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PGA TOUR 2K21 Gameplay Video (IGN)

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PGA TOUR 2K21

PGA TOUR 2K21 Gameplay Video (IGN)

During IGN’s Summer of Gaming 2020 last night, HB Studios creative director Josh Muise and senior producer Shaun West, showed off some PGA TOUR 2K21 gameplay footage.

The video is almost 8 minutes long, highlighting four holes from TPC Scottsdale, including a look at the all-new pro-rivalry system.

In case you missed the video, we’ve posted it below. Let’s hear your thoughts!

Players can create and personalize their MyPLAYERs with equipment and apparel from licensed brands, including adidas, Polo, Ralph Lauren, Malbon Golf, Callaway Golf, Bridgestone Golf, TaylorMade Golf and more.

PGA TOUR 2K21 will include 15 licensed PGA TOUR courses, each of which were scanned using cutting-edge technology to bring the fairways, greens, bunkers, trees, lakes and ponds to life. Players can also trick out their own greens and fairways with thousands of custom options in the Course Designer.

PGA TOUR 2K21 is designed for players of all skill levels. Rookies can take advantage of real-time tutorials, tips and shot suggestions, while veterans can master their games with Pro Vision, Distance Control, Putt Preview and other innovations.

Social gaming is at the core of the experience, as players can hit the links with friends in local and online matches, including Alt-Shot, Stroke Play, Skins and 4-Player Scramble. In addition, Online Societies will encourage players to invite their squad to hit the clubhouse and run full seasons and tournaments with unique entry rules and requirements ,as well as handicap and event settings.

PGA TOUR 2K21 is scheduled to release on August 21 for the PlayStation 4, Xbox One, PC (via Steam), Nintendo Switch and Google Stadia.

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  1. 🏌️*♂️TONIGHT! Get a glimpse of exclusive, glorious #PGATOUR2K21 gameplay on #IGNSummerofGaming* stream at 8:10PM ET/ 5:10PM PT! 🏌️*♂️ Featuring a play by play walkthrough from @HB_Studios! #GolfLife #Golfstagram #GolfAddict #GolfTime
    jbd345
    That scorebug looks great. I was hoping with 2k presentation will get a major facelift But Ugh, that stance is brutal to look at.

    I tuned in, but I'm seeing Animal Crossing, not PGA TOUR 2K21, it's 8:25 PM EDT here and it should be on.
    OnlookerDelay
    I tuned in, but I'm seeing Animal Crossing, not PGA TOUR 2K21, it's 8:25 PM EDT here and it should be on.

    Okay, learning it did get pushed back by Animal Crossing... about to start here in a few.
    Not sure what to make of that. Way too easy to hit the ball in that video. Hoping there are different layers of difficulty that can be applied.
    Disappointed they messed with putting. Looks like they now have a meter for putting.
    But the presentation looked nice I thought. Looks like the PGA pros will be your "rivals".
    Still holding out hope for a solid golf title but first impression makes me feel game difficulty has been brought way down.
    Definitely some changes. A swing meter for the beginners and casuals, a long asked overswing from the community for advanced players, and it looks like there was no loft box when he shot that draw on the par 5.
    TheBrew101
    Not sure what to make of that. Way too easy to hit the ball in that video. Hoping there are different layers of difficulty that can be applied.
    Disappointed they messed with putting. Looks like they now have a meter for putting.
    But the presentation looked nice I thought. Looks like the PGA pros will be your "rivals".
    Still holding out hope for a solid golf title but first impression makes me feel game difficulty has been brought way down.

    How many times did they play that hole to get a Hole in One?
    Random Impressions:
    - Follow-cam.....ugh (puke)
    - Ball trail needs to be toggle-able or dialed-back a bit
    - Same crappy swing animation - no flow or rhythm at all. Like the anti-Fred Couples. Disappointing but not unexpected. On the plus side, with a slight tweak, it sort of looks like Bryson DeChambeau's swing (in that it is quick/choppy, not fluid at all, and slightly ugly from an aesthetic perspective)
    - Notice that they showed Kuchar's swing from an odd angle, because if they showed it from a recognizable angle, every golf fan would immediately realize how stupid/unrealistic it looked to have Kuchar with a completely foreign random generic golf swing
    - Loud cheers on the first hole played from the gallery, without anyone in the gallery actually clapping their hands...
    - Audience members look like low-poly crap-tastic PS2-era characters
    - Some of the bounces looked a little extreme
    - He should not have been able to hit 3-wood out of that rough like that....
    On the plus side, the course itself looked okay - still not as good as the courses on Rory McIlroy looked but pretty decent. I didn't love what I saw but I didn't hate it; I am still willing to be convinced. Depending on the hands-on impressions of the guys here, I can see myself giving this one a shot. Maybe.
    Some of the physics in the gameplay still needs to be improved upon, but that can be patched. All HUD elements can also be disabled per Shaun West on Twitter.
    I personally think this is a massive improvement over 2019. Will definitely be pre-ordering.
    TheBrew101
    Not sure what to make of that. Way too easy to hit the ball in that video. Hoping there are different layers of difficulty that can be applied.

    If you looked at the HUD. The driver carry was one yard less than what we now have with Pro clubs. Also, the shot shaping arc and visible power meter across the bottom are pretty good indicators that the game was being played at a gutted level of difficulty.
    Disappointed they messed with putting. Looks like they now have a meter for putting.

    They've got a meter for every shot, not just putting in this video. Maybe this is all part of what they're calling "Pro Vision", which is targeted at beginners as they state on the game's catalog page.
    But the presentation looked nice I thought. Looks like the PGA pros will be your "rivals".

    I thought the 4K video of it that's now been published on You Tube looked very good. I'm not sure the TV Broadcast presentation options will make sense if I'm thinking that it's me playing the round. I'd rather be honed in more on my golfer's perspective. If you're going to show my opponent from those views, it makes a little more sense, but I'd still feel more tuned-in to the moment to watch them from my golfer's perspective, with a camera cut once the ball is about 75% to its destination.
    This bit about the cut ahead to Kuchar finishing the hole three holes ahead makes me now think you won't be able to play a tournament round in the same pairing with a featured pro. The TV Broadcast style of it was good, but I can't say how injecting something like that in the middle of my round would hurt or help the atmosphere.
    Still holding out hope for a solid golf title but first impression makes me feel game difficulty has been brought way down.

    I'm pretty sure you can relax on the difficulty. What you saw was a shot aid fest. I've read where Shaun West said the game will provide advanced players an unprecedented challenge. He also said on the other end that more aids have been brought in for the beginning player to make it even easier than it is now with Beginner clubs.
    I really hope we can get a decent commentary team in one day. I appreciate them trying with the single guy doing friendly banter, but I muted him from day 1, just cannot stand it. It is sorely needed.
    TheBleedingRed21
    I really hope we can get a decent commentary team in one day. I appreciate them trying with the single guy doing friendly banter, but I muted him from day 1, just cannot stand it. It is sorely needed.

    They're going to have Luke Elvy and Rich Beem doing the commentary in Career mode. I think they're good. I'm one of the rare breed who likes John McCarthy's comments as an observer... can't call him a commentator, in Society and multiplayer mode. He said he's upped his library for this one, for what it's worth, but if you turned him off from day 1, that probably won't make any difference to you.
    Was really digging the camera cuts and presentation, especially the one a little zoomed out showing the green as the created player was taking a few practice putting strokes. Little stuff like that will really help the immersion.
    Liked what I saw, little paint job and a decent looking career mode is enough for me. I can definitely see how it wouldn’t be for a lot of folks.
    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Steve_OS

    Thanks Steve - i missed it since they were late... my impressions:
    -the game seems “cleaned up” aesthetically, everything seems less choppy
    -presentation has taken a huge step forward, the cut away to Kuch at 18 was great
    -crowd noise has improved dramatically, hopefully they can sync up the crowd with the cheering
    -Draw/Fade meter improved
    -new score bug is a huge improvement
    Overall impressed - not blown away, but I’m happy they are putting the PGA license to use with real players and more courses.
    Finally got around to watching this...presentation is much improved. The course (TPC Scottsdale) looked pretty great as well. Would have been nice to hear actual commentary instead of the awkward banter between the HB Studios guys.
    As many others mentioned, this must be on the lowest difficulty level. Tough to get a really good read on any gameplay changes when looking at this.
    I am interested exactly as to what the pros' role will be in Career Mode. They mention a rivalry system...does one of the 12 pros become your rival? Do we get a rivalry with all 12 at some point, as we progress? It definitely doesn't look like it will be the style of old Tiger Challenges as I initially thought it would be. Showing Kuchar a few holes ahead was kinda cool, but I am not sure of the context around it.
    Still a lot of unanswered questions...
    MrArlingtonBeach
    Finally got around to watching this...presentation is much improved. The course (TPC Scottsdale) looked pretty great as well. Would have been nice to hear actual commentary instead of the awkward banter between the HB Studios guys.

    I thought Scottsdale looked markedly better than it does in TGC 2019. Yeah, that banter was very awkward between Josh Muise and Shaun West... especially when Josh didn't know what to call a downswing:
    Josh: What you're going to see there is we've got a shot feedback meter, and it's going to show you the result of the backswing and the... uh "forward" swing, is that the word we're going with here Shaun?
    Shaun: Yeah, that'll do.
    Josh: Huh huh.
    As many others mentioned, this must be on the lowest difficulty level. Tough to get a really good read on any gameplay changes when looking at this.

    Shaun West is saying they had the game playing about as easy as it can play in that walkthrough. He's also saying today in a closing comment to a post in the official forum where someone raised the concern about ease of play: "The game isn't easy if you don't want it to be. IMO no one is breaking par day 1 on the hardest difficulty."
    I am interested exactly as to what the pros' role will be in Career Mode. They mention a rivalry system...does one of the 12 pros become your rival? Do we get a rivalry with all 12 at some point, as we progress? It definitely doesn't look like it will be the style of old Tiger Challenges as I initially thought it would be. Showing Kuchar a few holes ahead was kinda cool, but I am not sure of the context around it.
    Still a lot of unanswered questions...

