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OS newcomer Ben Vollmer added a good piece asking the question, "Does more sim equal more sales?" We want to ask you that same question in a true or false format.

In your opinion does more realism lead to better sales?

Sound off by voting in our poll on your right on the frontpage and above you in the forums.

Member Comments
# 1 wisdom less13 @ 05/01/13 02:47 PM
I'd say yes, because there are a lot of people, myself and friends included, who have boycotted getting games until they got more realistic. Looking at you, Madden...
 
# 2 Majingir @ 05/01/13 02:55 PM
I think that's basically what video games in modern days have been about.In the past(like 10 or so years ago) people liked a balance of arcade type games(like NBA street,FIFA street,NHL Hitz and so on) but now, people want most realistic stuff in sports games.


I don't mind arcade stuff, but I'd rather play games with real teams, real players, realistic stuff happening. Though I also hope in the future, we see games have arcade modes within the game. Like how MVP Baseball had various arcade modes(my fave was the hitting minigame where if you hit it off certain things, you get points), and NBA(SCEA made one) had various minigames too(like the brick game and superpowers minigame).

Overall I'd prefer realistic game, but like I said, would also be nice if those realistic games had minigames as well in them.
 
# 3 jello1717 @ 05/01/13 02:57 PM
I absolutely want games to be more realistic, but if games get too realistic I'm sure it would alienate the more casual gamers (who are, of course, the vast majority of the customer base).

As a couple of examples, in football there should be bad snaps to the QB. There should be bad snaps on FGs. Weather, particularly rain and snow, should have a big impact on FGs. In basketball there should be travelling calls

All of those things would piss off casual gamers because "I wasn't in control of the snap and the game just randomly made my center snap the ball wide and I lost because of that bull#@!&. I should never lose because of some random CPU BS that was out of my control."
 
# 4 Bobhead @ 05/01/13 02:57 PM
Absolutely.

And realism translates to more than just gameplay. Capturing the feeling of being a rookie working your way up to superstar, for example, is also based on realism... the more accurately they capture the experience, the more fun the mode becomes.

And the importance of realistic physics and behaviors in any sports game cannot be overstated. It was the reason I traded in NBA 2k13 after 2 weeks and won't be buying a game from that franchise again.

There's your sales right there, or lack thereof.
 
# 5 wisdom less13 @ 05/01/13 02:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majingir
I think that's basically what video games in modern days have been about.In the past(like 10 or so years ago) people liked a balance of arcade type games(like NBA street,FIFA street,NHL Hitz and so on) but now, people want most realistic stuff in sports games.


I don't mind arcade stuff, but I'd rather play games with real teams, real players, realistic stuff happening. Though I also hope in the future, we see games have arcade modes within the game. Like how MVP Baseball had various arcade modes(my fave was the hitting minigame where if you hit it off certain things, you get points), and NBA(SCEA made one) had various minigames too(like the brick game and superpowers minigame).

Overall I'd prefer realistic game, but like I said, would also be nice if those realistic games had minigames as well in them.
I look for realism above all, but I completely forgot about that minigame in MVP. I loved it. It was one of those modes I'd play waiting to get scooped up or was just bored and didn't want to play a full game.
 
# 6 Bobhead @ 05/01/13 03:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jello1717
I absolutely want games to be more realistic, but if games get too realistic I'm sure it would alienate the more casual gamers (who are, of course, the vast majority of the customer base).

As a couple of examples, in football there should be bad snaps to the QB. There should be bad snaps on FGs. Weather, particularly rain and snow, should have a big impact on FGs. In basketball there should be travelling calls

All of those things would piss off casual gamers because "I wasn't in control of the snap and the game just randomly made my center snap the ball wide and I lost because of that bull#@!&. I should never lose because of some random CPU BS that was out of my control."
Well in real life Jesus doesn't step in and force you to travel arbitrarily.

You can make a serious argument that simply leaving out "Travel" violations from the game altogether is the most realistic route, because I should never be forced into a travel by outside factors.
 
