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NBA 2K21 Next-Gen Gameplay Blog (Part 2 of 3) - Movement, Contact, Impact Engine & More

NBA 2K21

NBA 2K21 Next-Gen Gameplay Blog (Part 2 of 3) - Movement, Contact, Impact Engine & More

Last week, 2K revealed their NBA 2K21 next-gen gameplay trailer, along with part 1 of their 3 part next-gen gameplay blog, going over the fundamentals in the game, including details on Pro Stick shooting, Pro Stick dribbling, passing and more.

Today, 2K has released part 2, in their latest Courtside Report, as gameplay director, Mike Wang (AKA Beluba), goes over movement, contact, the Impact Engine, PlayStation 5 trigger controls and much more.

Next-Gen Movement

There’s nothing more exciting for a developer than the arrival of new consoles. Every new generation gives us the opportunity to step back and reimagine how we can push the sports gaming genre forward. If I had to pick one aspect of gameplay that’s probably benefited the most from the jump to next-gen, the answer would probably have to be on-court locomotion. Movement is the foundation for a solid basketball game. When that foundation isn’t solid, a lot of aspects of the game fall apart. We put a lot of resources toward improving locomotion with and without the ball, and I’m excited how far it’s come to kick off year one of the next generation of 2K hoops.

Dribble movement: The dribbler was rebuilt from the ground up for next-gen and the difference is night and day. We retained the concept of signature dribble styles that we introduced a couple years ago, but otherwise, everything was scrapped and re-architected bringing a completely different feel with the ball in your hands for next-gen. Additionally, protect and post movement saw massive upgrades. The aspect of dribble movement that excites me the most is the predictability and consistency of it. It’s much easier to go exactly where you want on the floor, and in the manner that you’d expect to get there. No unwanted turns or having your player face the wrong way. No bursting up to speed or failed cuts. It just works. And because it’s built using the same engine as the Pro Stick dribble move system, movement and moves work cohesively together. Player speeds are more accurate to real life and the sense of weight feels more realistic. It’s a complete package and I don’t think I can overstate how much it’s elevated my enjoyment of playing the game.

Defense and Off-Ball: All non-dribbling movement from on-ball defense, to off-ball offense and defense is run by our motion engine which is in its third year of development. The motion team has been working tirelessly to bring a next-gen improvement to moving without the ball, and it both looks and feels fantastic. Here are some of the upgrades that stand out:

  • Unique contextual motion assets for various basketball situations (Transition Stops, Leak Out, Guard Break, Anchor, Space Perimeter) bring an awareness to the look of the players on the floor and give them more life.
  • Improved pathing, cuts, and stops make defenders feel more grounded and fix a lot of the sliding from the previous generation.
  • Overall improvement to motion stability and response. In other words, we smoothed out the twitchiness and players can more accurately follow exactly what you’re doing on the sticks.
  • Updated player-size detection logic and greater emphasis on player differentiation. Bigs move like bigs, and guards move like guards. This includes a lot of new animation content to support signature motion styles.
  • Left stick taps allow you to play quick steps which are really helpful when you need to make subtle adjustments to your defensive position.

Foot Planting: Sliding in basketball is no good. But it’s something we’ve had to live with in the past because of limitations in technology. I’m happy to say that the next-gen version of NBA 2K21 takes a huge leap in that department. Our engineers re-wrote our foot planting tech from scratch and it led to one of the most striking visual improvements when you compare next-gen to previous generations. Players can now take procedural steps instead of sliding their feet when they need to make micro-adjustments. I love seeing proper footwork as players are making hard cuts, accelerating, stopping… even just standing and making subtle movements in place. It just brings 2K hoops one more step (see what I did there?) closer to real life.

Body Ups: That’s our internal name for all of the interactions between the ball handler and defender. It’s always a tricky balance trying to accurately model the cat & mouse game between the offense and the defense. Our goal with body ups was to highlight the improvements that we were able to make to both dribbling and defensive movement. To that end, it meant less canned interactions and doing a better job of respecting user control. I think the next-gen version of NBA 2K21 strikes a great balance between rewarding taking proper driving angles and respecting contact. Attempting to drive head first directly into a defender will stop them in their tracks, lead to charges, or force pickups. When ball handlers get to the hip of the defender but the defender matches well, it will lead to more realistic rides that neither player will feel stuck in. And on the other extreme, slow footed (or slow to react) defenders will be punished with blow by’s and if they try to force the contact too late, might get hit with a blocking foul. Strong ball handlers can also hard stop out of a ride and crab defenders more effectively so it’s not always about speed when trying to probe into the paint. The logic for the types of resolutions that play out is much more robust and takes into account every little detail you can think of. The end result is a better 1-on-1 game that more accurately mirrors the real NBA.

Off-Ball Contact: Just like with body ups, we wanted to translate those same principles off-ball. The motion team completely re-worked the off-ball contact system, which now features everything from “let throughs” (incidental contact) to hard collisions. There’s a great freedom of movement when you’re working away from the ball but also realistic contact when it’s called for, all with no snatching or sliding. My favorite aspect of these collisions can be seen in the new screen interactions. Gone are the “vacuum screens” that have plagued basketball games in the past where defenders would get pulled into a screen collision and run in a direction they weren’t asking for. You can reject screens appropriately, go over or under as you’d expect, and “die” on a screen if you have a weak defender trying to barrel through a big. It all looks great, but more importantly, feels great for both the offense and defense to get the outcomes that make sense in such an important aspect of team basketball.

Impact Engine

One of the biggest challenges we face when balancing offense and defense is contact in the paint. As you can tell, with next-gen we really stress the importance of respecting user control and not warping defenders into place for the sake of game balance. But it’s vital to be able to have reliable contact, especially for protecting the basket, in order to prevent bloated points in the paint. For NBA 2K21 next- gen, we developed a new in-air contact shot system that we internally call the Impact Engine. The goal was to completely remove the snatching that we’d been using in past games and resolve collisions on the fly as players hit each other in mid-air. The Impact Engine and next-gen console power gives us the flexibility to do just that. By creating reliable contact when players are in flight, we no longer have to take control of defenders while they’re on the ground and pull them into place just to force certain outcomes. This will be most noticeable for paint defenders as they’ll have the freedom to maneuver their players into position and make a play on the ball themselves rather than the game dictating what happens based on whatever animations happen to trigger. To further aid paint defense, the logic that goes into block targeting was improved and we’re using IK more heavily now to get the hand to track the ball (as well as to minimize clipping.) One of the main beneficiaries of the new engine is that we now have contact alley- oop and putback dunk-ons for the first time in 2K, which look sick and feel rewarding when you can pull them off!

On-ground contact also saw major upgrades, specifically with charge and block fouls. Beating the shooter to the spot and getting set will yield a lot more successful charge calls on the offense while being late will give you more blocking fouls. We’ve also added “crash” layups for the situations where the shooter barrels into the defense but a charge or block aren’t warranted. These animations will help convey to the player that they’re forcing the issue and hopefully teach them to respect paint defenders next time they go inside. If you can’t get around the defense, sometimes it’s better to shoot a floater or pull-up jumper.

PlayStation 5 Trigger Effect

Something that always excites us as developers is the introduction of new hardware features that come along with new consoles. When we first heard about the PlayStation 5’s adaptive triggers and haptic feedback, we immediately began brainstorming ways to use them to enhance the gameplay experience. As soon as we got our hands on the dev kits, our lead engineer experimented with several different prototypes to figure out what made the most sense for a basketball game.

For the adaptive triggers, we opted to use them to convey energy/fatigue. As you move around the court, you’ll feel more and more resistance on the Sprint trigger as your player’s energy drains. We also use adaptive resistance in the post game. Strong post players will feel very little resistance on L2 when backing down weaker opponents, but you’ll have to use more force to pull L2 when it’s the other way around. It’s very interesting to play with and helps immerse you into the experience of actually being on the basketball court!

As for haptic feedback, we used it to accentuate our various collision systems. Boxouts, body-up rides, off-ball collisions/deny/rides… basically any situation where players make significant contact will vibrate the controller at various intensities depending on the strength of the players involved and the severity of the impact. It’s so dope to feel the difference in your hands between a grazing bump and hard hit. It’s also a great reinforcement tool to understand when you’re making players work too hard on the court, which could hit their energy/stamina levels and potentially cause wear-and-tear on their bodies with our in-depth injury system.

There’s so much more that happened on the engineering front to raise the bar in building NBA 2K21’s next-gen tech, but these are just the main ones I wanted to bring to your attention for today. New technology is always exciting and I love seeing how advancements in the hardware lead to advancements in the software, which then birth new gameplay features and push the genre forward. Make sure to check out next week’s final gameplay Courtside Report as I reveal details about player builds, badges, takeover, and improvements to AI!

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Discussion
  1. "charges and blocks" finger crosses that they can last past the first next gen title update.
    Everything in NBA 2K blogs always sounds great, and I give each new game the benefit of the doubt, but the last few years many aspects of the game haven't lived up to the excitement created by the blogs.
    So I'm optimistic as always, because of course it all sounds phenomenal beyond belief, but a fair amount of skepticism is warranted. I held off on buying the current gen for the first time ever, this will an day one purchase of course despite any misgivings.
    it scares me hearing them overusing the term " from the ground up"...or "completely rebuild" just sound like PR marketing talk and over the past iterations hearing the overpromising and under delivering has really taking its told to be cautious.
    what really stood out hearing was the Blocking/charging improvements from the collision engine and ability to not feel stuck in any collision animations from both offense and defence aspects of 1 on 1 animations...
    hopefully the PNR collisions are as advertised and all that suction towards the screener is removed
    and finally am looking forward in experiencing just how fluid movements are in regards to subtle angles and directions a user can change (baring using sprint or not)
    ....as before the wide angles or paths one would have to take after getting pass a defender to get to the rim due to lack of subtle dribbling movement directional changes was lacking
    Dribbler built from scratch yet in the first trailer, Tim Hardaway is still skipping frames and warping between positions before his drive and dunk.
    Other than that, the animations look great in super slow-mo. We'll see if they look as good during proper gameplay.
    But it's the same marketing buzzwords every few years.
    This is what they said for 2K14...
    "Mike talking about emphasis on foot planting in next gen and how next gen helps us improve it beyond any sports game experience in history"
    And going back to 2K15 (before the visual downgrades), the animations looked just as smooth too:
    https://youtu.be/NK71eV7ozvM
    Don’t understand why they showed that dlo footage but okay. Foot planting looks good, nice contact dunks. Will say I am a bit disappointed that a lot of hairstyles are still the same. Was hoping they would update next gen
    I like the idea of resistance triggers tied to stamina, I have always wanted something like that, I hope it is also represented in the speed of players on the court Bron little to no resistance, Gobert lots of resistance.
    And for the life of me, I don't know why they don't use the swipe function on the touch pad to assign some plays or sets and you can just swipe left, right, up or down to immediately go into that play or set.
    I’m liking all of the gameplay stuff coming out first.
    I’m liking all of the “little things” in gameplay they are showing.
    Sometimes a lot of little things can add up to big changes.
    I’m excited.
    thesniper321
    So a long blog just to show us new Can animations that are* going to make us lose control of our players... Nothing New here.