    I'm not sure what to make out of what I saw with that cut away to Kuchar. I'm getting the impression from it that you won't actually be playing along with a featured pro (if you opted to do so) in a medal play Career tournament. IMO, the option for that needs to be in there to give it the proper atmosphere.
    With regard to the difficulty I guess I’m just mostly interested to see how they are going to get there.
    Will the ways they increase the difficulty mirror those in real golf or will it be weird conventions they have come up with to make it artificially more difficult in ways that do not resemble the actual game.
    I would argue the latter is mostly what they did in previous versions and that’s why the methodology and thought behind some of it was poorly received by real golfers.
    Initial reactions to the live stream were not great but after watching the higher resolution upload from 2K the game actually looks almost good.
    Scottsdale isn’t the most visually appealing track on tour for me anyway.
    If the new grass textures carry into user created courses I’m sure we’ll see some great results from conversions of old courses & new designs alike.
    It’s a shame gameplay doesn’t look to have evolved in any way shape or form from the 2019 game. The harder you look for differences the more familiar the game looks.
    The developers have probably put a lot of work in with their small team but the silence on the official forum is telling.
    Finally triple a presentation. Now just need to see if we can turn the follow camera off. Everything looks much better than I thought. I Kind of liked the “live look in” at Kuchers shot. Hopefully they do that more than one or two times a round. Everything seemed at 60fps and crisp. I’m back to cautiously optimistic about this game.
    itsmb8
    Some of the physics in the gameplay still needs to be improved upon, but that can be patched. All HUD elements can also be disabled per Shaun West on Twitter.
    I personally think this is a massive improvement over 2019. Will definitely be pre-ordering.

    Patch? :laugh: Don't look too bad. They got a guy working on this game who doesn't know what a downswing is? LOL.
    lowpaiddonkey10
    Patch? :laugh: Don't look too bad. They got a guy working on this game who doesn't know what a downswing is? LOL.

    I was just gonna say…
    Let’s aim higher than a post release patch to fix things like physics.
    That is either dialed in upfront or it’s not gonna get touched on adequately.
    It’d be like a flight simulator releasing with aerodynamics out of whack and then hoping they “patch it later” — non starter.
    scagwi

    It’d be like a flight simulator releasing with aerodynamics out of whack and then hoping they “patch it later” — non starter.

    Also known in aviation circles as the "Boeing Approach".
    scagwi
    @pietasterp will be here all week.... :woot::spit:

    OnlookerDelay
    You're killing me here man! LOL!!

    Thanks, that's my time! You guys have been great! Tip your waiters, they're working hard for you.
    Easily the most informative video I've seen yet of 2K21 is You Tuber Respawn's side by side comparison of TGC 2019 and 2K21. It opened my eyes to a lot of details I missed in watching the gameplay walkthough, even though Respawn's video is in 1080p, whereas the gameplay walkthrough is in 4K. He has done an amazing job of getting the same shots in Scottsdale 2019 that the golfer "Mac" got in the four hole walkthough at Scottsdale 2K21. They need to hire this guy to do their feature videos; he does a more professional and incisive job of narrating them than anything I've seen from HB Studios!
    Here's the link:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHoJTBESGBI
    Definitely noticeable that they brightened up the color palette, which is great. I hate when golf games use greens that are too dark and it gives the whole thing a muddy/cloudy look.
    pietasterp
    Definitely noticeable that they brightened up the color palette, which is great. I hate when golf games use greens that are too dark and it gives the whole thing a muddy/cloudy look.

    Yes, the brighter colors do change the look of the course to something more lifelike, IMO, in the case of Scottsdale. This should do wonders for the tropical theme in 2K21. I've always thought the grass textures in the previous TGCs tropical courses looked foreign. I'm eager to see what they're going to look like with this new scheme.
    Is anyone else slightly miffed by the inconsistent rollout of info with 2K21? I mean, two weeks ago, we started getting the roster of real-life golfers announced each day, followed by this IGN gameplay video just over a week ago. Since then...radio silence.
    We are now under two months until launch, and still no pretty much zilch about certain gameplay elements, new additions to the course designer, what the full roster of licensed courses is in the game, all the real apparel and equipment options available and how they work, etc. And you still can't even digitally pre-order the game thru the PS Store.
    I wish they would have done a similar schedule like San Diego Studios does with MLB The Show, where they offer the dates in which they are going to release info on the various aspects of the game. Instead, we're just left to wait and wonder.
    MrArlingtonBeach
    Is anyone else slightly miffed by the inconsistent rollout of info with 2K21? I mean, two weeks ago, we were getting the roster of real-life golfers announced each day, followed by this IGN gameplay video just over a week ago. Since then...radio silence.
    We are now under two months until launch, and still no pretty much zilch about certain gameplay elements, new additions to the course designer, what the full roster of licensed courses is in the game, all the real apparel and equipment options available and how they work, etc. And you still can't even digitally pre-order the game thru the PS Store.
    I wish they would have done a similar schedule like San Diego Studios does with MLB The Show, where they offer the dates in which they are going to release info on the various aspects of the game. Instead, we're just left to wait and wonder.

    I'd say I'm predictably perplexed by the lack of coordination and consistency in this rollout. I don't know whether to point the finger more at 2K or HB Studios. Last week they went back to back days with the Career mode trailer and the 4 hole gameplay walktrough, both of which triggered a lot of discussion early on. However, HB Studios/2K responses to the questions those raised was very spotty and in some cases evasive.
    I don't know why they don't space the videos, articles, and tweets out more evenly to keep the pot stirred, as the discussion has now died down to barely a murmur in even in the 1.2 thousand member Reddit forum. They may be walking on eggshells here because they're at a point where they're going to have to reveal some information, or answer some questions that aren't going to please a lot of their potential market. They could at least start a measured rollout of the remaining four or five remaining official PGA TOUR courses.
    The putting simulation alone is a big step. Seems to now mirror Jack Nicklaus PG. As long as the sensitivity especially on the short game is not too crazy, I might end up getting this.
    daflyboys
    The putting simulation alone is a big step. Seems to now mirror Jack Nicklaus PG. As long as the sensitivity especially on the short game is not too crazy, I might end up getting this.

    I'm curious to see how that's going to feel... not just the putting, but all swing types. They do need to work on the sensitivity in the short game. The tempo is just way too heavy a factor in the chip shot result in 2019. What I'm most hoping for is that I'll be able to actually feel a 90% approach shot without having to watch a power meter. I can see using the power meter in practice to get an idea of what stick motion and golfer animation coincides with what the power bar is indicating. The swing interface is where a golf game really has a chance to distinguish itself by conveying nuances that are relatable to real life in both execution and results. There's considerable room for improvement in this area over that power fade from a perfect/slow swing tempo crap in TGC 2019.
    That video has so many curious elements..
    "If you're not familiar with what a draw is".. (paraphrasing - it was close to that)
    With comments like that, it's hard to believe they are implementing anything at all for actual simulation oriented golf fans. Will there be an introduction to what "golf clubs" are too?
    They also need to work a lot on the zombies and reactions..
    The YouTube comments are right to skewer them on that point. The environment and excitement isn't quite "there" and the zombies aren't reacting to things with the proper level of interest.
    OnlookerDelay
    I'm curious to see how that's going to feel... not just the putting, but all swing types. They do need to work on the sensitivity in the short game. The tempo is just way too heavy a factor in the chip shot result in 2019. What I'm most hoping for is that I'll be able to actually feel a 90% approach shot without having to watch a power meter. I can see using the power meter in practice to get an idea of what stick motion and golfer animation coincides with what the power bar is indicating. The swing interface is where a golf game really has a chance to distinguish itself by conveying nuances that are relatable to real life in both execution and results. There's considerable room for improvement in this area over that power fade from a perfect/slow swing tempo crap in TGC 2019.

    Agree, the swing interface is everything in a golf game. That's literally the only "action" in the game, so it's gotta be 100% dead-on. It's even more magnified by the fact that the majority of people that play golf games also play golf in real life, so they actually know what it feels like to swing a club and have the ball react, and if anything is off, it's immediately obvious. Contrasting that with, for example, a hockey game, where I have no idea if the slapshot vs wrist-shot puck reaction is realistic (in terms of feel), since the closest I've come to an ice hockey game is that time I had rinkside seats at a minor league hockey game on 2-for-1 beer night.
    scagwi
    That video has so many curious elements..
    "If you're not familiar with what a draw is".. (paraphrasing - it was close to that)
    With comments like that, it's hard to believe they are implementing anything at all for actual simulation oriented golf fans. Will there be an introduction to what "golf clubs" are too?
    They also need to work a lot on the zombies and reactions..
    The YouTube comments are right to skewer them on that point. The environment and excitement isn't quite "there" and the zombies aren't reacting to things with the proper level of interest.

    I noticed this as well. It's a bit alarming, since the developers don't really seem very knowledgeable about golf (or at least it sort of comes across that way in their videos). It's possible that they're being directed to make sure they speak in a way that is understandable to all audiences, since presumably they want casual fans as well. But honestly, it's a bit condescending (and more importantly, worrisome). It'd be like if you were watching a Madden preview video, and the developer mentioned how it was more realistic when you bring more "pressure" with a "blitz (if you know what that is...)"....I mean, I think people would be rightfully concerned about who the game was being developed for if that was the communication you were getting.
    On that note, peripheral thought: why not lean-in (I hate that term, don't know why I just used it....) to the hardcore golfer a bit, and get a licensing deal with Trackman or something - just for the name - and have the option to go to the range and hit different club setups (different shafts, clubheads, grips, etc) on a Trackman and when you practice, it gives you launch angle, clubhead speed, ball speed, smash factor, spin rate, etc. Or heck, do this for on-course shots as well. It would be a nice complement to the swing mechanic, and allow you to at least workshop or figure out why you are hitting the ball well or not, and which club setups you like, etc. I dunno, I think this would be awesome. Similar to how racing sims allow you to set up your car in a certain way, and you can get as crazy as you want (adjust camber angle, suspension, etc) or not adjust any of it and still have fun going racing.
    Come to think of it, I have so many ideas, I don't know why I don't just quit my job, raise a bunch of money, and go make a golf game myself. Oh wait, I do know why I don't do that....
    pietasterp
    On that note, peripheral thought: why not lean-in (I hate that term, don't know why I just used it....) to the hardcore golfer a bit, and get a licensing deal with Trackman or something - just for the name - and have the option to go to the range and hit different club setups (different shafts, clubheads, grips, etc) on a Trackman and when you practice, it gives you launch angle, clubhead speed, ball speed, smash factor, spin rate, etc. Or heck, do this for on-course shots as well. It would be a nice complement to the swing mechanic, and allow you to at least workshop or figure out why you are hitting the ball well or not, and which club setups you like, etc. I dunno, I think this would be awesome. Similar to how racing sims allow you to set up your car in a certain way, and you can get as crazy as you want (adjust camber angle, suspension, etc) or not adjust any of it and still have fun going racing.