# 7 baggio77 @ 05/01/13 03:01 PM
Sports games are where people look for realism. In other games such as fantasy games or first person shooters a lot of people are looking for a way to get away from reality. Looking for an escape into things that are not real. An oppurtunity to get away from everyday boredom.
 
# 8 DirtyJerz32 @ 05/01/13 03:03 PM
I said false. The guys on this site all want a sim experience, but we are only a small select few. In the ESPN, Sports Center area people want home runs, slam dunks, hat tricks, etc...

IMO we are the minority and most companies don't care what we think.
 
# 9 wisdom less13 @ 05/01/13 03:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DirtyJerz32_OS
I said false. The guys on this site all want a sim experience, but we are only a small select few. In the ESPN, Sports Center area people want home runs, slam dunks, hat tricks, etc...

IMO we are the minority and most companies don't care what we think.
Amen on that last line. Bottom dollar, bro. That's what it's all about...
 
# 10 TreFacTor @ 05/01/13 03:12 PM
I gotta say false...just look at Madden. It sells well annually even though it's not a 100% replication of the sport and it's franchises. It does just enough to look real and is satisfied with the results. I have to agree that we here want simulation...but we are probably also not the ones crowding gamestop at midnight for release.


BTW, yes I buy Madden... have since the beginning, but since 08 I have not paid more than $20 new for the product because that's all I think it's worth.
 
# 11 Only1LT @ 05/01/13 03:28 PM
A sports game being more realistic can definitely increase sales. I say that from a marketing standpoint and not even from a hands-on playing standpoint.

Another poster mentioned in the comments on the original blog that sim is just one aspect and that graphical quality is another. I think that in terms of a sports sim, that they are intertwined. You can not have a game that plays realistically, but looks like a Dragon Ball Budokai game and still have it be sim. The players need to look as real life as possible. The only thing that can accomplish that is graphical excellence.

Case in point: How sim can increase sales through marketing alone is by showing a video of the game playing in a commercial. If the game looked like real players, the players moved like real players do, and they were doing things consistent with their real life counterparts, who would not buy that game for themselves or for any loved one that has an interest in that particular sport?

If Madden had a commercial of in game footage and you had to scrutinize the video to tell if it was real or a game or not, would you need to know anything else about the newest version of the game, or would you basically be sold right off of that?

This is basically what Sony's marketing strategy is with the Show. Every commercial is showing footage of the game and has an interviewer talking to an MLB player and asking what it was like to win the Series, win the triple crown, or what ever the case may be, and the MLB player says that didn't happen, it's just a game. Now the Show does not look so real that you can't tell it apart from a real game of MLB, but the implied hook is genius and I think that the way they market its realism, is one of the biggest reasons that the game is doing better and better each year in sales.

So yes, being more sim will increase sales for a sports game even on the most basic level of capturing the real life essence of the sport in the way that the game looks and moves, before you ever even dive into any realistic aspects in strategy or gameplay.

Even casual fans are not easily fooled. When they look at a commercial for Madden, they might think that it looks pretty good considering it's a videogame, and will chalk up any deficiencies to "this is the best they can do with these systems", but even they know at a glance that the tagline of "if it's in the game", is just that, a tagline.

More realistic player models and ESPECIALLY animations in Madden, when seen in a commercial, would do wonders in getting the title back to the sales numbers it used to enjoy as EA's premier title.
 
# 12 Rhouston @ 05/01/13 03:56 PM
You can't ask this question on this site and expect a mixed bag of responses -- the overwhelming majority of members on here will say "True." If you asked a more casual gamer though, he's more concerned about having fun playing the game than a game that completely emulates the real sport in every single way.

IMO, I think sports games should be fairly realistic, but not EXACTLY like the real game. How many people play Tiger Woods on the hardest setting, or how many of you play with the spin being able to be put on the ball in mid-flight? How many of you play the actual quarter/period lengths for games, or how many of you shorten the lengths of the game and adjust the sliders accordingly?

Long story short: I think if a video game was exactly like the actual sport it was trying to portray, then it wouldn't be as much fun. The video game companies know this, and that's why we'll never see a "true simulation," which I, for one, and perfectly OK with...
 