    Never a lack of optimism here!
    Not excited at all.
    Graphics are even worse than i thought after the first trailer.
    Definitly not next gen level. You can see that a lot of CFs of current gen are reused.
    You can also clearly see that sliding is still there despite excuse like "Sliding in basketball is no good. But it’s something we’ve had to live with in the past because of limitations in technology"
    2k14/15/16 dont have this big issue which appeared in fact with the new motion engine.
    Everything isnt bad, those new animations movements look better, and "less canned interactions and doing a better job of respecting user control" sounds better too
    but it's not the big step i expected for the next gen.
    stickyfingers
    Not excited at all.
    Graphics are even worse than i thought after the first trailer.
    Definitly not next gen level. You can see that a lot of CFs of current gen are reused.
    You can also clearly see that sliding is still there despite excuse like "Sliding in basketball is no good. But it’s something we’ve had to live with in the past because of limitations in technology"
    2k14/15/16 dont have this big issue which appeared in fact with the new motion engine.
    Everything isnt bad, those new animations movements look better, and "less canned interactions and doing a better job of respecting user control" sounds better too
    but it's not the big step i expected for the next gen.

    I keep seeing people say "this isn't next gen level" but I have yet to see another next-gen game that hands down looks better. In fact I'd say this is one of the best looking next-gen games we've seen thus far. I think some people have set their next-gen expectations too high. Maybe the Unreal 5 tech demo caused people to expect that level of graphics for next-gen.
    This looks and sounds like a promising start to the new generation. It seems like they are focused on important areas and I think the visuals are looking really good so far. And perhaps best of all is this sounds like it'll be a fully featured game and not a bare bones release like we've seen from previous next-gen launch sports titles.
    Yeah people expected to be controlling real humans on a screen by now. Anything less is simply "current gen" in their eyes. Smh
    scottyp180
    I keep seeing people say "this isn't next gen level" but I have yet to see another next-gen game that hands down looks better. In fact I'd say this is one of the best looking next-gen games we've seen thus far. I think some people have set their next-gen expectations too high. Maybe the Unreal 5 tech demo caused people to expect that level of graphics for next-gen.
    This looks and sounds like a promising start to the new generation. It seems like they are focused on important areas and I think the visuals are looking really good so far. And perhaps best of all is this sounds like it'll be a fully featured game and not a bare bones release like we've seen from previous next-gen launch sports titles.

    Sent from my SM-N986U1 using Operation Sports mobile app
    scottyp180
    I keep seeing people say "this isn't next gen level" but I have yet to see another next-gen game that hands down looks better. In fact I'd say this is one of the best looking next-gen games we've seen thus far. I think some people have set their next-gen expectations too high. Maybe the Unreal 5 tech demo caused people to expect that level of graphics for next-gen.
    This looks and sounds like a promising start to the new generation. It seems like they are focused on important areas and I think the visuals are looking really good so far. And perhaps best of all is this sounds like it'll be a fully featured game and not a bare bones release like we've seen from previous next-gen launch sports titles.

    Agree 100%. From what I have read and seen this looks like it will feel like a different game. The last 3 games have bored me pretty quick because the fell is so similar.
    I've stated the same in another thread, come on guys, you should be a bit more wiser than this, come on!!
    Looks like we should have had it 7 years ago... This is all bluh bluh guyss.. don't fall it, not anymore, please just a bit of memory, that's all....
    From 2013, below..
    https://twitter.com/ronnie2k/status/393116931756023808

    internette fotoğraf paylaşma
    Isn't that enough? You want some more here ya go..
    https://blog.playstation.com/2013/11/06/nba-2k14s-eco-motion-engine-brings-players-to-life-on-ps4/
    Still not enough you need more? I got ya...
    https://forums.operationsports.com/features/2322/nba-2k16-gameplay-blog-with-mike-wang/
    Just a bit of memory will help us all...
    To each their own but I cant understand how anyone could interpret this as not at least sounding great.
    I can fathom the skepticism as we've all seen underdelivered promises but at face value this is all a massive upgrade.
    Graphically speaking everyone was told for months it would be the little details, lighting etc that would be better so anyone thinking there would be a mind blowing difference either wasnt listening or has way too high of expectations. personally when looking at the little things on what we've been shown it looks a lot better than what I was expecting.
    lastly I'm so glad I preordered a PS5. I was second guessing myself a bit and when they cost $700 cad I think its natural to worry if I made the right decision. That part about the triggers and haptic feedback solidifies that I made the right decision and I cant wait to play this thing.
    Dione2014
    Yeah people expected to be controlling real humans on a screen by now. Anything less is simply "current gen" in their eyes. Smh
    Sent from my SM-N986U1 using Operation Sports mobile app

    Basically. I find it so annoying when people make this comment. Sometimes I just want to scream "How do you know what next-gen supposed to look like? Are you a game developer?". As long I can see some improvements, then I'm good. ESPECIALLY when it's a launch title for a new console. If it still looks the same 2-3 years from now, then that might be a new conversation.
    dvir10
    Am I the only one who was p***** off to see DLO contact dunk?!

    yeah, the one with the left hand? you simply can't jump as high after being bumped a coupld of times like that, balance isn't optimal and you can't get as much thrust, would have been much better if it was a lay-up attempt.
    I also noticed 2 other things - the screen video you can see 3-point shooter dunkan robinson with his hands on his hips!!!!,... normally I wouldn't care, but in that situation with the ball on the perimeter he should be ready for a pass #1 and #2, IF he did get a pass, he'd have some weird ash animation to go from lounging around pose to receiving a pass. He looks like it's a time-out!
    The Lopez block - the player who got his shot blocked will get the ball and probably get a bunny. His momentum should just take him out of the play, or make him lose balance and drift out of bounds because too many people who just get demoralized GET THE BALL BACK in too many previous 2k's... I know it happens sometimes in real life, but these vids are cherry picked. IRL Lopez would have knocked it further away or the player would have too much momentum going to the wrong way - not recover his ball after attempting a layup.
    So aside from those 2 things and the contact dunk, I'm actually pretty excited, it's just a bit odd to make such a deliberate choice, choosing those particular videos that show weaknesses like that.
    ataman5
    I've stated the same in another thread, come on guys, you should be a bit more wiser than this, come on!!
    Looks like we should have had it 7 years ago... This is all bluh bluh guyss.. don't fall it, not anymore, please just a bit of memory, that's all....
    From 2013, below..
    https://twitter.com/ronnie2k/status/393116931756023808

    internette fotoğraf paylaşma
    Isn't that enough? You want some more here ya go..
    https://blog.playstation.com/2013/11/06/nba-2k14s-eco-motion-engine-brings-players-to-life-on-ps4/
    Still not enough you need more? I got ya...
    https://forums.operationsports.com/features/2322/nba-2k16-gameplay-blog-with-mike-wang/
    Just a bit of memory will help us all...

    Soooooooooo...are you staying that NBA 2K14 played exactly the same on the PS3 and PS4? Are you stating that there was zero improvements made and that game didn't take advantage of the new technology?
    ksuttonjr76
    Basically. I find it so annoying when people make this comment. Sometimes I just want to scream "How do you know what next-gen supposed to look like? Are you a game developer?". As long I can see some improvements, then I'm good. ESPECIALLY when it's a launch title for a new console. If it still looks the same 2-3 years from now, then that might be a new conversation.

    And i feel it annoying when people bite every words of those communications.
    Low expectations, low updates...
    We agree that the most important is the gameplay.
    But right now, we can judge what we saw, and im disappointed.
    Perhaps you should just play other games than 2K...
    Even on current gen. some (non sports) games have some kind of photorealistic render.
    They can call it next gen, you can bite it, sorry but not me.
    2K use to reuse the same faces textures in 1024px or 2048px ; same textures for the arenas (256px or 512px since 2K9).
    Watch the first video, Zion at the PS5 launch. Here and now, we're far from that and closest to current gen.
    The lighting is slightly better, the animations looks better, but you can see that CP3, Beverley, Adam models and textures are the same.
    Its a f****ing bball game 5vs5 in an closed arena with a crowd full of generic people. Dont tell me that these new consoles cant deliver more....
    I am really hoping the screens are improved. I am tired of being screened to death as a PG every defensive possession so the PG can shoot a green 3. At the very least, call more illegal screens. Players should have to actually set up. Not just keep smashing B and suck you into an animation.
    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Jesus...I wonder what some of yall expect 2k to be like 10 years from now...hell 5 years.
    The more I want the game to be so realistic the more I realize its a video game. So I try to enjoy it for what it is...
    entertainment that doesn't involve my wife and in-laws...Thank you 2k lol
    Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
    dvir10
    Am I the only one who was p***** off to see DLO contact dunk?!

    yeah, the one with the left hand? you simply can't jump as high after being bumped a coupld of times like that, balance isn't optimal and you can't get as much thrust, would have been much better if it was a lay-up attempt.
    I also noticed 2 other things - the screen video you can see 3-point shooter dunkan robinson with his hands on his hips!!!!,... normally I wouldn't care, but in that situation with the ball on the perimeter he should be ready for a pass #1 and #2, IF he did get a pass, he'd have some weird ash animation to go from lounging around pose to receiving a pass. He looks like it's a time-out!
    The Lopez block - the player who got his shot blocked will get the ball and probably get a bunny. His momentum should just take him out of the play, or make him lose balance and drift out of bounds because too many people who just get demoralized GET THE BALL BACK in too many previous 2k's... I know it happens sometimes in real life, but these vids are cherry picked. IRL Lopez would have knocked it further away or the player would have too much momentum going to the wrong way - not recover his ball after attempting a layup.
    So aside from those 2 things and the contact dunk, I'm actually pretty excited, it's just a bit odd to make such a deliberate choice, choosing those particular videos that show weaknesses like that.
    edit- I forgot to add, I have different gripes than most - one of my biggest is that a user controlled player seems like is boxing out from an offensive rebound 95% of the time regardless of team of player position. They suction you in and you can't get away even with worm and other badges. My favourite play in basketball might be the rebound dunk and it's been next to impossible until 2k20 but even then it's a bit too hard and rare because it happens more irl than in the game. My boy Nik Stuaskas even did it to the raptors so with guards it should be a little easier to crash because it's not the smartest thing to do most of the time. NO MORE SUCTION BOX OUTS PLS
    This what I always try to remember about games...
    Developers (NOT the corp heads) will have the "best intentions" when it comes to making games, but it's the GAMERS that determine if the new changes were good or not. Gamers have a bad habit of always trying to break the game or find as many exploits/cheats as possible. It's like no one picks up a controller to have fun and play within the intended "vision" of the game.
    Mike Wang is posting and writing about what he genuinely believe are game changers for next-gen NBA 2K21. When it gets into the hands of the consumers, that's when we'll see if the game holds up to what they "promised".
    stickyfingers
    Its a f****ing bball game 5vs5 in an closed arena with a crowd full of generic people. Dont tell me that these new consoles cant deliver more....

    How many game developers of ANY genre have been able to "max out" the power of next-gen consoles on Day 1?
    I'm pretty confident that the new consoles CAN deliver more, but we probably won't see the "big" changes until we're further along in the consoles' life cycle.
    So on one hand I understand what you are saying. 2k says similar things almost every year "less canned animations, more control, more responsiveness, more realistic movement, etc."
    But on the other hand these are all areas of the game that need to improve and evolve. The next-gen power should help. No one should take this blog as indication that all these problems have been fixed and solved but it should be encouraging that 2k has put focus and effort into these areas.
    And in regards to 2k14 it's not like they lied. The areas they said were improved were indeed improved compared to the current gen version of 2k14, it just wasn't a perfect solution to foot planting, movement, and animations.
    scottyp180

    So on one hand I understand what you are saying. 2k says similar things almost every year "less canned animations, more control, more responsiveness, more realistic movement, etc."
    But on the other hand these are all areas of the game that need to improve and evolve. The next-gen power should help. No one should take this blog as indication that all these problems have been fixed and solved but it should be encouraging that 2k has put focus and effort into these areas.