    This sounds a lot like, if I'm remembering correctly, the club tuner in the Tiger Woods games made in the early 2010s. You could adjust various aspects of each club in your bag to suit your play and maximize their effectiveness. While, at the same time, you might reduce the sweet spot on the club and, therefore, misses would result in bigger penalties. It was a lot of fun to mess around with and gave a bit of added depth to the game. But it was totally skippable if you didn't want to dig that deep.
    scagwi
    That video has so many curious elements..
    "If you're not familiar with what a draw is".. (paraphrasing - it was close to that)
    With comments like that, it's hard to believe they are implementing anything at all for actual simulation oriented golf fans. Will there be an introduction to what "golf clubs" are too?

    This is the second time they've brought Josh Muise, who is titled "Creative Director" at HB Studios to discuss and comment on a Golf Club video. It was as much of a train wreck then as it was in this one. He's an art guy who buy his resume has no interest in the sport of golf. Why you'd want to bring someone into the film studio, who doesn't know that a "downswing" is what follows a "backswing", or feeling the need to explain a "draw" to the mostly golf oriented audience for a promotional video showing off your new golf game, as a commentator is truly befuddling to me!?
    Josh could probably very well be doing a good job as a Creative Director for HB Studios, but he clearly doesn't know golf and he's not helping your cause any in a case where someone who understands golf is needed.
    MrArlingtonBeach
    This sounds a lot like, if I'm remembering correctly, the club tuner in the Tiger Woods games made in the early 2010s. You could adjust various aspects of each club in your bag to suit your play and maximize their effectiveness. While, at the same time, you might reduce the sweet spot on the club and, therefore, misses would result in bigger penalties. It was a lot of fun to mess around with and gave a bit of added depth to the game. But it was totally skippable if you didn't want to dig that deep.

    I know for a fact that Tiger Woods 10 has that "club tuner" feature and if it didn't, I would have bailed on it after a couple of months. I could fine tune the difficulty to give me the kind of challenge, with believable stats for FIRs and GIRs by using it. The problem was, for multiplayer and tournament play, it could be neutered with dead axis modified controllers to where the accuracy of a max-distance tune was not a factor. The fact remains though, the club tuner worked great for private or career mode play.
    pietasterp
    On that note, peripheral thought: why not lean-in (I hate that term, don't know why I just used it....) to the hardcore golfer a bit, and get a licensing deal with Trackman or something

    I like the idea, but not sure Trackman in particular would have any interest.
    They bought Perfect Golf and that's fully integrated now and under ongoing development with new features, fixes, course releases, etc.
    TM seems totally set for the long term in this regard as they have a full hardware/software integrated package to offer. I'm pretty sure their core demographic doesn't need or want to play alongside a generic swing with Matt Kuchar's head attached to it either.
    (TM has a ton of real pro's using their setups...they get to play alongside real pros in real life as it is)
    scagwi
    I like the idea, but not sure Trackman in particular would have any interest.
    They bought Perfect Golf and that's fully integrated now and under ongoing development with new features, fixes, course releases, etc.
    TM seems totally set for the long term in this regard as they have a full hardware/software integrated package to offer. I'm pretty sure their core demographic doesn't need or want to play alongside a generic swing with Matt Kuchar's head attached to it either.
    (TM has a ton of real pro's using their setups...they get to play alongside real pros in real life as it is)

    I didn't know that - that's pretty cool, actually. Obviously others have thought about this long before me...
    Although, on second thought, they don't even need Trackman as a license. It's not like Trackman owns the concept of spin rate, smash factor, ball speed, etc. But just having a swing interface that was robust enough to be able to vary those factors with equipment/swing would be awesome. I'd probably hit as many balls on the virtual range as I do in real life (!).
    Now, if 2K really wanted to do some smart marketing, they would have had her interview Justin Thomas instead of The Miz, or have her narrate/mentor you as a part of your career mode...
    MrArlingtonBeach
    Looks like the bear may be awaking from its hibernation...apparel/gear info seems to be coming:
    https://twitter.com/PGATOUR2K/status/1276546522021126145

    I can summarize that video in one word..... BLECH!
    I said in their Twitter feed in response to that video, if I was on the fence about buying 2K21, that video would steer me away from it. A six second video that loops and flashes 8 (correction, it was 9) times!? I don't care what you're showing in that span, it's going to be fuster-cluck! And in this case it's mostly outlandish bling!?
    MrArlingtonBeach
    I was hoping that a more in-depth article/video would follow that teaser pretty quickly...we shall see.

    Seriously! A good marketing director would have had another more substantive video in queue as damage control for what they should have well suspected wouldn't be well received.
    What I'd really like to see is a couple of the dev team members (sans Josh "forward swing" Muise), play each other via private or public matchmaking... LIVE, not any of that mostly scripted, canned video of the 4 hole walkthrough. Oh, and I'd want them to be playing on the hardest settings allowable in public matchmaking when they do so.
    I'm pretty skeptical about any official videos coming that will show the game "as hard as it can be"..
    As much as many would enjoy seeing that, I'll bet they are worried about scaring people off.
    Nuance and understanding are totally lost on people these days and too many would see it and get freaked out that the game is "impossibly hard" and "looks like no fun" and simply not care to even listen to HB/2K telling them to their face that it's only optionally that hard.
    Maybe I'll be wrong, but I've got a feeling even if they do make a "hard as it can be" video that it might be kept pretty close to the vest. They should maybe even consider outsourcing that type of thing to a community and/or YouTube person who could show that side of things "unofficially".
    I would like to see a match between Early 1981 and Jim Gem on impossible difficulty.
    I don't think these guys know WTF they are doing. Total waste of money for them to go this PGA course if the body types are the same. Can't play with pros can't go head to head real time with them? Forget about swing similarity.
    I pray EA gets involved in this space cause this franchise is going nowhere.
    scagwi
    I'm pretty skeptical about any official videos coming that will show the game "as hard as it can be"..

    I remember them showing a live match between Shaun West and TheApexHound (a well known You Tuber) for TGC 2019, playing a match. It wasn't at the hardest settings, but it was tough enough for each of them to miss some fairways and greens. I'd like to see something like that, but IIRC, the streaming match I'm referring to wasn't shown until maybe two weeks before release.
    As much as many would enjoy seeing that, I'll bet they are worried about scaring people off.

    They're already showing me that they're more fearful of that with this release. I think the thing they're most scared of scaring people off with is the knowledge that not only are you not going to be able to play as a featured pro, you're not going to actually play in a head-to-head, turn order enabled match against them or a tournament round in a pairing with them. They are dodging this question right and left because they know the reaction is going to be volatile.
    Nuance and understanding are totally lost on people these days and too many would see it and get freaked out that the game is "impossibly hard" and "looks like no fun" and simply not care to even listen to HB/2K telling them to their face that it's only optionally that hard.

    This is so true, but I'll take it one step further... on the other extreme you have simulation oriented gamers complaining about how easy this game is going to be, based on that neutered 4 hole walkthrough. They can't seem to realize for themselves that they're seeing a showcase of shot aids and forgiving clubs at work!? I can't say that the game is going to play as difficult as the hardcore simulation style golf gamers wants, but I know it's going to be a damn sight harder than what we saw in the walkthrough!
    Maybe I'll be wrong, but I've got a feeling even if they do make a "hard as it can be" video that it might be kept pretty close to the vest. They should maybe even consider outsourcing that type of thing to a community and/or YouTube person who could show that side of things "unofficially".

    Good idea, they should set up Respawn and Early-1981 and let them stream/record a head to head match, using whatever will be the most difficult settings you can use for online, public matchmaking. It would demonstrate how multiplayer matches are setup, how they launch, and those two would talk about all the options and aids, and how they are hidden or locked-out, as they play the game. Joe Sixpack wouldn't be all that interested in it, but the 10 to 15% of their market who are hardcore golf-gamers like ourselves would eat this up.
    lowpaiddonkey10
    I would like to see a match between Early 1981 and Jim Gem on impossible difficulty.

    You were on the same track as me when I responded to Scagwi! I said Respawn and Early-1981, but Jim Gem would also do. If we had Respawn and Early, we'd at least get to see how a transatlantic multiplayer connection would work. :)
    I don't think these guys know WTF they are doing. Total waste of money for them to go this PGA course if the body types are the same. Can't play with pros can't go head to head real time with them? Forget about swing similarity.

    Shaun West is a low handicap golfer (6 to 8 I'm thinking?), but he at least knows golf. I'm sure they've got other guys on this team who understand and play golf, but I know Creative Director, Josh Muise, isn't one of them. I don't know who is responsible for the choice to not offer head-to-head play against the pros, but it probably was a pay grade above the Senior Producer (Shaun West).
    I think they didn't want to invest the resources and time it would take to hash out the AI needed for the other players. Having a spreadsheet calculate what score a player should post on a hole based on a formula is one thing, but having an AI model convincingly play out a shot based on attributes, lie, wind, course conditions in real time for an entire round is a tough proposition than it sounds.
    I pray EA gets involved in this space cause this franchise is going nowhere.

    I'd love to see it also; competition brings out the best in everyone.
    bigkev
    Of course they're scared to show that the game is too hard, they remember quite well all the negative reviews when they gave the game for free for 1 month. And lots of those guys thought the game was broken or simply hated it because it was too inconsistent.
    https://www.microsoft.com/en-ca/p/the-golf-club-2019-featuring-pga-tour/c08xr9bb6th5?activetab=pivot:reviewstab

    I think the problem they had there is that the way the factor in the tempo component in the swing. It's a counter-intuitive model to think that the only component of the swing that affects hook or slice is your backswing to downswing ratio, and/or transition. Most people think - and rightly so - that swing path, as in outside in or inside out is what causes hook or slice... not in this game, swing path only affects push or pull.
    You have to read and understand the explanation of how this counter-intuitive model works, and most people aren't going to take the time to do it. Even when you do understand it, it's hard to make your rational thinking brain to set aside our understanding of terrestrial physics, and put this alternative model into practice.
    People picking up the game for free are the least likely to go to the trouble to learn and understand that alternative swing mechanic. That said though... I did pick up a half dozen new friends whom I'd met by playing public matchmaking during that period. I coached all of them through the process TGC 2019's tempo mechanic uses and they finally got it. They were all operating under the assumption that swing path affected hook/slice until I told them otherwise.