# 13 CM Hooe @ 05/01/13 04:21 PM
A comparison of the sales of FIFA and Football Manager, or The Show and OOTP, or WWE and TEW shows where I stand on the question.

Realism is an important component. It is not the trump card.
 
# 14 charter04 @ 05/01/13 04:43 PM
I think the idea that a game will sell more to casual gamers if its less realistic is inaccurate. Almost every genre of games are trying to be more realistic. People love Battlefield and Skyrim because of how real they are. I know Skyrim is an a fantasy world but, that game is incredibly detailed and realistic within the world. Even FPS games have hardcore options. I think there is a place for arcade games but, I believe most people want there pro sports games to be as sim and detailed as possible. Why can't they make a game sim and have a casual, dumbed down, option like every other game?
 
# 15 charter04 @ 05/01/13 04:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CM Hooe
A comparison of the sales of FIFA and Football Manager, or The Show and OOTP, or WWE and TEW shows where I stand on the question.

Realism is an important component. It is not the trump card.
Those aren't very good comparisons. You can't compare text style game to a real game. Even text style games have games that aren't as realistic. Like OOTP versus Baseball mogul. OOTP baseball is much more realistic so it sells more.

Your comparing apples to oranges.
 
# 16 charter04 @ 05/01/13 04:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhouston
You can't ask this question on this site and expect a mixed bag of responses -- the overwhelming majority of members on here will say "True." If you asked a more casual gamer though, he's more concerned about having fun playing the game than a game that completely emulates the real sport in every single way.

IMO, I think sports games should be fairly realistic, but not EXACTLY like the real game. How many people play Tiger Woods on the hardest setting, or how many of you play with the spin being able to be put on the ball in mid-flight? How many of you play the actual quarter/period lengths for games, or how many of you shorten the lengths of the game and adjust the sliders accordingly?

Long story short: I think if a video game was exactly like the actual sport it was trying to portray, then it wouldn't be as much fun. The video game companies know this, and that's why we'll never see a "true simulation," which I, for one, and perfectly OK with...
But, at least you have the option to play on the hardest setting on Tiger Woods. Why not let the gamer decide?
 
# 17 charter04 @ 05/01/13 04:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TreFacTor
I gotta say false...just look at Madden. It sells well annually even though it's not a 100% replication of the sport and it's franchises. It does just enough to look real and is satisfied with the results. I have to agree that we here want simulation...but we are probably also not the ones crowding gamestop at midnight for release.


BTW, yes I buy Madden... have since the beginning, but since 08 I have not paid more than $20 new for the product because that's all I think it's worth.
Madden's sales are not a good point. The reason Madden sells is the NFL and marketing and they're the only ones making an NFL game. As long as they put out a halfway decent game and have NFL on it, it will sell. I still believe it would sell more if it were sim and gave the players true difficulty options. Casual gamers only need to see NFL and they buy it. Just my opinion.
 
# 18 charter04 @ 05/01/13 04:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DirtyJerz32_OS
I said false. The guys on this site all want a sim experience, but we are only a small select few. In the ESPN, Sports Center area people want home runs, slam dunks, hat tricks, etc...

IMO we are the minority and most companies don't care what we think.
If its a small select few then explain MLB the Show NHL, Fifa, NBA 2k. Those games sell great for their sport and are more sim than Madden or NCAA. I see your point but, I really think if sports gamers wanted arcade experiences then NBA Jam, NFL Street, Blitz, ect would be the top sports games.
 
# 19 qetuonz @ 05/01/13 05:56 PM
Its false.
There are a small few who want as close to sim as possible, but to the vast majority of gamers if it looks graphically real, and plays an enjoyable replication of what it is portraying then the masses love it.
If you make something too real, too sim, it will not make for fun gameplay.
 
# 20 mestevo @ 05/01/13 06:02 PM
I voted no, it's just not true in a vacuum. I'll take 20 GRIDs, DIRTs and Burnout games over Gran Turismo. Sales are a mix of Sim, Fun, Gameplay and other elements, being more Sim doesn't absolutely mean more sales.
 

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