    And in regards to 2k14 it's not like they lied. The areas they said were improved were indeed improved compared to the current gen version of 2k14, it just wasn't a perfect solution to foot planting, movement, and animations.

    Quoted for Truth.
    ataman5
    I've stated the same in another thread, come on guys, you should be a bit more wiser than this, come on!!
    Looks like we should have had it 7 years ago... This is all bluh bluh guyss.. don't fall it, not anymore, please just a bit of memory, that's all....
    From 2013, below..
    https://twitter.com/ronnie2k/status/393116931756023808

    internette fotoğraf paylaşma
    Isn't that enough? You want some more here ya go..
    https://blog.playstation.com/2013/11/06/nba-2k14s-eco-motion-engine-brings-players-to-life-on-ps4/
    Still not enough you need more? I got ya...
    https://forums.operationsports.com/features/2322/nba-2k16-gameplay-blog-with-mike-wang/
    Just a bit of memory will help us all...
    You probably posted the worst two examples, lol
    The next gen port, which showed clear changes and 2K16, which is probably 1 or 2 on most peoples greatest 2K's of all time, and probably had the best footplanting of the series.
    I think its smart to be skeptical.
    but "our engineers worked on this..." doesnt mean that "this feature will translate and evolve flawlessly based on each gamers expectation"
    Absolutely hold 2k accountable. At the same time I think we should reasonable.
    Until people can get they hands on this game and play for themselves, I think judging the game based off these small sample clips and articles isn't the best way to get a fair assessment of how well the game will play. Everything said so far sounds good, the graphics look good, lighting is great in my opinion but until my hands can touch the controls and play for myself I hold out any negative judgment other than that Jimmy Butler from the angle shown might not have a good rendered face scan.
    "Sliding in basketball is no good. But it’s something we’ve had to live with in the past because of limitations in technology."
    This isn't true and it makes no sense. There was no sliding on NBA 2k7 or 2k8 on the 360.
    2k9 was unplayable due to the fact they made the computer be able to guard anyone off the dribble. So no one would guard anyone. Sort of like now. No one guards anyone online because your sliding all over the place.
    I still play 2k8. The reason. It was the last release of a NBA2k game where I felt like I was actually dribbling in real time on the court. No delay on offense or defense.
    They are continuing to do an A+ job with their sales pitch. Many of my biggest issues with the game have been addressed in the first two blogs but it will all come down to raw gameplay videos and when people finally get their hands on the game. I hope 2K will walk the walk after talking the talk.
    A lot the "games other than 2k" are also only running at 30fps on consoles. The only 60fps console games I can think of that have an argument in the visual department is the newer COD and Doom Eternal. Not sure how you could compare either of those games to 2k and come to a conclusion of what a next gen 2k should be capable of.
    And let's focus on next-gen games. What next-gen game have you seen that is definitively better looking than 2K? I've seen people say 2k should look better. I've seen people say other next gen games should look better. Yet besides the Unreal 5 demo there is no proof of exactly what these consoles should be capable of at their peaks. You can speculate all you want but it means nothing if you can't prove that these games are indeed capable of more at this point.
    And you do realize that with a crowd full of people even adding a little detail and improvement to those models means hundreds of models will be rendered with higher quality? That alone makes a difference unless you prefer photorealism on the court while everyone off court looks like they belong in a game from 2 or 3 generations ago.
    scottyp180

    A lot the "games other than 2k" are also only running at 30fps on consoles. The only 60fps console games I can think of that have an argument in the visual department is the newer COD and Doom Eternal. Not sure how you could compare either of those games to 2k and come to a conclusion of what a next gen 2k should be capable of.
    And let's focus on next-gen games. What next-gen game have you seen that is definitively better looking than 2K? I've seen people say 2k should look better. I've seen people say other next gen games should look better. Yet besides the Unreal 5 demo there is no proof of exactly what these consoles should be capable of at their peaks. You can speculate all you want but it means nothing if you can't prove that these games are indeed capable of more at this point.
    And you do realize that with a crowd full of people even adding a little detail and improvement to those models means hundreds of models will be rendered with higher quality? That alone makes a difference unless you prefer photorealism on the court while everyone off court looks like they belong in a game from 2 or 3 generations ago.

    I think Dirt 5 had some leaked gameplay footage a couple of days ago.
    What do people even want, exactly ? Why even keep playing it if no matter what you’re gonna say they aren’t changing enough or you heard it all before?
    Eman5805
    What do people even want, exactly ? Why even keep playing it if no matter what you’re gonna say they aren’t changing enough or you heard it all before?

    Exactly!
    I'm keeping an open mind about the game, and any game launching with the next-gen consoles. I just find it hard to believe that ANYONE is going to play NBA 2K21 on the PS5 or XBSX and be like "Oh! This is just NBA 2K21.6!". Truthfully, COD might be the only game that will have the biggest chance of impressing people with graphics. The graphics in COD:MW campaign mode looked good on the XB1X in 4K and with HDR activated.
    I'll probably post gameplay footage on release day, but it will be a while. I have to drive to another city to get my XBSX, and I still have to download the game when I get home.
    ksuttonjr76
    How many game developers of ANY genre have been able to "max out" the power of next-gen consoles on Day 1?

    2K ... for 2K14 PS4/XB1
    another era unfortunately
    scottyp180
    And you do realize that with a crowd full of people even adding a little detail and improvement to those models means hundreds of models will be rendered with higher quality?

    its not my point at all.
    My point was it's a 5vs5 game in an closed arena and the crowd is generic. Dont tell me that the next gen consoles havent the resources to manage better graphics which means better 3D models (more polygons), higher textures resolution. And obviously, they reuse LOT of current gen stuff.
    And dont tell me it's the physics engine that eat all resources, i could bring you a lot of simulators (plane, cars) with realistic physics and better graphics too.
    stickyfingers
    2K ... for 2K14 PS4/XB1
    another era unfortunately
    its not my point at all.
    My point was it's a 5vs5 game in an closed arena and the crowd is generic. Dont tell me that the next gen consoles havent the resources to manage better graphics which means better 3D models (more polygons), higher textures resolution. And obviously, they reuse LOT of current gen stuff.
    And dont tell me it's the physics engine that eat all resources, i could bring you a lot of simulators (plane, cars) with realistic physics and better graphics too.

    NBA 2K14? You do realize that NBA 2K14 was barebones too?
    You do realize that the crowd takes up game resources? To be fair and given that it's a new game, we don't know if the crowd is a "technical/effort"
    or resource problem.
    ksuttonjr76
    Soooooooooo...are you staying that NBA 2K14 played exactly the same on the PS3 and PS4? Are you stating that there was zero improvements made and that game didn't take advantage of the new technology?

    We're in 2k21 on current-gen? What do you think about the last 7 years in terms of improvements? Ofcourse in 7 years anyhting and everyhting can/may improve, if it's enough for you and them saying one iteration after another the same things you keep buying into this, i'm all good with; i buy the game every year,too not with what they promise though. That's what i'm giving attention to.
    The 24th Letter
    You probably posted the worst two examples, lol
    The next gen port, which showed clear changes and 2K16, which is probably 1 or 2 on most peoples greatest 2K's of all time, and probably had the best footplanting of the series.
    I think its smart to be skeptical.
    but "our engineers worked on this..." doesnt mean that "this feature will translate and evolve flawlessly based on each gamers expectation"
    Absolutely hold 2k accountable. At the same time I think we should reasonable.

    24TH you're better than that is it possible that i just think about one iteration or anything over another or comparing anything within 7 games they released in this gen? I'm giving numerous wordings through the years of NBA 2K blogs from different sources... We should be able to see 7 years of improvements on that part! Do you see a 7 years of improvement? And 2k16 is one of my favorite,too; so what do we come up with now, really?
    And i'm not even trying to hold anyone accountable or anything, i'm just saying what i'm saying, truth is there, the work is there, the words are there as consumers, anyone or everyone needs to pay more attention to some stuff before capitalizing or giving me the eyebrows, my friends. :)
    scottyp180

    So on one hand I understand what you are saying. 2k says similar things almost every year "less canned animations, more control, more responsiveness, more realistic movement, etc."
    But on the other hand these are all areas of the game that need to improve and evolve. The next-gen power should help. No one should take this blog as indication that all these problems have been fixed and solved but it should be encouraging that 2k has put focus and effort into these areas.
    And in regards to 2k14 it's not like they lied. The areas they said were improved were indeed improved compared to the current gen version of 2k14, it just wasn't a perfect solution to foot planting, movement, and animations.

    Sorry but have i mentioned or said anyhting about anyones lying anywhere at all? Would you please take a look at my post again?
    On the other that's what i'm saying,too that's all for the 2nd paragraph. Nothings will be fixed especially if it's 2k talking about it. Don't buy into that thinking all the problems will be solved, it's just they like to word it all these things all the time... So these blogs are ofcourse 'after all those years' are bluh bluh...
    Things sound good. But I'm just trying to see some unedited gameplay. They say things like warping and sliding have been reduced but I've already seen them in these clips they're showcasing. If this is a showcase then I'm expecting gameplay to be worse.
    Also, I'm wondering how those haptic triggers on the PS5 controller are going to hold up over time. I now people are going to be squeezing tf out of those triggers lol.
    I’m hyped to get my copy day 1. I’m a half full kinda guy so I’ll keep it positive unless there is something game breaking. Less than 30 days, let’s go!
    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    ataman5
    We're in 2k21 on current-gen? What do you think about the last 7 years in terms of improvements? Ofcourse in 7 years anyhting and everyhting can/may improve, if it's enough for you and them saying one iteration after another the same things you keep buying into this, i'm all good with; i buy the game every year,too not with what they promise though. That's what i'm giving attention to.

    NBA 2K20 (Last game I purchased) is a vastly different game than NBA 2K14. The sheer volume of modes available can attest to that. Animations, graphics, movement, etc. Now, I'm not a lighting person, so I really don't care about that, but the overall game has improved.
    ksuttonjr76
    NBA 2K20 (Last game I purchased) is a vastly different game than NBA 2K14. The sheer volume of modes available can attest to that. Animations, graphics, movement, etc. Now, I'm not a lighting person, so I really don't care about that, but the overall game has improved.

    This is a gameplay blog ksutton, i'm not talking about any modes or animations or graphics, right.
    ksuttonjr76
    NBA 2K14? You do realize that NBA 2K14 was barebones too?
    You do realize that the crowd takes up game resources? To be fair and given that it's a new game, we don't know if the crowd is a "technical/effort"
    or resource problem.

    2K14 was my answer to the point that, yes, devs can release something top noch at a new console' start.
    My point about the crowd is it's generic crowd, repeated low res textures and repeated low lod 3d models, it cant be an excuse.
    So we're left with 10 players, 1 ball and an arena.
    Again, watch the other games (specially open worlds). On graphics, there's no excuse for me, the game should be better.
    "Gameplay" ? we cant see a lot from the new videos, except that the players still slide.
    For the other Gameplay announcements, we cant really see right now from the little 2K shows us.
    ataman5
    This is a gameplay blog ksutton, i'm not talking about any modes or animations or graphics, right.
    You asked me about the 7 years of improvement....either way, the gameplay has improved over the years.
    stickyfingers
    2K ... for 2K14 PS4/XB1
    another era unfortunately
    its not my point at all.
    My point was it's a 5vs5 game in an closed arena and the crowd is generic. Dont tell me that the next gen consoles havent the resources to manage better graphics which means better 3D models (more polygons), higher textures resolution. And obviously, they reuse LOT of current gen stuff.
    And dont tell me it's the physics engine that eat all resources, i could bring you a lot of simulators (plane, cars) with realistic physics and better graphics too.