    Based on the insertion of the words "Sounds" and "listen" in the teaser, I'd say we're going to get a feature on the audio. Maybe they'll have a montage of commentary from Beem and Elvy, and hopefully, some sounds of the club making impact with the ball using something other than a studio condenser microphone!
    I'll bet one of the unintended results of this feature will be more video evidence that the featured pros are going to appear in video highlight, cut-scenes only.
    OnlookerDelay
    I can summarize that video in one word..... BLECH!
    I said in their Twitter feed in response to that video, if I was on the fence about buying 2K21, that video would steer me away from it. A six second video that loops and flashes 8 (correction, it was 9) times!? I don't care what you're showing in that span, it's going to be fuster-cluck! And in this case it's mostly outlandish bling!?

    That video wasn't for old farts like us... they're trying to hook the millennial and younger. Same they did with the Miz, I'm half expecting to see a basketball court from NBA2K between 9s soon. :y1:
    MrArlingtonBeach
    As predicted...it's a commentary video for today:
    https://twitter.com/PGATOUR2K/status/1277603060651454467

    Yeah, and it's almost exactly as I expected! I'm glad I had already conditioned my expectations down to prepare for it. I like Rich Beem and Luke Elvy and they're the type of personalities that are suited for something like this. I think their input will be rich in quality, but probably lacking in quantity. I have a feeling it's going to get repetitive in fairly short order.
    I was hoping we'd get a peek at one or more of the featured pros in this clip so we could see if: 1.) they've done any work to their body structure to match that of the player they represent, and 2.) they make specific remarks about the pros and the shot they're playing.
    A few thoughts:
    - I really dislike the follow cam. It's dated and just needs to go away forever.
    - Adding the swing "meter" at the bottom at least tries to address the difficulty trying to dial in swing power.
    - Hopefully there's a 2/3 click option but I won't hold my breath.
    - Perfectly straight ball flight on default shots remains weird. This is an issue in many golf games but pros generally intentionally bend the ball one way or the other on most shots.
    ComfortablyLomb
    A few thoughts:
    - I really dislike the follow cam. It's dated and just needs to go away forever.

    It won't, too many people still love it. I'm sure they'll at least have the left and right d-pad camera cut options we have now in 2K21. As long as I can stay with the golf view for 75% of the shot, then cut to a reverse angle-ish view to see the finish, I'll be content.
    - Adding the swing "meter" at the bottom at least tries to address the difficulty trying to dial in swing power.

    I hope that I can use it as a training aid to help me learn what a 95% shot feels like, so that when I turn it meter off, I'll have something experiential to go on.
    - Hopefully there's a 2/3 click option but I won't hold my breath.

    I don't have a dawg in the 3-click fight, but as many people as I hear voicing their desire for it, I hope they offer it as well. I doubt seriously they're going to do it because it would dilute their player base into more compartmented play types, as analogs feel clickers have an advantage, and vice versa.
    - Perfectly straight ball flight on default shots remains weird. This is an issue in many golf games but pros generally intentionally bend the ball one way or the other on most shots.

    I see this also, but remember, you're watching scripted action by someone playing with forgiving clubs and probably Pro Vision enabled.
    capnlarge
    I wonder if the Switch version will have motion controls. That could be fun for a weekend

    Great question capnlarge! I wish I had thought to pose that one to HB Studios when Reddit was compiling their questions for them. What the heck, I'll ask them in their official forum... the worst they can do is not answer, which they're very good at! ;)
    EDIT: Question now asked in official forum.
    pietasterp
    Is it too much to ask that the game basically look like this? I don't think it is - there's only 1 moving character and no person-person interaction....

    I think we should be able to get relatively close to that on the Series X and the PS5. I think they could even have the other player standing there with their caddie in view, along with yours, as was the case at one point in that video. They were relatively motionless... it just would add some tension to the game to have them all looking at you while you hit. It ain't gonna happen with Unity, that much I can tell you!
    I have no idea how any of this works but if they shelve Unity in favor of a new game engine I would imagine all user created courses are gone. The main selling point of a game like this is the variety of courses. They have a big decision to make once we get into next gen. I highly doubt HB has the resources to go that alone and it this game bombs I doubt 2k stays on board.
    lowpaiddonkey10
    I have no idea how any of this works but if they shelve Unity in favor of a new game engine I would imagine all user created courses are gone. The main selling point of a game like this is the variety of courses. They have a big decision to make once we get into next gen. I highly doubt HB has the resources to go that alone and it this game bombs I doubt 2k stays on board.

    It would likely be similar to what happen when EA took their golf game to the Frostbite engine for "Rory". There was a reason the game shipped with less than 10 courses - all of the courses in-game had to be rebuilt in the new engine. I can't imagine courses made in the Unity engine used in TGC/PGA 2K21 would be compatible with whatever new engine would be implemented, as you mentioned.
    It's also interesting that course creation is such a selling point of TGC/2K21...and they haven't even touched on any info about updates/improvements to the course creator in their upcoming game. Just another thing we get to sit around and wait for.
    lowpaiddonkey10
    I have no idea how any of this works but if they shelve Unity in favor of a new game engine I would imagine all user created courses are gone. The main selling point of a game like this is the variety of courses. They have a big decision to make once we get into next gen. I highly doubt HB has the resources to go that alone and it this game bombs I doubt 2k stays on board.

    That's what I think too. I'm not even sure they were able to sell as many TGC2019 as TGC1, probably just over 100K or so. Both HB and 2K won't spend a lot of $$$ and time for something that is not selling, while a cartoon arcade golf game is selling 500K copies.
    MrArlingtonBeach
    It's also interesting that course creation is such a selling point of TGC/2K21...and they haven't even touched on any info about updates/improvements to the course creator in their upcoming game. Just another thing we get to sit around and wait for.

    They're taking just about every old customers for granted, there was pages of thread after thread requesting news for a new golf game and it was only 18 months since the last patch. And we have a guy around here who wants a game every 5 years, I can just imagine the community over there if he got his wish. :lol:
    I don't understand 2k purchased the rights to Links way back and did nothing with it. Links had a solid player base and people made some very nice courses. Some of the top designers use topo maps and went to the courses and took pics and what not. If Links was modernized i think it would blow 2k1 out of the water
    Jitter1127
    I don't understand 2k purchased the rights to Links way back and did nothing with it. Links had a solid player base and people made some very nice courses. Some of the top designers use topo maps and went to the courses and took pics and what not. If Links was modernized i think it would blow 2k1 out of the water

    I don't think 2K is doing much with this game. They're there as the publisher doing the media thing to promote the game and not much else. HB is doing the game and 2K is taking a cut as a publisher. We're probably going to see a game very similar of TGC2019, the reason why we're not getting too much details about game play and course designers. And why we're not going to see much of the pros in the game if I remember the few times I try the career mode in TGC2019. The shot of Kuchar in that promo could well what we're going to see in career mode 3 or so times a game as an opponent.
    Jitter1127
    I don't understand 2k purchased the rights to Links way back and did nothing with it. Links had a solid player base and people made some very nice courses. Some of the top designers use topo maps and went to the courses and took pics and what not. If Links was modernized i think it would blow 2k1 out of the water

    Many people who worked on making the Links franchise of golf games apparently went and started a golf simulator company called TruGolf Inc.
    /The More You Know
    Jitter1127
    I don't understand 2k purchased the rights to Links way back and did nothing with it. Links had a solid player base and people made some very nice courses. Some of the top designers use topo maps and went to the courses and took pics and what not. If Links was modernized i think it would blow 2k1 out of the water

    You want to read something about this that will make you really sad? Read this interchange I had with Andrew Jones, Executive Producer of Perfect Golf:
    Me: Take-Two Interactive did acquire the rights to Links. They were in the process of creating what would have been called "Links 2007" for the XBox 360, when the project was canceled. I was in an e-mail exchange with Daryl Welsh, who was the producer of Links 2004, in 2006. He was working for Microsoft Corporate at that time, but was still staying in contact with the 2K Sport team that was developing the game.
    2K Sports was only a couple of months away from publishing Links 2007 for the 360, when Take-Two Interactive (2K Sports parent company) decided to close up shop with Indie Games (Links 2004 and 2007 developers). From what I understand, Links 2007 was said to be a landmark golf game, which would have been to the 360 what Links 2004 was to the XBox. It pains me to know that an 80% complete version of Links 2007 is languishing on somebody's hard drive right now, but it wouldn't more than a museum piece today in comparison to Perfect Golf.

    Andrew Jones: I actually had advanced conversations with Take 2 following the closure of Indie and they had agreed to give me the source code to Links 2007 on the condition that we released what we did as a community add on similar to what we had done with the MOD. The problem was when they closed the studios they just dumped all the stuff into boxes and warehoused it and they were not willing to spend the money to go through everything just to find me the source code...
    Does that not break your heart!? I know it rips me up even when I see it today, and this from over four years ago that we had the conversation. Heck, I'd have paid the money to go through everything and find that code! As good as Links 2004 looked and played on the original XBox, I can't imagine what they had accomplished with it but I bet it would have been a sight to behold!
    OnlookerDelay
    You want to read something about this that will make you really sad? Read this interchange I had with Andrew Jones, Executive Producer of Perfect Golf:
    Me: Take-Two Interactive did acquire the rights to Links. They were in the process of creating what would have been called "Links 2007" for the XBox 360, when the project was canceled. I was in an e-mail exchange with Daryl Welsh, who was the producer of Links 2004, in 2006. He was working for Microsoft Corporate at that time, but was still staying in contact with the 2K Sport team that was developing the game.
    2K Sports was only a couple of months away from publishing Links 2007 for the 360, when Take-Two Interactive (2K Sports parent company) decided to close up shop with Indie Games (Links 2004 and 2007 developers). From what I understand, Links 2007 was said to be a landmark golf game, which would have been to the 360 what Links 2004 was to the XBox. It pains me to know that an 80% complete version of Links 2007 is languishing on somebody's hard drive right now, but it wouldn't more than a museum piece today in comparison to Perfect Golf.

    Andrew Jones: I actually had advanced conversations with Take 2 following the closure of Indie and they had agreed to give me the source code to Links 2007 on the condition that we released what we did as a community add on similar to what we had done with the MOD. The problem was when they closed the studios they just dumped all the stuff into boxes and warehoused it and they were not willing to spend the money to go through everything just to find me the source code...
    Does that not break your heart!? I know it rips me up even when I see it today, and this from over four years ago that we had the conversation. Heck, I'd have paid the money to go through everything and find that code! As good as Links 2004 looked and played on the original XBox, I can't imagine what they had accomplished with it but I bet it would have been a sight to behold!

