw an animation that looked very much like the quick fall-fwd one, an RB tackled solo by CB. I checked stats after the play and there was no recorded tackle for him, neither a banner notification that he got a tackle. After game I confirmed, no solo tackles for him. So perhaps the fall-fwd animation is still remotely possible w/o the tackling recording being fixed. But in my handful of games, that was the only tackle I saw like that. And thankfully, it was with proper fwd momentum of bigger RB vs lighter DB, and not the reverse-momentum version. Definitely don't mind the proper fwd-momentum animation still being there, but a little disappointed it doesn't record the tackle when it happens.
    Fyi also, Player vs CPU Xbox, and I tuned tackling down slightly for CPU and on both sides, I'm seeing satisfactory momentum tackling, sometimes stuffed, sometimes bowling through a little or a lot when head-on, and some good angle momentum tackles. Very rare with the WWE blowup, not even once per game.
    EP
    The strength of strength is grace.

    I've seen it a couple times to, but I've also unfortunately seen too many WWE Superman reverse momentum hit.
    FWIW, I'm happier with the game now than I've ever been. 1.21 gives me a reduction in the over-the-top fall-forward stuff while still allowing me to truck players when ratings and size suggest I should be able to.
    The game is a joy to play right now and I only wish it'd been this good all year long. I know the circle of folks who game like I game and want what I want from the game also feel similarly.
    One of the more stunning revelations for me is that post-1.21, I'm getting very compelling games out of default AP (King's sliders), to the point that I'm having to focus on each play call and on each user input to ensure that I play as close to mistake-free as possible, because if I don't, I'm gonna lose. That never used to happen for me on AP and now it does.
    Trojan Man
    FWIW, I'm happier with the game now than I've ever been. 1.21 gives me a reduction in the over-the-top fall-forward stuff while still allowing me to truck players when ratings and size suggest I should be able to.
    The game is a joy to play right now and I only wish it'd been this good all year long. I know the circle of folks who game like I game and want what I want from the game also feel similarly.
    One of the more stunning revelations for me is that post-1.21, I'm getting very compelling games out of default AP (King's sliders), to the point that I'm having to focus on each play call and on each user input to ensure that I play as close to mistake-free as possible, because if I don't, I'm gonna lose. That never used to happen for me on AP and now it does.

    I hear ya. I got my butt kicked but good after this patch a couple of times. In the playoffs, I got down 17 points to the Falcons and came back to win. Beat the Saints on a 4th and goal from the 2 with TD toss to Zeke, with only 19 seconds left to play. I feel like the CPU playcall updates are making an impact. However, CPU clock management is still deplorable and I'm being kind when I say that.
    I'm seeing some realistic forward momentum that I didn't notice before. It may have been there, but I don't recall animations playing out like I am experiencing now. I'm also seeing a bit more "funny business" going on, like 4 defenders not being able to take Alvin Kamara down, etc..
    All in all, game is playing as well as it has for me all cycle long. Be interesting to see where they take game play from here in M20. Tackling and end zone man coverage are the two biggest areas in need of attention IMHO.
    edgevoice

    I'm seeing some realistic forward momentum that I didn't notice before. It may have been there, but I don't recall animations playing out like I am experiencing now. I'm also seeing a bit more "funny business" going on, like 4 defenders not being able to take Alvin Kamara down, etc..
    All in all, game is playing as well as it has for me all cycle long. Be interesting to see where they take game play from here in M20. Tackling and end zone man coverage are the two biggest areas in need of attention IMHO.

    I'm with you on seeing more funny business, I've noticed more than before these last 2 patches. Playing a user vs user game last night I was way outplaying my opponent especially on defense. My opponent ran one of the more predictable offenses I have seen, for most of the first half I held their offense to a negative yardage total. But offensively it just kept feeling like madden kept trying to take the game out of my hands by awarding his rushers instant sheds and forcing an irregular amount of over throws.
    Fast forward to the 4th quarter I was holding a 7 point lead and driving to try and make it 2 scores when all of a sudden my TE fumbles on a weak arm tackle and the ball doesn't even hit the ground just goes straight in to the arms of a defender. The very next play they call a dive which my defense bottles up but his RB breaks 2 solo tackles in a row the somehow breaks free of a group of 3 or 4 of my defenders all trying to bring him down and stays on his feet to take off for a touchdown to tie the game.
    Mind you his RB was no Alvin Kamara, it was some 2nd rate running back with an overall in the mid 70's.
    The following drive was almost killed by some inexcusable overthrows to open WRs but I was able to convert a 3rd and long with a dump off throw and nice run after the catch. I would go on to score to take the lead back, then add another td to win by 2 scores when I audibled to a quick pass because I caught my opponent in a run commit trying to force me to punt to get the ball back.
    Even with the win it didn't feel good because it felt like Madden was trying to give my opponent the game. I've noticed it in both solo offline franchise games and user vs user games but feel like it's even more obvious when playing against other users.

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