    So by your logic the UFC games should probably look better than just about any other game on the market since it's 1v1, closed arena, and dark lighting on everything outside the octagon. Yet I'd say the visuals are pretty standard for current gen. That's to say the UFC games look good, they definitely look like current gen games, but they aren't the benchmark for graphics. Using the argument of "it's a closed arena, 5v5, generic crowd" holds no weight when a game like UFC is dealing with less and still doesn't look any better than current gen 2k or anything else on the market.
    You aren't seriously comparing emulating the physics of cars and planes to human movement are you? Two entirely different things. Racing simulators are almost always at the forefront of photorealism for consoles. There's a big difference between emulating the physical makeup of a mechanical object such as a car compared to a living, flesh covered organism. And that's just the physical appearance, not the animation process which is entirely different. We've seen cars move realistically for generations now, yet developers are still struggling to get life like human movement during gameplay.
    stickyfingers
    2K14 was my answer to the point that, yes, devs can release something top noch at a new console' start.
    My point about the crowd is it's generic crowd, repeated low res textures and repeated low lod 3d models, it cant be an excuse.
    So we're left with 10 players, 1 ball and an arena.
    Again, watch the other games (specially open worlds). On graphics, there's no excuse for me, the game should be better.
    "Gameplay" ? we cant see a lot from the new videos, except that the players still slide.
    For the other Gameplay announcements, we cant really see right now from the little 2K shows us.

    Okay, NBA 2K14 was a solid next-gen game, so I won't take nothing from it; however, the game still made progressive stepd with some rough spots.
    What other next-gen games with a yearly release are you comparing NBA 2K to? Computer mods DON'T count.
    ataman5

    24TH you're better than that is it possible that i just think about one iteration or anything over another or comparing anything within 7 games they released in this gen? I'm giving numerous wordings through the years of NBA 2K blogs from different sources... We should be able to see 7 years of improvements on that part! Do you see a 7 years of improvement? And 2k16 is one of my favorite,too; so what do we come up with now, really?
    And i'm not even trying to hold anyone accountable or anything, i'm just saying what i'm saying, truth is there, the work is there, the words are there as consumers, anyone or everyone needs to pay more attention to some stuff before capitalizing or giving me the eyebrows, my friends. :)
    ...

    Did you think older 2K blogs were a smoking gun or something? I'm not sure what you're getting at. A lot if us have been around since they first started coming out. It's not new information..at all. We know certain specs of the game have been LONG standing works in progress and reinvented multiple times.
    In a perfect world, sure....the game should improve in every way every single year. In the real world, that's not always the case. 2K12 is my least favorite 2K of that generation, it followed my (and many others) favorite 2K of that generation.
    Does that make 2K12's blog "bluh bluh" or is it possible the developers ideas of improvements in certain areas didn't align with mine or the communities? We've seen multiple systems be retooled. Some hit, some miss.
    but its like I said, I'm not trying to rally anyone to get excited or change any viewpoints. I'm not necessarily brimming with excitement myself. 5 on 5 gameplay will sell me on everything.
    Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk
    Only complaint I have from this is look at Duncan robinson and jae crowder in the corner. They're both standing straight up like it's a break in action. Duncan even puts his hand on his hip.
    ataman5

    Sorry but have i mentioned or said anyhting about anyones lying anywhere at all? Would you please take a look at my post again?
    On the other that's what i'm saying,too that's all for the 2nd paragraph. Nothings will be fixed especially if it's 2k talking about it. Don't buy into that thinking all the problems will be solved, it's just they like to word it all these things all the time... So these blogs are ofcourse 'after all those years' are bluh bluh...

    I'm having a hard time following you. First you say that you aren't calling anyone a liar but go on to say "Nothings will be fixed especially if it's 2k talking about it." Sorry but it sounds like you are saying don't trust or believe anything 2K says, which isn't far off from saying they're lying.
    But I think I get your point. I still remember the year where they talked about arena specific sounds and atmosphere. How there would be real life chants for home teams. How the sound of the ball hitting the rim would differ depending on the arena. 2k wasn't exactly lying but they definitely hyped it up more than it should have been. I think a lot of us were expecting the most realistic atmosphere in a basketball game but it felt more like a minor improvements when playing the game (can't remember which year this was).
    Basically what it comes down to is that while 2K is probably trying to make the best basketball game they can make they are also selling a product for a brand new generation of consoles and they need to make is sound as good as possible. People should be excited just don't completely buy into the marketing hype. It's not much different than any other product.
    scottyp180
    You aren't seriously comparing emulating the physics of cars and planes to human movement are you? Two entirely different things. Racing simulators are almost always at the forefront of photorealism for consoles. There's a big difference between emulating the physical makeup of a mechanical object such as a car compared to a living, flesh covered organism. And that's just the physical appearance, not the animation process which is entirely different. We've seen cars move realistically for generations now, yet developers are still struggling to get life like human movement during gameplay.

    2 parts here :
    About emulating physics i think its totally different but not easier.
    Dont underestimate a racing simulation physics : aerodynamics, ground effect, power, weight of the cars, physics of each part of the cars (tires, suspensions, wings), collision management, tire grip regarding the track's surface, weather. And the console should compute this for 19-35 cars on a wide area.
    While (at least on current) 2K still cant emulate properly the physics of the ball, the collision between the players, the way they just move.
    The new motion engine (2k18/21) is worse than the previous one, the players dont run like a real human at all (while it was ok on last gen and on 2K14-17). So IMO, excuse of old gen provided isnt valid.
    About physical appearance, compare to other games with humans, any open world for the last 5 years for exemple. Ok, its not basketball, but its still humans who jump, fight, roll etc...
    You want sports games, PES21 on current gen in 4K looks better IMO
    EurozDontFogertTheZ
    Only complaint I have from this is look at Duncan robinson and jae crowder in the corner. They're both standing straight up like it's a break in action. Duncan even puts his hand on his hip.

    lol oh you caught that too...yea that will not be in the final game I can almost assure you of that...but it was weird seeing that though ...
    but after reading all the comments so far I do get both sides of the coin some are disappointed and majority are optimistic with a slight mix of scepticism....
    This is not an " I hate 2k and I want what I want Thread nor place for that...that approach helps none so guys with the strong displeasure just pipe it down a bit and just try to convey structural criticism and not so much the mud slinging....
    here is the long and short ...when it comes to our beloved basketball fix on a yearly basis, options is a choice removed when EA can not for the love of the basketball gods make a viable competitive game to 2k, hence 2k alone stands..we all have our pet peeves and share strong ties and emotions in the outcome of this game...but saying things like this doesn't look next gen or this is the same game, is blatantly far deviated from the truth and disingenuous...but we have to all admit that to ourselves at some point going forward...so hate it or love it, it's all we got. let's help make it better together!
    now with that out the way...one thing am sure like me you guys are looking forward to are those no call layup/ dunk collisions that leads to turnovers and missed layup/dunk attempts...
    The way I look at it, graphics in the year 2020 on PS4/Xbox1 are already insane! Yes I do expect the next gen graphics to take a step forward, but not that much since I do believe that the graphics are top notch already. I think we need to keep in mind that these are video games.
    I just hope the gameplay has a new feel to it and that they just add a ton of new features to ALL game modes and tweak all of their bugs.
    I do hope that they create a new immersive experience for MyLeagueOnline.
    stickyfingers
    2 parts here :
    About emulating physics i think its totally different but not easier.
    Dont underestimate a racing simulation physics : aerodynamics, ground effect, power, weight of the cars, physics of each part of the cars (tires, suspensions, wings), collision management, tire grip regarding the track's surface, weather. And the console should compute this for 19-35 cars on a wide area.
    While (at least on current) 2K still cant emulate properly the physics of the ball, the collision between the players, the way they just move.
    The new motion engine (2k18/21) is worse than the previous one, the players dont run like a real human at all (while it was ok on last gen and on 2K14-17). So IMO, excuse of old gen provided isnt valid.
    About physical appearance, compare to other games with humans, any open world for the last 5 years for exemple. Ok, its not basketball, but its still humans who jump, fight, roll etc...
    You want sports games, PES21 on current gen in 4K looks better IMO

    Couldnt disagree more about PES21 looking better. To each their own.
    From some of these responses it might just be time for some folks to take a break from the series ....I had to do it with madden....-kanye shrug-
    Anyway...
    Good Blog Mike!! I cant wait to see this stuff in game!
    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
    CujoMatty
    Couldnt disagree more about PES21 looking better. To each their own.

    I just clicked on the link...
    Maybe because I don't play soccer games, but those looked like some clunky animations when the players were transitioning from one action to another.
    EDIT: Off-topic, but I think FIFA 21 has the smoother and better looking animations.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7digVj3F3T0
    both are close for few years, but the thing was to point a 4K video of a current gen sport game with graphics and animation not so far than 2K21 NG.
    about videos, here the mini videos compiled in 4K
    dwnz
    I'd have more faith in this blog regarding foot-planting if we hadn't already seen the sliding issues such as Jarrett Allen on the right here: https://cdn.2kgames.com/nba/nba2k20/video/2KVID_NBA2K21_CourtsideReports_ShotMeter_1920x1080_V2.mp4
    Until the game is released, regardless of what they say I can only assume this is how the game will actually play, which to me still leaves a lot of room for improvement.

    And at the 7 second mark of the mini-clip video, I liked the way Mitchell realistically stopped on a dime....
    Quentin32
    I forgot what the thread was about lol
    I don’t envy being a 2k dev at all lol
    I couldn't be one. I would mess around and fly in 10 random people, sit them in front of a computer, them tell them to create the game better than us.
    stickyfingers
    Not excited at all.
    Graphics are even worse than i thought after the first trailer.
    Definitly not next gen level. You can see that a lot of CFs of current gen are reused.
    You can also clearly see that sliding is still there despite excuse like "Sliding in basketball is no good. But it’s something we’ve had to live with in the past because of limitations in technology"
    2k14/15/16 dont have this big issue which appeared in fact with the new motion engine.
    Everything isnt bad, those new animations movements look better, and "less canned interactions and doing a better job of respecting user control" sounds better too
    but it's not the big step i expected for the next gen.
    You need glasses.
    Sent from my SM-N960U using Operation Sports mobile app
    ksuttonjr76
    What I would like to know is...
    What is this mythical game that's the gold standard for what a next-gen looks and plays like?

    Bruh is 2k paying you to hype the game, or is this beluba’s burner? People can have their opinions on the game without you needing to defend your opinion vs theirs at every chance. This whole thread is you arguing with different people’s opinion every 3rd post.
    I agree with most, it looks pretty good, but not a huge leap in terms of graphics or movement. Maybe it’ll change with more gameplay videos, but as of now, that’s my opinion.
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
    ksuttonjr76
    What I would like to know is...
    What is this mythical game that's the gold standard for what a next-gen looks and plays like?