    Oh god, this is just about the worst thing that I have heard (within the very parochial confines of golf video games, obviously). That absolutely breaks my heart to hear, given how good I think the original Links on Xbox was - and still is! How good would an X360 version of the game have been? Honestly, it may have changed the whole landscape of golf video games, if Links became to golf what NBA2K did to basketball (and just buried the EA product or forced it to be much, much better than what it was).
    Oh well. Just another horrible development in the long, sad, recent history of sports gaming. We've never been worse off, across sports, than we are right now (sadly).
    pietasterp
    Oh god, this is just about the worst thing that I have heard (within the very parochial confines of golf video games, obviously). That absolutely breaks my heart to hear, given how good I think the original Links on Xbox was - and still is! How good would an X360 version of the game have been? Honestly, it may have changed the whole landscape of golf video games, if Links became to golf what NBA2K did to basketball (and just buried the EA product or forced it to be much, much better than what it was).
    Oh well. Just another horrible development in the long, sad, recent history of sports gaming. We've never been worse off, across sports, than we are right now (sadly).

    I still can't get over how cavalierly Take 2 disposed of those valuable assets!? They didn't realize the value of what they had! I wish I had saved the e-mails I had with Daryl Welsh discussing Links 2007... he was really proud of what his former team had accomplished with it. Yet we never got to see even a screen shot of it... although that might make the pain even worse!
    Your point about how it *could* have escalated the race with the Tiger Woods series, and potentially have become the NBA 2K of golf is so valid that it raises my remorse over it to a new, unprecedented level..... ARRRGGGGGGHHHHH!!!
    pietasterp
    Oh well. Just another horrible development in the long, sad, recent history of sports gaming. We've never been worse off, across sports, than we are right now (sadly).

    The best testimonial I can offer to your point here is this... I get more enjoyment out of playing NCAA Football 2004 on my PS2, than I do playing Madden NFL 20 on my XBox One X!?
    OnlookerDelay
    The best testimonial I can offer to your point here is this... I get more enjoyment out of playing NCAA Football 2004 on my PS2, than I do playing Madden NFL 20 on my XBox One X!?

    I absolutely do as well (albeit w/ NCAA14 on X360). And oddly, the read-option/zone-read is better implemented in NCAA14 on X360 than in the most recent Madden game.
    Semi-seriously, I wonder if we offered to just come up to the offices and sift through the boxes, if they'd hand over the Links 2007 assets for a nominal fee. That's idiotic and fanciful thinking, but it's desperate times in the golf gaming landscape...
    OnlookerDelay
    The best testimonial I can offer to your point here is this... I get more enjoyment out of playing NCAA Football 2004 on my PS2, than I do playing Madden NFL 20 on my XBox One X!?

    I think most people feel that way. It's no surprise that, as competition goes out the window and complacency takes hold, subpar products get released. That's why these are the games in my rotation right now:
    -NCAA Football 14 (X360)
    -Tiger Woods PGA Tour 14 (X360) and TGC 2019 (only for course design, PS4)
    -2010 FIFA World Cup South Africa (X360)
    I think NBA 2K20 might enter my rotation once it's released on July 7 as one of the PS Plus free games for the month.
    And it also explains why the team making PGA Tour 2K21 can essentially do whatever kind of marketing, upgrades, enhancements, etc. it wants. I mean, we aren't getting a new golf "sim" anywhere else soon, are we?
    MrArlingtonBeach
    I think most people feel that way. It's no surprise that, as competition goes out the window and complacency takes hold, subpar products get released. That's why these are the games in my rotation right now:
    -NCAA Football 14 (X360)
    -Tiger Woods PGA Tour 14 (X360) and TGC 2019 (only for course design, PS4)
    -2010 FIFA World Cup South Africa (X360)
    I think NBA 2K20 might enter my rotation once it's released on July 7 as one of the PS Plus free games for the month.
    And it also explains why the team making PGA Tour 2K21 can essentially do whatever kind of marketing, upgrades, enhancements, etc. it wants. I mean, we aren't getting a new golf "sim" anywhere else soon, are we?

    Interesting - I'm similarly engaged..
    I play NHL Legacy (essentially the same for NHL 14, NHL 15 and Legacy), NCAA 2014 and TW 14
    Things seem to have peaked for me in that generation of things..
    Agree on all counts above (to a "T" with regard to the games being in rotation still), and even NCAA14 is only in the rotation because it was the last one released. EA is amazingly obtuse in that they take OUT features that used to exist in prior games for reasons that no one can adequately explain. For example, the most recent Madden has no option to slow the game speed down (I like to play NCAA14 on "very slow" because it seems like a more realistic pace to me). Why? Who knows? What am I going to do if I don't like it?
    Links on XBox wasn't perfect by any means, but as far as console golf went, it was as good as it got. The swing interface was really good (probably better IMO than anything even to this day). I actually still have my physical copy (yea for physical copies of games!) with Sergio Garcia on the cover. It is backward-compatible on the X360, which is why it will remain in my collection, likely forever.
    Now I really wonder what even a screenshot of the X360 game would have looked like....
    pietasterp
    Honestly, it may have changed the whole landscape of golf video games, if Links became to golf what NBA2K did to basketball (and just buried the EA product or forced it to be much, much better than what it was).

    To be honest, I don't think it would have changed much things at EA. The holy grail was always the Masters with Augusta and the 3 other Majors. EA did eventually get all that. It wouldn't even surprise me if EA ever make another golf game, it's because they were able to get Augusta again. It was a riot on all social media when simmmers found out Augusta wasn't in the game. It was post after post of customers stating they were not going to buy the game without Augusta.
    bigkev
    To be honest, I don't think it would have changed much things at EA. The holy grail was always the Masters with Augusta and the 3 other Majors. EA did eventually get all that. It wouldn't even surprise me if EA ever make another golf game, it's because they were able to get Augusta again. It was a riot on all social media when simmmers found out Augusta wasn't in the game. It was post after post of customers stating they were not going to buy the game without Augusta.

    Maybe. But I think, bigger picture, the question is would their product have been fundamentally different or more advanced if there was another game either nipping at their heels or overtaking them completely, as NBA2K did to NBA Live. As someone that bought the very first NBA2K on Sega Dreamcast way back in the day, I had no idea basketball games could be that good until I got NBA2K. Whatever you might think of it today, back then, it was so superior to what everyone assumed was the best/only basketball game around (NBA Live), it absolutely changed what people expected out of their sports games. Ditto NFL2K, which clearly forced Madden to up its game before they decided to eliminate the competition altogether.
    Clearly I'm extrapolating what might have happened in a far more niche sport like golf, but the point is that we'll never know what might have happened if another legitimate golf franchise with an entrenched/built-in fanbase (like myself) had been around during the entirety of the Tiger Woods era games. Whatever the case may have been, even if EA's product would have been no different (which I find hard to believe), at least there would have been a legitimate alternative that played a very different brand of golf than EA's offering.
    Just to add onto the above..
    EA has proven time and again that when they are in a space with no competition, they end up getting lazy and the products stagnate.
    I'd argue that the NHL games are a prime example of that. Some would argue Madden is also.
    Anyone ever go look at videos of All Pro Football 2k8?
    It's incredible to see the detail that went into that. Many would say Madden hasn't matched huge parts of it, 13 years later.
    scagwi
    Just to add onto the above..
    EA has proven time and again that when they are in a space with no competition, they end up getting lazy and the products stagnate.
    I'd argue that the NHL games are a prime example of that. Some would argue Madden is also.
    Anyone ever go look at videos of All Pro Football 2k8?
    It's incredible to see the detail that went into that. Many would say Madden hasn't matched huge parts of it, 13 years later.

    No question. There are still competitive eleagues for APF2K8, and watching them on TV, those games still somehow look more like real football than Madden20.
    NHL has also gone downhill - was disappointed when 2K dropped out of making hockey games, because I liked their offerings a lot more.
    Re: PGA2K21, I wonder what 2K needs to see in terms of sales to justify continued investment in the franchise? These things tend to be self-fulfilling prophecies in my experience. They invest next-to-nothing into the franchise, so it predictably doesn't do gangbusters sales, so they interpret that as a sign that they shouldn't invest more into the franchise....long story short we're back to no major publisher of golf next gen.
    pietasterp
    Maybe. But I think, bigger picture, the question is would their product have been fundamentally different or more advanced if there was another game either nipping at their heels or overtaking them completely, as NBA2K did to NBA Live.
    Clearly I'm extrapolating what might have happened in a far more niche sport like golf, but the point is that we'll never know what might have happened if another legitimate golf franchise with an entrenched/built-in fanbase (like myself) had been around during the entirety of the Tiger Woods era games.

    Yeah, niche sport like golf is the key here. It could very well have been like EA quitting on golf like they did after Rory because there was not enough return for investment with a rival game. Maybe never seen a game with Augusta and the 3 other Majors and instead of being nickel and dime by EA, it would have been by 2K. And MAYBE 2K would have quit too by now, and we would be stuck with HB and their low budget attempt because well... only the cartoon arcade golf games are selling these days. And some on mobile to make it even worst.
    Man, that's very depressing.
    pietasterp
    I absolutely do as well (albeit w/ NCAA14 on X360). And oddly, the read-option/zone-read is better implemented in NCAA14 on X360 than in the most recent Madden game.
    Semi-seriously, I wonder if we offered to just come up to the offices and sift through the boxes, if they'd hand over the Links 2007 assets for a nominal fee. That's idiotic and fanciful thinking, but it's desperate times in the golf gaming landscape...

    Yeah, truth be known, I prefer NCAA 2014 on the 360 to 2004 on the PS2. 2014 continues to amaze me! I still prefer NCAA 2004 PS2, over Madden 20 on the XBox One X though, just to take this comparison to its extremes.
    While I'm at it... NBA Inside Drive 2004 on the original XBox was second only to NBA 2K11 as my favorite basketball game of all time. College Hoops 2K8 isn't far behind.
    pietasterp
    Links on XBox wasn't perfect by any means, but as far as console golf went, it was as good as it got. The swing interface was really good (probably better IMO than anything even to this day).

    IMO, Links 2004 had the best full swing interface I've ever experienced. It's the only one that made a sensible connection between the rhythm of your swing and the shot result. I may have gotten 100% only 10 to 15% of the time on a full swing, but it felt so sweet when I did. It's chipping and putting game could have used some work, but it was a great start.
    Now I really wonder what even a screenshot of the X360 game would have looked like....

    Links 2004 already looked like an advanced XBox 360 game on the original XBox; I can't imagine what it would have looked like on the 360! I'd probably toss my cookies over it though! :)
    scagwi
    Anyone ever go look at videos of All Pro Football 2k8?
    It's incredible to see the detail that went into that. Many would say Madden hasn't matched huge parts of it, 13 years later.

    I have it and still play it on occasion. It is light years better than Madden 20 in terms of control and gameplay.
    OnlookerDelay
    Yeah, truth be known, I prefer NCAA 2014 on the 360 to 2004 on the PS2. 2014 continues to amaze me! I still prefer NCAA 2004 PS2, over Madden 20 on the XBox One X though, just to take this comparison to its extremes.
    While I'm at it... NBA Inside Drive 2004 on the original XBox was second only to NBA 2K11 as my favorite basketball game of all time. College Hoops 2K8 isn't far behind.

    I've played more College Hoops 2K8 than any other basketball game ever produced, with the possible exception of NBA Jam. While we're on the topic of being PO'd about the state of sports gaming, if there were a college basketball game with the graphics of the modern gen systems, even if it were a half-step behind the NBA product (which the college products tended to be), it would still be the best basketball game ever made. Heck, the exact gameplay from College Hoops 2K8 with updated graphics would be enough - that game was so good. I hate that we don't have a modern college hoops game. In fact, an entire console generation passed with no college sports games. What a disgrace.
    OnlookerDelay
    IMO, Links 2004 had the best full swing interface I've ever experienced. It's the only one that made a sensible connection between the rhythm of your swing and the shot result. I may have gotten 100% only 10 to 15% of the time on a full swing, but it felt so sweet when I did. It's chipping and putting game could have used some work, but it was a great start.
    Links 2004 already looked like an advanced XBox 360 game on the original XBox; I can't imagine what it would have looked like on the 360! I'd probably toss my cookies over it though! :)

    Agree that the short game was a little dicey, but the swing interface on XBox felt exactly right, to your point. It was somehow remarkable in its ordinary-ness, in some ways. It seemed like it was just logical and the default way a swing should work with an analog stick in a golf game, but as many years of subsequent titles have shown, it turns out that it isn't that easy to achieve that sort of "it's obvious it should feel like this" quality. I'm not sure how to describe it well (clearly!), but that was what always stuck out to me about the game. Like why doesn't every golf game's swing feel like this?
    OnlookerDelay
    I have it and still play it on occasion. It is light years better than Madden 20 in terms of control and gameplay.

    NFL2K5 is better than Madden20 in gameplay and control. I know that's a very "Operation Sports" thing to say, but I 100% believe that. It's amazing how well they integrated the ESPN license as well, with halftime highlights of other games and Boomer in the studio. I realize most people probably skipped those, but I (for whatever reason) would always watch them and see how the rest of the games in the league were going. I have APF2K8 as well, and it's great, but the lack of a real season or any kind of franchise makes it mostly a game of 1-off game, which it still does exceptionally well.
    OnlookerDelay
    You want to read something about this that will make you really sad? Read this interchange I had with Andrew Jones, Executive Producer of Perfect Golf:
    Me: Take-Two Interactive did acquire the rights to Links. They were in the process of creating what would have been called "Links 2007" for the XBox 360, when the project was canceled. I was in an e-mail exchange with Daryl Welsh, who was the producer of Links 2004, in 2006. He was working for Microsoft Corporate at that time, but was still staying in contact with the 2K Sport team that was developing the game.
    2K Sports was only a couple of months away from publishing Links 2007 for the 360, when Take-Two Interactive (2K Sports parent company) decided to close up shop with Indie Games (Links 2004 and 2007 developers). From what I understand, Links 2007 was said to be a landmark golf game, which would have been to the 360 what Links 2004 was to the XBox. It pains me to know that an 80% complete version of Links 2007 is languishing on somebody's hard drive right now, but it wouldn't more than a museum piece today in comparison to Perfect Golf.

    Andrew Jones: I actually had advanced conversations with Take 2 following the closure of Indie and they had agreed to give me the source code to Links 2007 on the condition that we released what we did as a community add on similar to what we had done with the MOD. The problem was when they closed the studios they just dumped all the stuff into boxes and warehoused it and they were not willing to spend the money to go through everything just to find me the source code...
    Does that not break your heart!? I know it rips me up even when I see it today, and this from over four years ago that we had the conversation. Heck, I'd have paid the money to go through everything and find that code! As good as Links 2004 looked and played on the original XBox, I can't imagine what they had accomplished with it but I bet it would have been a sight to behold!

    I have not heard this story before, but I knew Andrew and a few other were working with perfect golf. I think one of the main problems was at the time Tiger Woods was huge and MS could not compete or have the licenses that EA had. It is definitely horrible that they could not be bothered to find the code. Surely they had it on some type of electronic backup that was not that difficult to find. We cant even get a new mario golf on the switch right now I have no idea what is going on.
    I see 2K announced a price hike for next gen console games...
    I wonder if EA will follow suit… I would imagine so…
    Maybe that will help them justify getting back into golf.
    scagwi
    I see 2K announced a price hike for next gen console games...
    I wonder if EA will follow suit… I would imagine so…
    Maybe that will help them justify getting back into golf.

    So I guess a $20 NFL2K21 is out....
    I’m mostly fine with the price increase for truly AAA games.
    They really haven’t kept pace with inflation as one might have expected.
    That said, to me now EA and 2K need to step up these offerings a bit more for the next console generation. For instance it’s time for EA to truly reimagine the NHL games.
    I don't disagree, considering games were $50-60 as far back as 20-30 years ago already. But if they're going to up the cost, I do think that will signal to consumers that they need to up the quality as well. I'm not confident that will happen.
    I would imagine it costs a lot more to produce AAA titles now than it did 20-30 years ago but rarely did a studio release a game that wasn't finished unlike today. Graphics on the whole are a lot better of course but in most cases the quality of the experience has gone down.
    Someone on the HB forum commented about this in much the same way I think about it..
    Essentially, there is too much "release it at 80/90%" and "maybe we'll patch it later". Even worse, one wonders/worries that they end up deciding "how much to do" in patching based upon sales once it's already out.
    It's a complete path to nowhere.
    You have people waiting for patches for functionality/issues before buying the game and the company itself watching initial sales to, at least partially, gauge how much effort to put in moving forward.
    At least way back when, patching was much more challenging post release and thus the care that went into the released product was much higher.
    I can imagine some would use the above as a rationale to defend "pre-ordering"... I would look at it exactly in reverse in that you'd be "pre-rewarding" HB for, to this point, showing us a rather underwhelming product given that they want a completely new full purchase all over again -- instead of just a $15-20 DLC pack for 2019....which many of us have argued is what 2k21 really is/should have been.
    scagwi
    Someone on the HB forum commented about this in much the same way I think about it..
    Essentially, there is too much "release it at 80/90%" and "maybe we'll patch it later". Even worse, one wonders/worries that they end up deciding "how much to do" in patching based upon sales once it's already out.
    It's a complete path to nowhere.
    You have people waiting for patches for functionality/issues before buying the game and the company itself watching initial sales to, at least partially, gauge how much effort to put in moving forward.
    At least way back when, patching was much more challenging post release and thus the care that went into the released product was much higher.
    I can imagine some would use the above as a rationale to defend "pre-ordering"... I would look at it exactly in reverse in that you'd be "pre-rewarding" HB for, to this point, showing us a rather underwhelming product given that they want a completely new full purchase all over again -- instead of just a $15-20 DLC pack for 2019....which many of us have argued is what 2k21 really is/should have been.

    The whole issue of retail price on computer and video games is almost lost on my anymore. The only games I've just had to have on launch day at full retail price over the last five or six years has been: Forza 7, The Golf Club (2 & 2019), and Perfect Golf. I can see that a next-gen, AAA game that truly tapped the power of the next gen consoles would be worth $69.99, but a Unity based PGA TOUR 2K21 wouldn't fit that bill, unless they were somehow able to overcome whatever limitation Unity has that results in these substandard player models.
    I'll buy a $69.99 Forza 8, MSFS 2020, Virtual Golf 2 (Perfect Golf 2, if it ever gets beyond Trackman launch simulator use) and a MLB 2021: The Show (the only team sports game going right now that I think is worth its salt). The rest, I'll wait on the first or second price cut.
    pietasterp
    So I guess a $20 NFL2K21 is out....

    I know you're joking around ..... but springboarding off this to say that the build up has been so long, people would probably pay $79.99 and $99.99 if it included a single blade of "grass" from this past SB.
    I just noticed this little nugget on the PGA 2K21 website that I hadn't seen before, or seen anyone mention...bad news for all of the aspiring course designers that have a Nintendo Switch:
    "BUILD YOUR MYPLAYER & DREAM COURSE
    Create and personalize your MyPLAYER with equipment and apparel from brands you love. Design your ultimate course with 1,000s of custom options.*
    *Course Designer is not available on the Nintendo Switch."
    Even better? The Switch version is still listed for $60 on the site. Fewer features, same cost. Nice.
    The only way I see them showing increased sales on this game is a move to turn off the servers on the older games. Caught between the $hit and the stink here. User created courses is the biggest selling point but once you dump the archaic engine its game over. Sports gaming is not in a good place now.
    Someone on the TGC Tours Forums posted a great question to go along with the lack of the designer on the Switch:
    What courses the Switch users will get to play on their version of the game? Will they have access to the courses built on Xbox One, PS4, and PC? Or will they just get to play the "official" courses?
    MrArlingtonBeach
    Someone on the TGC Tours Forums posted a great question to go along with the lack of the designer on the Switch:
    What courses the Switch users will get to play on their version of the game? Will they have access to the courses built on Xbox One, PS4, and PC? Or will they just get to play the "official" courses?

    I think Shaun West's reply to the question, from the Reddit Q & A, about whether cross-play would be offered answers this question:
    "There will not be any crossplay, but courses designed by our community can be shared across all platforms. Users will be able to import their courses from The Golf Club 2019 and edit them with the new tools and assets available before publishing them in PGA TOUR 2K21."
    That's at least a sliver of good news for the Switch users...even though they are still being asked to pay full price for a game missing one of the features standard on other consoles.
    MrArlingtonBeach
    That's at least a sliver of good news for the Switch users...even though they are still being asked to pay full price for a game missing one of the features standard on other consoles.