    Bruh is 2k paying you to hype the game, or is this beluba’s burner? People can have their opinions on the game without you needing to defend your opinion vs theirs at every chance. This whole thread is you arguing with different people’s opinion every 3rd post.
    I agree with most, it looks pretty good, but not a huge leap in terms of graphics or movement. Maybe it’ll change with more gameplay videos, but as of now, that’s my opinion.
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
    sva91
    Bruh is 2k paying you to hype the game, or is this beluba’s burner? People can have their opinions on the game without you needing to defend your opinion vs theirs at every chance. This whole thread is you arguing with different people’s opinion every 3rd post.
    I agree with most, it looks pretty good, but not a huge leap in terms of graphics or movement. Maybe it’ll change with more gameplay videos, but as of now, that’s my opinion.
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

    It's simple question...people are saying it's "not next-gen", so I want to know what is THE game that embodies the next-gen gaming experience? I mean...to make that comment, a person would have to have a point of reference, right?
    Right now, the people who are not impressed are using the belief that the developers SHOULD be able to do more, and not if they can. Big difference.
    The 24th Letter
    Did you think older 2K blogs were a smoking gun or something? I'm not sure what you're getting at. A lot if us have been around since they first started coming out. It's not new information..at all. We know certain specs of the game have been LONG standing works in progress and reinvented multiple times.
    In a perfect world, sure....the game should improve in every way every single year. In the real world, that's not always the case. 2K12 is my least favorite 2K of that generation, it followed my (and many others) favorite 2K of that generation.
    Does that make 2K12's blog "bluh bluh" or is it possible the developers ideas of improvements in certain areas didn't align with mine or the communities? We've seen multiple systems be retooled. Some hit, some miss.
    but its like I said, I'm not trying to rally anyone to get excited or change any viewpoints. I'm not necessarily brimming with excitement myself. 5 on 5 gameplay will sell me on everything.
    Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

    First of all, I'm trying my best not to turn this into one n one nor personal..
    Second of all following 2k11 to 2k12, it shouldn't have been the least favorite of all time of (yours) that generation and nobody i mean; NObody should have come up with excuses for the game on the consumer side, i and nobody should be caring what they had in mind and how they couldn't realize into the game to fulfill them, we pay full we should get full and improved otherwise why would i buy year after year for a roster update? Don't you see a problem here at all? And it can even regress... After all those years of 'bluh bluh' again... :)
    You say 'in a perfect world' to come up with excuses for the games regressions, one iteration to another and its devs lack of; isn't that already an acceptance of what i already say as well? Which is 'guys, don't expect what they say will be.' ? And also it should be a perfect world for 2k because they release the game for a perfect full price yearly. Which i don't care about paying full, personally as i told b4 i buy the game no matter what..(At least until now...)
    These things i say are not to point out to anyone or to 2k devs just as twitter does these days.
    I've played basketball games for the last 30 years at least if my memory serves right so, i know when i see a fundamental improvement to the game and i know when to expect pure 'bluh bluh' out of blogs already..
    And why would you think that i'm trying to get anywhere? When you don't expect 2k to get anywhere year after year with full AAA games?(2k12 excuses)
    These are all part of a thinking process, some gets some won't.. That's life this what i'm after, that's how you really improve a game or not.
    ksuttonjr76
    And at the 7 second mark of the mini-clip video, I liked the way Mitchell realistically stopped on a dime....

    In the marketing material specifically used to emphasize the improvement, sure. But when they're not trying to show that improvement (such as in the clip I posted) we can see its still happening.
    ForeverVersatile
    I think the PC players are getting mad because the console version is looking as good if not better than mods they use.
    *Edit i removed pic because the upload makes it blurry.
    Sent from my SM-N960U using Operation Sports mobile app

    do you realize that you compare a next gen game vs a current modded game ? absolute non sense.
    dwnz
    In the marketing material specifically used to emphasize the improvement, sure. But when they're not trying to show that improvement (such as in the clip I posted) we can see its still happening.

    Does anyone here know how often the sliding happens in the game?
    ksuttonjr76
    Does anyone here know how often the sliding happens in the game?

    How often? I'm not sure how you'd measure that, but from watching the gameplay trailer and the videos from blog 1, there are several instances of it.
    ataman5
    First of all, I'm trying my best not to turn this into one n one nor personal..
    Second of all following 2k11 to 2k12, it shouldn't have been the least favorite of all time of (yours) that generation and nobody i mean; NObody should have come up with excuses for the game on the consumer side, i and nobody should be caring what they had in mind and how they couldn't realize into the game to fulfill them, we pay full we should get full and improved otherwise why would i buy year after year for a roster update? Don't you see a problem here at all? And it can even regress... After all those years of 'bluh bluh' again... :)
    You say 'in a perfect world' to come up with excuses for the games regressions, one iteration to another and its devs lack of; isn't that already an acceptance of what i already say as well? Which is 'guys, don't expect what they say will be.' ? And also it should be a perfect world for 2k because they release the game for a perfect full price yearly. Which i don't care about paying full, personally as i told b4 i buy the game no matter what..(At least until now...)
    These things i say are not to point out to anyone or to 2k devs just as twitter does these days.
    I've played basketball games for the last 30 years at least if my memory serves right so, i know when i see a fundamental improvement to the game and i know when to expect pure 'bluh bluh' out of blogs already..
    And why would you think that i'm trying to get anywhere? When you don't expect 2k to get anywhere year after year with full AAA games?(2k12 excuses)
    These are all part of a thinking process, some gets some won't.. That's life this what i'm after, that's how you really improve a game or not.

    You made a general post on a forum, you got responses. Its never personal. It's just the internet.
    I literally have no idea what you're trying to convey here ....so I'll leave it alone. From what I could understand, you won't be paying full price for the game anymore. That's probably for the best. Seems like you haven't enjoyed it in a while. Good luck either way...
    dwnz
    I'd have more faith in this blog regarding foot-planting if we hadn't already seen the sliding issues such as Jarrett Allen on the right here: https://cdn.2kgames.com/nba/nba2k20/video/2KVID_NBA2K21_CourtsideReports_ShotMeter_1920x1080_V2.mp4
    Until the game is released, regardless of what they say I can only assume this is how the game will actually play, which to me still leaves a lot of room for improvement.

    Good point. Looks like a glitch though...hopefully it is.
    sva91
    Bruh is 2k paying you to hype the game, or is this beluba’s burner? People can have their opinions on the game without you needing to defend your opinion vs theirs at every chance. This whole thread is you arguing with different people’s opinion every 3rd post.
    I agree with most, it looks pretty good, but not a huge leap in terms of graphics or movement. Maybe it’ll change with more gameplay videos, but as of now, that’s my opinion.
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

    I think KSuttonjr76's point is valid - and none of the people complaining have tried to answer it. Which next gen launch game should 2K21 be measured against? Which launch game is the next gen standard bearer?
    Spiderman Miles Morales?
    Ratchet and Clank?
    Godfall?
    Dark Souls?
    I don't know all the launch titles but these are the big releases I'm aware of that people seem most excited about. Imo none of them represent some huge transformative leap the bulk of those complaining seem to be expecting of 2K21. EA hasn't even bothered to show so much as a screenshot of next gen Madden or Fifa to my knowledge - less than a month away from their release - so who knows what those titles will be.
    But 2K merits getting flack? They're putting out blogs, giving out info... the only next gen title that may be putting out more info is Spiderman MM. But I wouldn't say that game is some generational leap beyond the original Spiderman. Neither are any of the other titles I noted. 2K21 should be compared to it's peer launch games, not some imagined standard by people that likely have no clue what it takes to develop software, let alone a videogame.
    There was a pretty bad slide by the defense in the second Curry finishing vid from the first blog as well. I'm honestly surprised it wasn't mentioned here. Its moreso relevant to this blog because it makes me worry "crowd" contests still aren't still in the game and finishes are still "latching" to the person in front of them.
    this thread sure is entertaining.
    I dont know what people are expecting out of the next gen consoles. I Think the folks that dont appreciate the next gen graphics and gameplay footage are probably folks who have 4k television, and play the current gen on max settings.
    For me the graphics are a nice leap forward from current gen. the game play clips look nice as well.
    The 24th Letter
    There was a pretty bad slide by the defense in the second Curry finishing vid from the first blog as well. I'm honestly surprised it wasn't mentioned here. Its moreso relevant to this blog because it makes me worry "crowd" contests still aren't still in the game and finishes are still "latching" to the person in front of them.

    Oddly enough, I saw it originally, then I was like..meh, Curry was heading towards the shot blocker anyways. It was going to be a contest no matter what.
    tril
    this thread sure is entertaining.
    I dont know what people are expecting out of the next gen consoles. I Think the folks that dont appreciate the next gen graphics and gameplay footage are probably folks who have 4k television, and play the current gen on max settings.
    For me the graphics are a nice leap forward from current gen. the game play clips look nice as well.
    I'm convinced people were somehow expecting photo realism
    Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
    spankdatazz22
    I think KSuttonjr76's point is valid - and none of the people complaining have tried to answer it. Which next gen launch game should 2K21 be measured against? Which launch game is the next gen standard bearer?
    Spiderman Miles Morales?
    Ratchet and Clank?
    Godfall?
    Dark Souls?
    I don't know all the launch titles but these are the big releases I'm aware of that people seem most excited about. Imo none of them represent some huge transformative leap the bulk of those complaining seem to be expecting of 2K21. EA hasn't even bothered to show so much as a screenshot of next gen Madden or Fifa to my knowledge - less than a month away from their release - so who knows what those titles will be.
    But 2K merits getting flack? They're putting out blogs, giving out info... the only next gen title that may be putting out more info is Spiderman MM. But I wouldn't say that game is some generational leap beyond the original Spiderman. Neither are any of the other titles I noted. 2K21 should be compared to it's peer launch games, not some imagined standard by people that likely have no clue what it takes to develop software, let alone a videogame.

    His point is valid, but so is everyone else’s point. The fact that the ridiculously bad player models, NOT FACES, just player models, were untouched, is already a big red flag. They kept touting the game as “built from scratch” when the player models are still the exact same. I know for a fact they have the capabilities to at least improve the player models, but they did not. It takes a lot of the realism out, when these players have huge heads and little legs, and just look cartoonish.
    Nba live had amazing models, but the game wasn’t great. I just wanted to see an improvement in player models, and we got none. If enough people complain, maybe they’ll fix it, but I’d hate to be stuck with these models for this whole generation, just because people with no artistic sense think they look “good enough” or because it “doesn’t bother them”. No! This is one of the best selling games in the world. The essence of any NBA basketball game should be 5v5 in an NBA court. Fix that before you build a whole neighborhood with a barbershop and footlocker.
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
    sva91
    His point is valid, but so is everyone else’s point. The fact that the ridiculously bad player models, NOT FACES, just player models, were untouched, is already a big red flag. They kept touting the game as “built from scratch” when the player models are still the exact same. I know for a fact they have the capabilities to at least improve the player models, but they did not. It takes a lot of the realism out, when these players have huge heads and little legs, and just look cartoonish.
    Nba live had amazing models, but the game wasn’t great. I just wanted to see an improvement in player models, and we got none. If enough people complain, maybe they’ll fix it, but I’d hate to be stuck with these models for this whole generation, just because people with no artistic sense think they look “good enough” or because it “doesn’t bother them”. No! This is one of the best selling games in the world. The essence of any NBA basketball game should be 5v5 in an NBA court. Fix that before you build a whole neighborhood with a barbershop and footlocker.
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

    Maybe that's the artistic style they decided for the game?
    EDIT: Wait a minute...did you say that NBA Live had "amazing" models???
    Surprised at the amount of people that don’t realize the effect lighting alone is going to have on next gen. You can tell console gamers are so used to graphical leaps they are disappointed next gen doesn’t look better than real life.
    The models are about where they are gonna be with main improvements on details. Your big change in visual fidelity is going to be the lighting and smaller details this gen.
    If you’re coming into this gen expecting movie like graphics, you’re going to be disappointed.
    Sounds good but it always does. The games get better over time no doubt but we all know success is not linear. Hopefully Next gen 2k21 is a step forwards in contrast to what i believe were plateau steps with 2k20 & current gen 2k21.
    Its just encouraging to read that they are least making attempts to address the biggest issues with gameplay. If anything 2k is not afraid to tear something down and start over if their vision does not seem to be going as intended (2 or 3 new motion systems since 2k17) and this is what contributes to the plateau years in my opinion.
    With all that said the game is 1 month away and i have a feeling that it is going to be a solid iteration.
    Baebae32
    Sounds good but it always does. The games get better over time no doubt but we all know success is not linear. Hopefully Next gen 2k21 is a step forwards in contrast to what i believe were plateau steps with 2k20 & current gen 2k21.
    Its just encouraging to read that they are least making attempts to address the biggest issues with gameplay. If anything 2k is not afraid to tear something down and start over if their vision does not seem to be going as intended (2 or 3 new motion systems since 2k17) and this is what contributes to the plateau years in my opinion.
    With all that said the game is 1 month away and i have a feeling that it is going to be a solid iteration.

    Solid iteration for the first 1-2 weeks until Twitter/Reddit start whining....
    I swear, if I wasn't a PNO and now a REC player, I wouldn't accept a single game patch after launch.
    Hustle Westbrook
    What’s good with D-Lo doing that one hand Giannis dunk on Malcolm Brogdon though lmao?

    Irony was not lost in that sequence at all with that being the "Body Up" section lol. Great contact interaction on the floor between those two and then one of the least physical players in the league just barrels through a good defender for a contact dunk. Gah. Just have to hope that's on Pro-Casual
    I've been running 2K in 4K since NBA 2K18. The graphics shown here are still a nice leap above what's on current gen. However, I went in with realistic expectations... Not expecting the game to look like some ish straight off of black mirror.
    tril
    this thread sure is entertaining.
    I dont know what people are expecting out of the next gen consoles. I Think the folks that dont appreciate the next gen graphics and gameplay footage are probably folks who have 4k television, and play the current gen on max settings.
    For me the graphics are a nice leap forward from current gen. the game play clips look nice as well.

    Sent from my SM-N986U1 using Operation Sports mobile app
    Dione2014
    I've been running 2K in 4K since NBA 2K18. The graphics shown here are still a nice leap above what's on current gen. However, I went in with realistic expectations... Not expecting the game to look like some ish straight off of black mirror.
    Sent from my SM-N986U1 using Operation Sports mobile app

    Black Mirror literally put you in the game ;). That's what I want for my gaming experience.
    Looks good and sounds great. The hip ride animations look very similar to some other current gen titles. But sounds like we will be more in control here.
    Just make sure we can save roster files locally this time around.
    Very encouraging. They used the words “charging” and “blocking”... I almost shed a tear.
    If they can bring back the risk/reward to the dribble drive and finishing aspects of the game, then that’s a game changer. It’s long overdue.
    Can’t wait to see all of this in game action.
    The 24th Letter
    There was a pretty bad slide by the defense in the second Curry finishing vid from the first blog as well. I'm honestly surprised it wasn't mentioned here. Its moreso relevant to this blog because it makes me worry "crowd" contests still aren't still in the game and finishes are still "latching" to the person in front of them.
    I don't think that's the case since Brook Lopez got the block when Donovan was engaged in animation with Wes Matthews.

    Sent from my SM-N960U using Operation Sports mobile app
    youALREADYknow
    Very encouraging. They used the words “charging” and “blocking”... I almost shed a tear.
    If they can bring back the risk/reward to the dribble drive and finishing aspects of the game, then that’s a game changer. It’s long overdue.
    Can’t wait to see all of this in game action.

    The fact that defender positioning not being respected in 2k isnt talked about more astounds me. Imagine all the “cheese” that can mitigated with
    1.) being to consistently draw a simple charge
    2.) passing lanes and angles being taken away due to bodies being in the way
    ForeverVersatile
    They must be using some type of port of the engine(s) or similar techniques from NBA Live because I'm having a hard trying to distinguish the 2 from certain angles and animations. Thats a good and bad thing.
    Sent from my SM-N960U using Operation Sports mobile app

    Being one of the few resident Live lovers around here, I agree and it makes me happy.
    I think most people seemingly have a strong gag reflex at the mere mention of NBA Live but in reality they had a lot of great ideas. They were just mostly executed horribly.
    2k incorporating some of the ideas and improving on them would be fantastic in my books.
    ksuttonjr76
    Maybe that's the artistic style they decided for the game?
    EDIT: Wait a minute...did you say that NBA Live had "amazing" models???
    Bruh, Most of the guys who are arguing with you are dudes waiting for the return of NBA LIVE...smh.
    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
    This game looks like half ported graphics with next Gen gameplay.I know for a fact nobody had this same conversation about 2k14 PS4 looking the same as PS3 because everyone was drooling over how real Anthony Davis look in that trailer.
    CujoMatty
    Being one of the few resident Live lovers around here, I agree and it makes me happy.
    I think most people seemingly have a strong gag reflex at the mere mention of NBA Live but in reality they had a lot of great ideas. They were just mostly executed horribly.
    2k incorporating some of the ideas and improving on them would be fantastic in my books.
    I liked the dribbling when they brought in Scott OG back then and I've been asking Beluba for years to do dribbling like Live 10, with some 14-19 additions. I think that's where we're at now.
    Sent from my SM-N960U using Operation Sports mobile app
    simbayless
    This game looks like half ported graphics with next Gen gameplay.I know for a fact nobody had this same conversation about 2k14 PS4 looking the same as PS3 because everyone was drooling over how real Anthony Davis look in that trailer.

    It's different though. What you just described wasnt exclusive to NBA 2k14. The PS3 to PS4 jump in graphics is always going to be bigger than PS4 to PS5. I promise you that this will be a common theme with all PS5 games. There will be a lot of people saying they dont see a big difference for every game. Again people's expectations are the bigger problem here.
    WaddupCouzin
    Bruh, Most of the guys who are arguing with you are dudes waiting for the return of NBA LIVE...smh.
    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

    Pretty much proves my point lol. It took less than a page of comments after someone says anything good about NBA Live for their credibility or opinion to not matter anymore because they had the audacity of enjoying an inferior game for what it was. I promise you that every single developer of NBA 2k saw some good aspects in Live and vice versa.
    CujoMatty
    Pretty much proves my point lol. It took less than a page of comments after someone says anything good about NBA Live for their credibility or opinion to not matter anymore because they had the audacity of enjoying an inferior game for what it was. I promise you that every single developer of NBA 2k saw some good aspects in Live and vice versa.
    That's game development, period, but that wasn't My Point.
    When KS asked the question about who here has played the Next Gen Basketball Game, dude started chirping about player models and Live in a game he hasn't played yet. Some don't like the art style of the game and like Live's better, cool, but getting in each thread criticizing a game they haven't played when what they really want is LIVE, is wack.
    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
    I personally think the next gen footage looks fantastic and am really pleased. The detail, the clarity, the lighting, the atmosphere, the player movement, faces and likeness all look substantially better to me, and def a next gen leap in my eyes. I just think some of these people have no concept of the law of diminishing returns.
    WaddupCouzin
    That's game development, period, but that wasn't My Point.
    When KS asked the question about who here has played the Next Gen Basketball Game, dude started chirping about player models and Live in a game he hasn't played yet. Some don't like the art style of the game and like Live's better, cool, but getting in each thread criticizing a game they haven't played when what they really want is LIVE, is wack.
    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

    ahhhhhh gotcha.
    WaddupCouzin
    That's game development, period, but that wasn't My Point.
    When KS asked the question about who here has played the Next Gen Basketball Game, dude started chirping about player models and Live in a game he hasn't played yet. Some don't like the art style of the game and like Live's better, cool, but getting in each thread criticizing a game they haven't played when what they really want is LIVE, is wack.
    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
    To be fair, I did download NBA Live 19 to look at the player models. Honestly, they weren't bad. I just prefer the look of the NBA 2K games. Also, Live is a not terrible game. They're just not as "deep" as 2K's game. Hell, the number of moves that you can do in the post with the shot stick is incredible. To me, NBA Live is just a simple game that you just pick up and play real quick, but can't take serious.
    Plus, the green release notification in NBA 2K is like crack to some players.
    "Make sure to check out next week’s final gameplay Courtside Report as I reveal details about player builds, badges, takeover, and improvements to AI!"
    i saw that this will be for the final blog...
    1. but they didn't even address Fouls (like running for shooters) as they always past through them like ghost. (im talking about CPU not been called fouls)
    2. CPU CONSISTENT TIMEOUTS. at least 2 timeouts per quarter
    3. Adjusted shot from left to right hand (a more fluid animation or new animation and not the clanky one we have right now)
    4. New assist animation (realistically) pocket pass, drop pass, no more head pass when your 3 inch to the basket and every defender is there also.
    5. And also passing from driving to the basket this. i think there is animations here that really need to be look at, it doesn't look fluid and smooth at all. and CPU automatically change direction to still defend the catcher like a canned animation.
    6. A full edited NBA players from head to toe. because we dont want to wait months for an update.
    7. Subs rotation.
    8. Walking and standing still when dribbling ang killing the time.
    9. Waving hand or hand gestures when calling plays.
    10. realistic Speed transition on fastbreak for offense and defense
    11. altercation
    12. different Flagrant fouls ( spamming steals that hit the player in head or trying to contest late and not giving space for landing )
    13. Coach running on the floor to call timeout or complain for bad call
    14. A realistic NBA replay showing highlight, fouls ,turnover in 3 views and discussing it. whether on timeouts or charity shot.
    15 Player being down on the floor if ever injured or not some medic will check or player will check him.
    16. The BUBBLE????
    17. Arena and audience and sound. nothing was discuss with this also??
    18. Hair movement.
    This are just somethings that was never in previous NBA 2k that should be added to the game.
    ForeverVersatile
    Didn't you just say that the game doesn't look next-gen, so which one is it?

    And you're the one who told me to wear glasses..
    My arguments are same CFs / 3D models, same textures, slightly better lighting, but other games do better.
    Still waiting for yours...
    So I persist, this game doesnt look like NG.
    Like others have said, it all sounds nice, but these blogs have indeed failed to deliver in the past and did not translate to anything significant in the game. As an example: this claim of first time contact alley-oops, uhm that was there in the past, just better animated it seems from that Dwight Howard clip. I will stay skeptical. Built from the ground up is always funny to hear, but let's hope it's true and it's really groundbreaking.
    I still haven't heard anything addressing my main issues with the game: full control of passing - more styles, ways to throw, speed - defense AI of teammates, box out and fighting for position control, fast break AI which is tied to passing as well. Difference in speed as well. I still don't feel it makes that much difference if you're Westbrook for example, who should have explosive speed and should be able to run on a fast break much faster than 90% of other players. Nobody should be able to catch up or stop him cept for a handful of fast and or good defensive players.
    I couldn't care less how the game looks, hell current gen still looks pretty damn good.
    It's all about whether the animations and player interactions have advanced enough to remove all the cheese/exploits that ruin the game every year including (but not limited to):

    • screen spam and being sucked into screens
    • teleporting for rebounds
    • bad or non-existent transition defense
    • broken help defense
    • blocked shots going back to the offense 90% of the time

    etc. etc.
    Texture quality should be the least of people's worries, and while they say they are addressing many of the issues above, well we've heard all this before, haven't we?
    Hell they've even FIXED them before at various points before reverting them back to broken status to appease the whiny Twitter fools...
    Gameplay improvements don't mean anything if you just revert/remove them again several weeks after the game releases because people cry when their cheese doesn't work.
    based on the all the clips shown so far the gameplay doesn't really particularly look remarkable. Kinda unimpressive tbh :/
    I was hoping for an AI movement system like I've seen from some research papers, or at least something similar. These animations on next-gen still appear to be mocap animations that are a few seconds long at max and then blended from one animation to the next which is why it still doesn't appear seamless like the AI tech I mentioned earlier. Maybe it's still not viable for use in commercial projects idk, either way it sucks that we're gonna be stuck with this fundamentally old method for next-gen
    NoLeafClover
    I couldn't care less how the game looks, hell current gen still looks pretty damn good.
    It's all about whether the animations and player interactions have advanced enough to remove all the cheese/exploits that ruin the game every year including (but not limited to):

    • screen spam and being sucked into screens
    • teleporting for rebounds
    • bad or non-existent transition defense
    • broken help defense
    • blocked shots going back to the offense 90% of the time

    etc. etc.
    Texture quality should be the least of people's worries, and while they say they are addressing many of the issues above, well we've heard all this before, haven't we?
    Hell they've even FIXED them before at various points before reverting them back to broken status to appease the whiny Twitter fools...
    Gameplay improvements don't mean anything if you just revert/remove them again several weeks after the game releases because people cry when their cheese doesn't work.