    They shouldn't be charging $59.99 for the Switch version of the game with this healthy chunk of its functionality missing... I agree.
    Does anyone think there is any way in (heck) they release a demo for this game? I'd obviously love it if they did, but it seems unlikely, to say the least....
    I have to say, I wouldn't be shocked if a demo did come out. Probably 3 holes or something like that, at East Lake or one of the new licensed courses they haven't mentioned yet. It could maybe be set up as the final round of the Tour Championship with you against Justin Thomas. Maybe it would be like demos for NBA 2K games where you got to set up your MyPlayer as part of it, too?
    This is likely way high hopes, but I'd really love to see a demo. My heart says a demo gets released, my head says no way a demo comes out.
    I'm pretty sure they feel they gave enough trials, TGC 2019 free for a month on XBox and another free trial lately where you could keep the game for cheap if you wanted too. And then there was also the spring sale where you could get TGC2 for like $4.
    bigkev
    I'm pretty sure they feel they gave enough trials, TGC 2019 free for a month on XBox and another free trial lately where you could keep the game for cheap if you wanted too. And then there was also the spring sale where you could get TGC2 for like $4.

    Yes, but PGA2K21 is a brand new game that has nothing whatsoever to do with TGC2019!!!
    MrArlingtonBeach
    I have to say, I wouldn't be shocked if a demo did come out. Probably 3 holes or something like that, at East Lake or one of the new licensed courses they haven't mentioned yet. It could maybe be set up as the final round of the Tour Championship with you against Justin Thomas. Maybe it would be like demos for NBA 2K games where you got to set up your MyPlayer as part of it, too?
    This is likely way high hopes, but I'd really love to see a demo. My heart says a demo gets released, my head says no way a demo comes out.

    Until last year, I wouldn't have given this a chance of happening, but they did release a demo of NBA 2K20 on the PS4, XBox One, and PC last year. Now that TGC has dropped their brand from the title and it's fully 2K, I can possibly see this happening.
    As for your suggestion about going up against Justin Thomas in the final round of the Tour Championship, I don't think that could happen because I suspect you're only going to see cut-scene highlights of Justin Thomas playing 'his' round. Allowing the potential buyer the chance to set up their own MyPLAYER is probably doable in a demo.
    Still, I'd only give this about a 20% chance of happening, even though it's the only way to allow those who question the swing mechanic a chance to see if it works for them.
    OnlookerDelay
    As for your suggestion about going up against Justin Thomas in the final round of the Tour Championship, I don't think that could happen because I suspect you're only going to see cut-scene highlights of Justin Thomas playing 'his' round. Allowing the potential buyer the chance to set up their own MyPLAYER is probably doable in a demo.

    Yeah, I guess my thought was that it would be set up with voice over from Elvy and Beem setting the stage, with cut scenes showing Justin Thomas hitting a shot or two and finishing his round before you approach the last 3 holes at East Lake. He'd have a 2 or 3 shot lead or something like that, and you'd try to beat him by birdieing out.
    pietasterp
    Does anyone think there is any way in (heck) they release a demo for this game? I'd obviously love it if they did, but it seems unlikely, to say the least....

    God no way. Unless I am sadly mistaken and they do have something special on their hands with the latest game can't call it new then it would kill more sales than it would deliver. Between this and the last release fiasco I am getting tired of HB. This is a $20 purchase for me if I even buy this. :zzz:
    MrArlingtonBeach
    They have finally made the PS4 digital version of the game available for pre-order on the PS Store, for those interested.
    Also of note on the PS Store listing for PGA 2K21, and something not mentioned anywhere else: offline multiplayer is limited to just 2 players.
    https://store.playstation.com/en-us/product/UP1001-CUSA16832_00-PGA2K21PREORDER0
    Offline multiplayer (2 players)
    Online multiplayer (2-8 players)

    Be interesting to see if that gets addressed today.
    Why would you pre order a digital game? These games never sold out in the physical form at Gamestop so there wouldn't be a need to pre order the physical copy either. What do you get a special hat? :59:
    lowpaiddonkey10
    Why would you pre order a digital game? These games never sold out in the physical form at Gamestop so there wouldn't be a need to pre order the physical copy either. What do you get a special hat? :59:

    And that hat should come with a free bowl of soup.
    lowpaiddonkey10
    Why would you pre order a digital game? These games never sold out in the physical form at Gamestop so there wouldn't be a need to pre order the physical copy either. What do you get a special hat? :59:

    Along with sometimes providing DLC incentives (IDK if that's the case here or not), digital preorders allow you to download the entire game a few days early, and have it fully installed and ready to start up when the game is released (usually at midnight eastern time on a given day).
    It's an option of convenience, one that costs no more than purchasing the game digitally a few days after release.
    bcruise
    Along with sometimes providing DLC incentives (IDK if that's the case here or not), digital preorders allow you to download the entire game a few days early, and have it fully installed and ready to start up when the game is released (usually at midnight eastern time on a given day).
    It's an option of convenience, one that costs no more than purchasing the game digitally a few days after release.

    There are a few bonuses that come with preordering PGA 2K21:

    And I find that pre-ordering is totally reasonable for many games. If you know you want a game, and want to play it right away, go ahead and pre-order it early.
    But 2K21 is still so light on info that I am nowhere near pre-order consideration for it.
    bcruise
    Along with sometimes providing DLC incentives (IDK if that's the case here or not), digital preorders allow you to download the entire game a few days early, and have it fully installed and ready to start up when the game is released (usually at midnight eastern time on a given day).
    It's an option of convenience, one that costs no more than purchasing the game digitally a few days after release.

    Play 2 days early? I want to see at least a few weeks of solid un biased reviews before I buy this.
    lowpaiddonkey10
    Play 2 days early? I want to see at least a few weeks of solid un biased reviews before I buy this.

    Which is totally your option. If somebody knows they're going to buy a game regardless of what reviews might come out, they might feel differently. I'm just speaking in general pre-order terms here, not only about this game.
    Also I didn't say "play 2 days early", I said "download a few days early". As in, it sits on your hard drive until release time, and you can't play it until then. It's not an incentive for playing the game early unless it specifically says so - those kinds of promotions do happen on occasion. And that doesn't appear to be the case here as the August 21 release date looks consistent no matter which version you buy. The digital preorder is more for people like me with slower internet who can't download the whole game in one night (again, not speaking specifically about this game).
    Sits on the hard drive. At my age I have learned to have a little patience and I kinda get the feeling when someone ain't telling me something good like chomping on the bit to spit it out they got nothing for me. But we wait. I'll wait a bit longer and forego the fancy pants.
    lowpaiddonkey10
    Sits on the hard drive. At my age I have learned to have a little patience and I kinda get the feeling when someone ain't telling me something good like chomping on the bit to spit it out they got nothing for me. But we wait. I'll wait a bit longer and forego the fancy pants.

    Interesting theory LPD, and at first glance, it makes logical sense. I pondered on it a bit and how it might work with illogical marketing entities like HB Studios and 2K are proving themselves to be. I'll go back to TGC 2019 to cite an example where this theory doesn't always work for them and I found one that's a classic, head-scratching example.
    In the roll up to TGC 2019's release, HB Studios was being hounded by questions about XBox One X and PS4 Pro enhancement... they wouldn't even acknowledge the questions. Finally, Shaun Wilson responded in a well written, detailed post about how they were going with 2160p on the XBox One X and 1600p on the PS Pro, further adding that they were each being locked at 30 FPS for stability. However, he failed to add to that post that the object detail was ratcheted up significantly in the X and Pro versions, to the point where it looked like a next tier game, when compared to the stock PS4 and XB1, in some cases!
    How in the world you could have an enhancement of the degree they pulled off with the Pro and the X, and NOT tout it as a desirable product feature is beyond all logic!? To make matters worse, they "lost" Shaun's post about Pro/X enhancement when they did a total wipe for the TGC 2019 forum, right around launch!? It made ZERO sense!!
    A second example I can cite as to how conventional marketing logic doesn't apply to HB Studios/2K is they way 2K21 was 'teased' by Shaun West in his TSN Radio 1290 interview with Andrew Paterson back in April. Andrew asked Shaun if there might be a new Golf Club game in the future and Shaun responded with: 'we're working to get some new content out there', which doesn't sound anything like a new game, with a new swing interface, licensed PGA TOUR pros, nine additional officially licensed PGA TOUR courses, new more realistically rendered 3-D rough grasses, more blended transitions between turf types, etc.
    That radio interview would have been a great way to properly announce your new product and its merits. To couch it as 'some new content' is denigrating to your own product, IMO?? I don't understand it... I just don't understand it.
    So now I'm sitting here wondering, what are they sitting on right now that could have people truly buzzed about the game, and thereby snowballing interest in it if it were known? HB Studios avoids some questions like the plague: Don't ask about: Screen resolutions, frame rates, anisotropic filtering levels, Anti-aliasing options, planned degrees of compatibility with next-gen hardware, how the swing mechanic has changed, how will tempo be implemented, how you can use the pros in career mode/can they play a round with you in tournament play, how will multiplayer online handle settings for matchmaking, what changes/options have been added to Society modes...
    I have a feeling there's going to be some hidden property about this game that I will find endearing, yet you'll never hear a peep about it from HB/2K. Of course here I am, a case in point of the textbook definition of illogical, calling the kettle black ;)
    bcruise
    Which is totally your option. If somebody knows they're going to buy a game regardless of what reviews might come out, they might feel differently. I'm just speaking in general pre-order terms here, not only about this game.
    Also I didn't say "play 2 days early", I said "download a few days early". As in, it sits on your hard drive until release time, and you can't play it until then. It's not an incentive for playing the game early unless it specifically says so - those kinds of promotions do happen on occasion. And that doesn't appear to be the case here as the August 21 release date looks consistent no matter which version you buy. The digital preorder is more for people like me with slower internet who can't download the whole game in one night (again, not speaking specifically about this game).

    I'm trying to remember back to TGC 2019's launch and it became playable for me right around midnight on launch day. I had placed a pre-order, so it was already downloaded, it was just waiting for the server to set the flag to "GO".
    MrArlingtonBeach
    Perhaps we're about to get something out of HB Studios/2K....course list coming soon, perhaps?
    https://twitter.com/PGATOUR2K/status/1281619477465985024
    EDIT - They tweeted back at me, and the course list is "coming soon".