    I would really like to see fatigue play a big factor. Damn the dribble gods and half court shots.
    Next week will be about badges and takeovers. Red flags to look for is when Mike mentions "balance" any where on the blog. We all know what "balance" means lol
    blocked shots going back to the offense 90% of the time

    eh...that block by Lopez most likely ended up in Mitchell's hands lol so I wouldn't be surprised in the least if the same problems we have now is going to next gen.
    I’m so happy that I can read something like this and have genuine excitement for a VIDEO GAME that brings me happiness and entertainment. Let’s go November 12th.
    Can’t wait!
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
    stickyfingers
    And you're the one who told me to wear glasses..
    My arguments are same CFs / 3D models, same textures, slightly better lighting, but other games do better.
    Still waiting for yours...
    So I persist, this game doesnt look like NG.

    Out of curiosity, of all the next generation games we’ve seen footage for, in your opinion, which looks better than 2K21??
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
    Ughh, i found out that NBA 2k21 won't have ray tracing on next gen version but it will run native 4k with 60 fps. that's all.. Madden NFL 21 will have ray tracing with native 4k and 60 fps
    michaelhawj
    Ughh, i found out that NBA 2k21 won't have ray tracing on next gen version but it will run native 4k with 60 fps. that's all.. Madden NFL 21 will have ray tracing with native 4k and 60 fps

    Where did u hear that ? Looks like it does in the trailer
    michaelhawj
    Ughh, i found out that NBA 2k21 won't have ray tracing on next gen version but it will run native 4k with 60 fps. that's all.. Madden NFL 21 will have ray tracing with native 4k and 60 fps

    You can't spout **** without providing source. If it's a youtuber then he's not credible since he got it from another youtuber and they love to parrot each other. Did Ronnie2k say this? Even he's prone to getting misinformed. Unless an actual dev says it then I believe it.
    Gosens6
    Out of curiosity, of all the next generation games we’ve seen footage for, in your opinion, which looks better than 2K21??
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

    Zion's first trailer aside, almost all games.
    Goffs
    You can't spout **** without providing source. If it's a youtuber then he's not credible since he got it from another youtuber and they love to parrot each other. Did Ronnie2k say this? Even he's prone to getting misinformed. Unless an actual dev says it then I believe it.

    https://www.overclockers.co.uk/forums/threads/ps5-enhanced-games-lists-resolution-frame-rate-ray-tracing-game-boost-more.18902504/
    this is link what i found for nba 2k21 that has no ray tracing that got me worrying
    stickyfingers
    And you're the one who told me to wear glasses..
    My arguments are same CFs / 3D models, same textures, slightly better lighting, but other games do better.
    Still waiting for yours...
    So I persist, this game doesnt look like NG.
    I can't take you serious when you say I'm comparing a next gen game to last gen, but then you previously said the game doesn't look next gen. Again the PC guys are mad.
    Sent from my SM-N960U using Operation Sports mobile app
    ForeverVersatile
    I can't take you serious when you say I'm comparing a next gen game to last gen, but then you previously said the game doesn't look next gen. Again the PC guys are mad.
    Sent from my SM-N960U using Operation Sports mobile app

    come on, grow up a little bit, there's no war PC vs consoles.
    if the game was beautiful, i'll be pissed off because it will not be released on PC. But here, i'm just disapointed because we'll have this result for 5/7 years...
    stickyfingers
    come on, grow up a little bit, there's no war PC vs consoles.
    if the game was beautiful, i'll be pissed off because it will not be released on PC. But here, i'm just disapointed because we'll have this result for 5/7 years...

    Come on, Man! 5-7 years? Really? You're going to sit here and state this is what we're going to get for the next 5-7 years? Wow...now, you're just being Chicken Little about the game. I understand some people had too high of expectations for the next-gen consoles in terms of graphics, but let's NOT pretend that game developers across all games won't produce better games over time.
    At this point, I don't know what you all were expecting, but sounds like you all wanted gameplay and graphics so dang realistic that you can sell tickets to people to watch you play the game.
    ksuttonjr76
    Come on, Man! 5-7 years? Really? You're going to sit here and state this is what we're going to get for the next 5-7 years? Wow...now, you're just being Chicken Little about the game. I understand some people had too high of expectations for the next-gen consoles in terms of graphics, but let's NOT pretend that game developers across all games won't produce better games over time.
    At this point, I don't know what you all were expecting, but sounds like you all wanted gameplay and graphics so dang realistic that you can sell tickets to people to watch you play the game.

    Well, i havent seen a huge gap in 2K between 2K14 and 2K21.
    Some parts of the graphics are better, some are the same, some are worse (lighting).
    So yeah, a console generation 5-7 years.
    stickyfingers
    Well, i havent seen a huge gap in 2K between 2K14 and 2K21.
    Some parts of the graphics are better, some are the same, some are worse (lighting).
    So yeah, a console generation 5-7 years.
    Then I don't know what to tell you other than you need to find a different game that meets your expectations for next-gen gaming. CLEARLY, NBA 2K is not going to do it for you.
    ksuttonjr76
    Then I don't know what to tell you other than you need to find a different game that meets your expectations for next-gen gaming. CLEARLY, NBA 2K is not going to do it for you.

    can hope for a wake up, crossed fingers for a real improvement on gameplay side... but you're right, the game delivers less and less of my expectations.
    FixEverything2k
    Y’all gonna say I’m nitpicking but does Dame not skip steps/Slide into Chris Paul on that charge?

    A little bit, but it looks like it was transitioning from the dribble animation into the charge animation.
    FixEverything2k
    Y’all gonna say I’m nitpicking but does Dame not skip steps/Slide into Chris Paul on that charge?

    You're right, btw sliding is more obvious on D.Mitchell clip.
    should develop a separate shot meter for ally oops and dunks that will both determine if it will be an ally oop or dunk verses layup on outside areas of meter and ally oop/dunk meter zoned around center
    I’m waay late on this, been busy with work. A lot of good things in the blog. Foot planting and help defense have needed a rework for a while. Makes me excited to see some 5 on 5 gameplay.
    As far as the graphics, I think it looks great.
    sva91
    His point is valid, but so is everyone else’s point. The fact that the ridiculously bad player models, NOT FACES, just player models, were untouched, is already a big red flag. They kept touting the game as “built from scratch” when the player models are still the exact same. I know for a fact they have the capabilities to at least improve the player models, but they did not. It takes a lot of the realism out, when these players have huge heads and little legs, and just look cartoonish.
    Nba live had amazing models, but the game wasn’t great. I just wanted to see an improvement in player models, and we got none. If enough people complain, maybe they’ll fix it, but I’d hate to be stuck with these models for this whole generation, just because people with no artistic sense think they look “good enough” or because it “doesn’t bother them”. No! This is one of the best selling games in the world. The essence of any NBA basketball game should be 5v5 in an NBA court. Fix that before you build a whole neighborhood with a barbershop and footlocker.
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

    No offense, but you sidestepped the questions: Which game is the next gen standard bearer? Don't be like someone else and say "all of them" lol. Complete silliness. Spiderman MM? Ratchet and Clank? Demon Souls Remastered!? Madden? These titles are representative of the power of the PS5 and XSX? What's supposed to be so beyond what 2K21 is? Spiderman MM is coming out for the PS4 too. Ratchet and Clank likely couldn't be done on the PS4, but it's not some reimagining of the Ratchet and Clank I have for the PS4. Dark Souls is a remake of the FIRST Dark Souls game from what I understand. And Madden... Go to that forum and you'll see there are tons of people that would love for the next Madden to be the equivalent of what 2K21 has shown. Instead it's the same old expect the worst/hope for the best scenario. Now there are rumors it may not even be a launch game - when it was already rumored to just be an upgrade of the current gen game anyway. 2K released a current gen 2K21 that had to add enough value to merit being purchased, AND is releasing a next gen 2K21. All after Madden 21 current gen released. Some perspective, please.
    Everyone's point is valid, to a degree - but it has to be within reason. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion, but when that opinion can generally be considered unreasonable, then imo it's not valid.
    They focused players not sliding on offence in this blog. My concern is players sliding on defence, and worries me they didn’t mention it. The euro step has been unusable against the cpu for years because the defender just slides with you and the animation
    I've sent countless tweets to 2k and Mike Wang every year since like 2k16 that they need to fix the damn court size in pro-am/rec modes. It is way too small. That's why there is absolutely zero spacing and teams are forced to run 5 out because its the only way to not have everyone on top of each other. It's also the main reason why there are so many passing lane steals. Because, again, there's no spacing. Passes are always going to be within arms reach of the defenders. They need to fix the size of the court or make the player models the proper size to fit the size of the court already rendered in the game.
    I have no clue why this hasnt been addressed. It's been six years. I know they get a ton of complaints about this issue but they never acknowledge it and they certainly havent done anything to fix it.
    ksuttonjr76
    Maybe that's the artistic style they decided for the game?
    EDIT: Wait a minute...did you say that NBA Live had "amazing" models???


    Nba live 18 vs the cover athlete for nba2k21. But please keep defending 2k’s art direction like you own stock in the company.
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports
    I don’t know, jimmy butler looked nothing like he does in the next gen clip and every year 2K makes these promises and we are already seeing a lot of the same re-used animations for next gen. Feels like it’s going to be slightly better game at best with a better looking crowd. Not the gameplay revamp “built from the ground up” they spewing.
    Hoping I’m wrong though come release day for the ps5 version.
    Schnoodle321
    They focused players not sliding on offence in this blog. My concern is players sliding on defence, and worries me they didn’t mention it. The euro step has been unusable against the cpu for years because the defender just slides with you and the animation

    yes this one need to be look into also along withe below.... instead people criccising and dissecting negatively the game thats not even out yet.
    "Make sure to check out next week’s final gameplay Courtside Report as I reveal details about player builds, badges, takeover, and improvements to AI!"
    i saw that this will be for the final blog...
    1. but they didn't even address Fouls (like running for shooters) as they always past through them like ghost. (im talking about CPU not been called fouls)
    2. CPU CONSISTENT TIMEOUTS. at least 2 timeouts per quarter
    3. Adjusted shot from left to right hand (a more fluid animation or new animation and not the clanky one we have right now)
    4. New assist animation (realistically) pocket pass, drop pass, no more head pass when your 3 inch to the basket and every defender is there also.
    5. And also passing from driving to the basket this. i think there is animations here that really need to be look at, it doesn't look fluid and smooth at all. and CPU automatically change direction to still defend the catcher like a canned animation.
    6. A full edited NBA players from head to toe. because we dont want to wait months for an update.
    7. Subs rotation.
    8. Walking and standing still when dribbling ang killing the time.
    9. Waving hand or hand gestures when calling plays.
    10. realistic Speed transition on fastbreak for offense and defense
    11. altercation
    12. different Flagrant fouls ( spamming steals that hit the player in head or trying to contest late and not giving space for landing )
    13. Coach running on the floor to call timeout or complain for bad call
    14. A realistic NBA replay showing highlight, fouls ,turnover in 3 views and discussing it. whether on timeouts or charity shot.
    15 Player being down on the floor if ever injured or not some medic will check or player will check him.
    16. The BUBBLE????
    17. Arena and audience and sound. nothing was discuss with this also??
    18. Hair movement.
    19. Challenge call need to be fix.
    20. last 2 minutes excessive controller vibration and arena more louder and expressive and more body contact.
    this are some that until now is never mentioned in the game that need to be look at or add and suggested instead of nitpicking every clip. I dont want to say anythng regarding Graphics as i already saw what they did with Steph and Klay so i expect the rest will look the part. too early to judge this. thank you
    I'm not even a Kobe fan, but it's so insulting to his legacy how terrible he looks in this game :o
    Especially since he's looked way better in this same series in the past...
    sva91

    Nba live 18 vs the cover athlete for nba2k21. But please keep defending 2k’s art direction like you own stock in the company.
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

    That Live 18 screen doesn’t look good and we have yet to see Kobe on PS5. Apparently he has a new and improved model on the way. On that note, he better cause it is currently disrespectful how he looks right now. He looked better 2K9-2K12.
    I dunno about you guys but I wanted 2k to move like this. To me this is next gen. Right now it's very 2k and scripted. They need more lifelike nuances and animations. Granted the vids here looks like a bunch of older players moving around but I'd like to imagine having a full on 5on5 mo cap session with NBA players and have 2k just pick out proper animations from it. I recall Live tried something like this years ago. Maybe the tech wasn't there yet.

    2k needs some sort of animation that triggers consistently so I don't run in place when running into a teammate.
    tcnumba10
    If you think the 2K Kobe looks more realistic than the Live pic, you must be watching too much Toy Story or Monsters Inc animated movies lmao
    Funny you should mention Monsters Inc.
    CP3 from that same game:
    Live did a pretty good job with models, but they aren't the golden standard and have their own issues...so let's not get going there, lol. In itself, That Melo pic is far from some mic drop.
    sva91

    Nba live 18 vs the cover athlete for nba2k21. But please keep defending 2k’s art direction like you own stock in the company.
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

    I prefer the Live direction in this pic rather than the 2K, the first next gen trailer looked promising but the clips in the blogs don’t impress for some reason.
    NoLeafClover
    I'm not even a Kobe fan, but it's so insulting to his legacy how terrible he looks in this game :o
    Especially since he's looked way better in this same series in the past...
    I'm glad that Mazique confirmed we are getting a brand new Kobe render for next gen.
    TBH though, when not captured making the least flattering expressions possible, he wasn't as bad. For some reason the emotion technology didn't lend itself well to his face in some editions.
    That first pic is straight up Kobe's glare.
    Speaking of which, I hope 2K continues to improve their facial expression technology. It's a bit taken for granted how many actual expressions and "dunk faces" of players are in the game.
    sva91

    Nba live 18 vs the cover athlete for nba2k21. But please keep defending 2k’s art direction like you own stock in the company.
    Sent from my iPhone using Operation Sports

    Blurry images where my brain has to fill in the gaps? Okay...
    You have the internet at your fingers, and you decide to post blurry images. SMDH.
    Goffs
    I dunno about you guys but I wanted 2k to move like this. To me this is next gen. Right now it's very 2k and scripted. They need more lifelike nuances and animations. Granted the vids here looks like a bunch of older players moving around but I'd like to imagine having a full on 5on5 mo cap session with NBA players and have 2k just pick out proper animations from it. I recall Live tried something like this years ago. Maybe the tech wasn't there yet.

    2k needs some sort of animation that triggers consistently so I don't run in place when running into a teammate.

    That looked absolutely glorious. I've seen something like that already for soccer. It's probably made by the same company. PES used to have trailers back in the 00s with this kind of movement and I remember people used to wonder when we would be able to have those kind of graphics and movement. Unfortunately I don't think this is something that will be possible in the next ten years. Also something about the way humans play video games make me think something like this is close to impossible.
    I'll try to give quote from a german philosopher Jürgen Habermas about the power of word, eventhough he was trying to explain a lot more serious stuff about the life itself ofcourse, but i thought this may help for 2k devs especially when writing blogs and also what i have previously tried to tell in this thread. It may not be the greatest translation but still from my understanding; he says: 'Power of word exists only in its exercise, in its actualization. Power is actualized only where word and deed have not parted company, where words are not empty.'....
    2k lost the power a long time ago...
    Goffs
    I dunno about you guys but I wanted 2k to move like this. To me this is next gen. Right now it's very 2k and scripted. They need more lifelike nuances and animations. Granted the vids here looks like a bunch of older players moving around but I'd like to imagine having a full on 5on5 mo cap session with NBA players and have 2k just pick out proper animations from it. I recall Live tried something like this years ago. Maybe the tech wasn't there yet.

    2k needs some sort of animation that triggers consistently so I don't run in place when running into a teammate.

    The problem of this and why the animations are so good is it's all scripted. This isnt action happening organically with the cpu processing input and results in real time. This is just a basketball game animated with a cpu like making an animated movie.
    One day this video will be possible I'm sure but we are far from it still I would guess.
    Some people just need to admit that they want 2K Sports to adopt NBA Live's artistic style...
    I'm trying to respect people's opinion regarding the models, but this topic is starting to dominate EVERY thread. If you don't like the artistic style of the game, then don't buy it. These conversation is basically falling into conversations where people who don't paint for a living are trying to tell a painter how to paint HIS work.
    ksuttonjr76
    Some people just need to admit that they want 2K Sports to adopt NBA Live's artistic style...
    I'm trying to respect people's opinion regarding the models, but this topic is starting to dominate EVERY thread. If you don't like the artistic style of the game, then don't buy it. These conversation is basically falling into conversations where people who don't paint for a living are trying to tell a painter how to paint HIS work.

    I almost feel like the graphic complaints are trivial at this point... I feel as though we are at point where the graphics were good enough on PS4, but from an animation and fluidity stand point, it was lacking and was a little clunky
    Yet here we are getting caught up in the age old Live vs 2K debate and discussing next generation graphics, yet most of the videos they’ve released so far look like recycled animations from last gen.
    Live is dead, so why do their graphics even matter?!
    I understand the “built from the ground up” statement truly couldn’t have been the case, but man that’s serious salesmanship for them to push that and then show VERY similar looking gameplay with minimal new animations in these hype clips.
    Nevertheles109
    I almost feel like the graphic complaints are trivial at this point... I feel as though we are at point where the graphics were good enough on PS4, but from an animation and fluidity stand point, it was lacking and was a little clunky
    Yet here we are getting caught up in the age old Live vs 2K debate and discussing next generation graphics, yet most of the videos they’ve released so far look like recycled animations from last gen.
    Live is dead, so why do their graphics even matter?!
    I understand the “built from the ground up” statement truly couldn’t have been the case, but man that’s serious salesmanship for them to push that and then show VERY similar looking gameplay with minimal new animations in these hype clips.

    Personally, "realistic" graphics is not that important especially with the next-gen consoles. As many videogames I play, there's not a SINGLE videogame that mimics real life all the way down to the pixel. EVERY videogame as player models that's "not quite human". In real life, Lara Croft's breasts would jiggle a lot given how much she jumps and moves around in that game. And I KNOW people are not looking at GTAV and saying that the game has top flight player models. In GOW, the player models are oversize brutes. For me, either you like the artistic style/appearance of the game, or you don't. However, it shouldn't be this unhealthy obsession to try to convince people that the developer can do more.
    Maybe using the words "built from the ground up" was a mistake, but I'm smart enough to see what improvements they did do the game. My main concern is how the game feels and plays like once the controller is my hands. The gameplay videos are nice, but I'm ready to play it. Yes, I see some possible legacy issues, BUT we don't know if happens all the time or was 2K able to miniumize the frequency.
    Everyone has their own opinions, so I'm just going to leave it at that. I think once they get mostly everyone's updated, it's going to look really good.
    I think the facial expressions look much more life like now and the lighting brings it all together. These pics are blurry from zooming or have motion blur, but that looks pretty realistic.
    Sent from my SM-N960U using Operation Sports mobile app
    stickyfingers
    somekind of stockholm syndrome
    This CP3 just look like current gen.
    Opinions are opinions, but now you're just coming off as saying things to say them.
    2K has been the standard with the facial expressions in sports games.
    Unless there's a face morphing mod that puts them to "shame" as well? I'd definitely like to see that. If I'm wrong I'm wrong.
    People have a super high bar when it comes to NBA 2K which is good. From what I can tell 2K is the only sports game company that takes next gen seriously! rebuilding from the group up to take full advantage of next gen power. Other sports game just basically port over their games.
    Next gen 2K21 looks amazing to me, can't wait to play it, hopefully the game actually delivers as advertised.
    The 24th Letter
    I hope 2K continues to improve their facial expression technology. It's a bit taken for granted how many actual expressions and "dunk faces" of players are in the game.

    u mean this

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    JoFri
    My son was playing 2K19 and I happened to notice this clip - block shot by Lopez. Isnt that 2K21 block animation in the blog? Lol
    https://youtu.be/rAphxWeEQag
    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

    Remember you cant barely make no block in 2K13 ?
    if you put it one year, remove it, they put it again, it's a new feature.
    stickyfingers
    Remember you cant barely make no block in 2K13 ?
    if you put it one year, remove it, they put it again, it's a new feature.
    It's definitely not the same. They aren't aligning you or moving the defender out of the way. As you saw from the blog, both defenders were able to contest the layup.
    Sent from my SM-N960U using Operation Sports mobile app
    JoFri
    My son was playing 2K19 and I happened to notice this clip - block shot by Lopez. Isnt that 2K21 block animation in the blog? Lol
    https://youtu.be/rAphxWeEQag
    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    stickyfingers
    Remember you cant barely make no block in 2K13 ?
    if you put it one year, remove it, they put it again, it's a new feature.
    ForeverVersatile
    It's definitely not the same. They aren't aligning you or moving the defender out of the way. As you saw from the blog, both defenders were able to contest the layup.
    Sent from my SM-N960U using Operation Sports mobile app

    Sent from my SM-N960U using Operation Sports mobile app
    Seems like people are hell bent on destroying next generation 2k21. Its been some clips lol. The game will definitely blow current generation 2k21 out the water. Regardless of the bugs, some of the same animations and legs being to short.
    I pre ordered xbox series x for the loading times alone so the upgrades to next generation is icing on the cake. Can you imagine almost instant load times into a myleague game? Current generation 2k21 is basically 2k20 twin. Next generation wont be that. Everyone who has a pre order or plan on getting next generation ignore these pointless post. Let them worry about short legs and SEE THAT ANIMATION IS IN 2K21 CURRENT! Who cares it will be a great game.
    What if it has upgraded pre game,half time, post game and better crowd reaction. Upgraded myleague/mygm. They already said its a different mycareer/neighborhood. This game could be spectacular. I don't care if graphics aren't there yet and somebody dribble package isn't like real life. Graphics are better and dribbling will be better. OMG D Russell dunking with his left with body contact! Hardaway dunking on people! Really? Adjust sliders and play on hall of fame. Omg legs are to short body types are awful! Its a video game we will be ok
    This all looks and sounds like a god-send for slider guys like me. So many aspects of gameplay were animation-dependent and required conflicting slider tweaks to band-aid over unfixable legacy issues, and these always compromised other aspects of gameplay.
    If these changes play out as described, this will open up a whole new world of customization via sliders for the offline crowd.
    2K, you had my curiosity. Now you have my attention.

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