    There's only like four or five courses yet to named but I guess in light of the way the rest of this rollout has gone, this would be considered to be a tease worthy tweet?
    I will say this, they have done a great job with their official PGA TOUR courses in TGC 2019, and I've seen nothing to make me think anything less of those that will be in 2K21 so far. HB Studios is able to add custom objects to their licensed courses, and mix assets from other themes to get just the look they want on these, and I see the benefit of it in the finished product.
    Given that most of the courses have already been listed or shown in videos from HB/2K, I am assuming that some of the remaining ones will be carryovers from TGC 2019.
    Ones not shown, but that were in TGC 2019:
    TPC Summerlin
    TPC Southwind
    TPC Boston
    They also included The Atlantic Beach Country Club in TGC 2019, as it was the Web.com Tour Championship site. Now, the Korn Ferry Tour Championship is held at Victoria National Golf Club in Indiana, so maybe that course will be in. The career mode trailer did show that the Korn Ferry Tour is in 2K21.
    MrArlingtonBeach
    Given that most of the courses have already been listed or shown in videos from HB/2K, I am assuming that some of the remaining ones will be carryovers from TGC 2019.
    Ones not shown, but that were in TGC 2019:
    TPC Summerlin
    TPC Southwind
    TPC Boston
    They also included The Atlantic Beach Country Club in TGC 2019, as it was the Web.com Tour Championship site. Now, the Korn Ferry Tour Championship is held at Victoria National Golf Club in Indiana, so maybe that course will be in. The career mode trailer did show that the Korn Ferry Tour is in 2K21.

    I think you're all over it. I'd love to see TPC Southwind come back; it's my favorite from TGC 2019.
    MrArlingtonBeach
    Given that most of the courses have already been listed or shown in videos from HB/2K, I am assuming that some of the remaining ones will be carryovers from TGC 2019.
    Ones not shown, but that were in TGC 2019:
    TPC Summerlin
    TPC Southwind
    TPC Boston
    They also included The Atlantic Beach Country Club in TGC 2019, as it was the Web.com Tour Championship site. Now, the Korn Ferry Tour Championship is held at Victoria National Golf Club in Indiana, so maybe that course will be in. The career mode trailer did show that the Korn Ferry Tour is in 2K21.

    Add in Olympia Fields to the list. HB and 2K have been hyping up the FedEx Cup way too much, for the past ~2 years, to just not include all of the playoff courses.
    itsmb8
    Add in Olympia Fields to the list. HB and 2K have been hyping up the FedEx Cup way too much, for the past ~2 years, to just not include all of the playoff courses.

    I hope you're right...I'd like to see a few new courses in the mix instead of retreads, personally.
    I mean, I know every popular real course under the sun will eventually make it into the game, via the designer, but I do like the tournament branding and things they can use in the real-life official courses. And they did make a point to say that there are 15 real-world licensed courses AND tournaments, so one can assume the courses they add will be attached to a real-world event, like the BMW Championship and Olympia Fields.
    So "coming soon" apparently didn't mean yesterday...still no course list.
    Also, UFC 4 just released a trailer and their release date: Aug. 14.
    So the week before PGA 2K21 comes out, UFC 4 is released. And the week after PGA 2K21 comes out, Madden NFL 21 is released. Plus, the highly-anticipated Tony Hawk Pro Skater 1 & 2 remake comes out 2 weeks later.
    HB/2K may want to step up their approach to marketing this game, given all the competition they have in the weeks surrounding their game's release. These little "sizzle" clips that feature next to nothing in terms of information or gameplay will get immediately lost in the shuffle as these other bigger games start to promote their products.
    MrArlingtonBeach
    So "coming soon" apparently didn't mean yesterday...still no course list.
    Also, UFC 4 just released a trailer and their release date: Aug. 14.
    So the week before PGA 2K21 comes out, UFC 4 is released. And the week after PGA 2K21 comes out, Madden NFL 21 is released. Plus, the highly-anticipated Tony Hawk Pro Skater 1 & 2 remake comes out 2 weeks later.
    HB/2K may want to step up their approach to marketing this game, given all the competition they have in the weeks surrounding their game's release. These little "sizzle" clips that feature next to nothing in terms of information or gameplay will get immediately lost in the shuffle as these other bigger games start to promote their products.

    It really is perplexing isn't it? I just can't believe that 2K would be a part of such a clumsy release promotion!? As for the other games you mentioned, they'll have some potential impact on PGA TOUR 2K21 getting lost in the noise.
    I remember when I used to pre-order Madden and keep a vigil for the UPS truck to deliver it. Now I wait for it to go into the EA Access vault and play one season with my Panthers, and I'm done. I'll put it through the motions during early access weekend, but that's before the football season and my football hormones haven't kicked in yet. I only played Madden 20 for an hour and a half before I'd seen enough of it. It might be one of the worst 2 or 3 Madden's I've ever played, and I'm hearing 21 isn't shaping up much better.
    itsmb8
    HB just has too much involvement in everything still. Gameplay, they're not bad. But they're trash at everything else.

    Yeah the game looks decent even on Unity and the game play is OK with a few small problems but overall I still like the game.
    As far as their marketing goes they're like the guy who stayed out all night drinking and shows up 5 minutes before their tee time. This release has to be better than the last time I would hope.
    They've still got five and a half weeks to get something more substantive out there. It's obvious they aren't doing the developer diaries like the did with TGC and TGC 2... those were well produced and informative.
    I don't think we're going to know anything worth knowing until one of the devs, probably Shaun West, takes on a you tube streamer (preferably one like Respawn or JimGem, who knows something about golf gaming, in live multiplayer. I still think that's going to happen, but I suspect it's going to be TheApexHound again. He did okay with TGC 2019 in a live stream with Shaun West, but he clearly doesn't know golf or golf gaming quite as well as Respawn or JimGem.
    You can't convince me that with the PGA being the only major sport currently playing, that if the PGA2K21 game were out right now, it would have a much better chance at doing well vs. releasing in August. I understand a lot goes into that decision and it may or may not have been possible to release earlier, but with no major releases currently and being smack in the middle of summer with golf having the spotlight to itself to some extent, it would make so much sense for the game to be out right now.
    But, as others have pointed out, nothing about this announcement or roll out has been even remotely sensible.
    pietasterp
    You can't convince me that with the PGA being the only major sport currently playing, that if the PGA2K21 game were out right now, it would have a much better chance at doing well vs. releasing in August. I understand a lot goes into that decision and it may or may not have been possible to release earlier, but with no major releases currently and being smack in the middle of summer with golf having the spotlight to itself to some extent, it would make so much sense for the game to be out right now.
    But, as others have pointed out, nothing about this announcement or roll out has been even remotely sensible.

    I really dont think the advertising / announcements and what not are up to HB. With the original TGC HB was very very open and engaging with news / updates / answering questions on the forums. Since they have partnered with other entities all that has disappeared. The one game launched without a release date just kinda showed up and sent them into scramble mode. I will say there has been much more advertising for this release than previous ones, but the lack of news / updates is kinda disturbing and disappointing.
    MrArlingtonBeach
    I just noticed this little nugget on the PGA 2K21 website that I hadn't seen before, or seen anyone mention...bad news for all of the aspiring course designers that have a Nintendo Switch:
    "BUILD YOUR MYPLAYER & DREAM COURSE
    Create and personalize your MyPLAYER with equipment and apparel from brands you love. Design your ultimate course with 1,000s of custom options.*
    *Course Designer is not available on the Nintendo Switch."
    Even better? The Switch version is still listed for $60 on the site. Fewer features, same cost. Nice.

    Wait a minute, really? I had planned on buying the Switch version but now I’m rethinking it.
    OnlookerDelay
    It shocked me to read that they were going with six levels of difficulty, but I welcome it! If all six can be used in online matchmaking, that's going to thin the player pool considerably!

    Im intrigued again, six difficulty levels and customization is great, but man this marketing has been awful. This type of info should’ve been revealed day 1.
    Crazy Packers Fan
    Wait a minute, really? I had planned on buying the Switch version but now I’m rethinking it.

    Shaun West (the game's producer) spoke to this on the 2K forum thusly:
    "We're not quite ready to share information about the post launch plans but there will be additional support after release. You'll have to wait a bit for more details as we're continuing to focus on the rollout for release on August 21. The game is looking and playing fantastic though and I can't wait for everyone to get their hands on it."
    Here's a link to the post: https://forums.2k.com/showthread.php?4379522-Nintendo-Switch-version-Same-functionality-as-other-versions&p=15274468#post15274468
    jbd345
    Im intrigued again, six difficulty levels and customization is great, but man this marketing has been awful. This type of info should’ve been revealed day 1.

    Not only six "fixed" difficulty levels, but it sounds like there's customization options between all of those. I'm curious to see how they ensure all players have the same settings in multiplayer with the chance of locking them also for Societies, as an option.
    I don’t really care how they market the game. We have all been around this game long enough to know how HB operates in that regard.
    But I can tell you this!
    This game is going to ROCK!!
    6 difficulty levels, able to mix and match them, attributes to clubs!.... Fantastic!!
    I was a little worried but not anymore.
    Cmon Aug21!
    I may have a chance now over at TGCTours lol
    lions67
    I don’t really care how they market the game. We have all been around this game long enough to know how HB operates in that regard.
    But I can tell you this!
    This game is going to ROCK!!
    6 difficulty levels, able to mix and match them, attributes to clubs!.... Fantastic!!
    I was a little worried but not anymore.
    Cmon Aug21!
    I may have a chance now over at TGCTours lol

    I don't think people care about the marketing of the game based on the relative merits of one strategy vs another, but it's relevant because for those of us that are on the fence or want to be persuaded to buy the game, you have to show some red meat and dig into the details of things that really matter (gameplay, mainly), not just produce puff pieces showing fast cuts of various courses. I need to see how the game actually looks & works while being played, otherwise I can't make any kind of decision on whether I might be interested enough to buy the game or not. Lacking any substantive information, though, my bias is to not purchase the game until/unless I hear something good from other like-minded individuals.
    If you're already all-in on the game, that's great. For those of us that aren't, this rollout is not moving the needle at all.
    pietasterp
    If you're already all-in on the game, that's great. For those of us that aren't, this rollout is not moving the needle at all.

    Yep - the needle hasn't even flickered on this one for me

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