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Madden NFL 13 News Post


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Game: Madden NFL 13Reader Score: 6/10 - Vote Now
Platform: PS3 / Wii U / Xbox 360Votes for game: 74 - View All
Madden NFL 13 Videos
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# 101 kjcheezhead @ 04/27/12 01:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Big FN Deal
Shopmaster mentioned this.

"All is not lost if your receiver isn’t looking for the ball and you want to throw to him though. You can still throw to that receiver whose icon is still “ghosted”, but you will have to switch over and user catch it yourself. This is also true for the defense." http://www.operationsports.com/forum...ay-review.html

Also this was stated in the EA game play playbook blog

"The new Read and React Defensive AI System ties directly into what I talked above with the receiver not being able to play catches unless they see the ball, so it works for both sides of the ball. This change will affect both the offense and defense in different ways, but nobody will be able to catch or swat unless they see the ball first. However, if the user has manually taken control and attempts to make a play on the ball, they will still have a shot at success." http://www.easports.com/madden-nfl/n...fl-13-gameplay
The shopmaster quote is something I really don't like. We'll see how it works but I agree with tfctilidie. Sounds like a return of the rocket catch days at worst and at best, a very arcade-like feature that allows gamers to override situations where wrs aren't supposed to be ready for the ball. Either way, it doesn't sound like an approach focused on realism.
 
# 102 GiantBlue76 @ 04/27/12 01:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjcheezhead
The shopmaster quote is something I really don't like. We'll see how it works but I agree with tfctilidie. Sounds like a return of the rocket catch days at worst and at best, a very arcade-like feature that allows gamers to override situations where wrs aren't supposed to be ready for the ball. Either way, it doesn't sound like an approach focused on realism.
This is where I am leaning. It doesn't seem like they solved anything here. Once again, player movement is going to play a major role in yet another football area. So basically, if I do nothing, my AI controlled defender/WR will not make a play for the ball if he's not looking (this is cool). However, even if he's not looking, and is completely out of position, I can take control of him and then move him into position to make a play on the ball? Ok, this can be good if it's done right. The player should only be able to be moved into a position to make a play on the ball if his body positioning would allow it. I don't want to be able to make my guy do a complete 180 while running in the opposite direction. That's exactly what ruined Madden 12 with the warping and the over abundance of interceptions/catches in triple coverage. I agree with the TC also in that user catching is already too easy. I posted about this in an earlier post.
 
# 103 RGiles36 @ 04/27/12 03:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spankdatazz22
Instead it's the same outside/in approach of focusing on the skill positions and little attention given to the OL/DL play, versus an inside/out approach that while not as exciting makes more sense long term. I'm sure they've made improvements to the OL/DL on some level, but it'd be nice to see the less glamorous aspects of the gameplay be given as much attention as the QB/WR play received and addressed sooner rather than later. To that end it doesn't seem like things have changed; they always seem like the team that refuses to draft an offensive lineman because they're normally not sexy picks.
I'm not going to present anything that's going to change anyone's mind, but I would like to respond to this.

Here's something Taz just stated in another thread:

Quote:
Originally Posted by tazdevil20
The average fan won't be able to tell if it really executes properly.
(for context, he was talking about something that had to do w/ the OL/DL interaction)

All things being equal, we'd all agree that both the passing game and OL/DL interactions needed an overhaul. Ideally, we'd like both addressed in the same cycle. If that can't happen, then a decision has to be made and I think that's the signifigance of Taz's post.

If they had the flexibility to only address passing or OL/DL, then I think they went with the right option. It's not so much about working outside/inside or going with the sexier option (although that's probably part of it). I think what sways a decision is bang-for-their-development-buck.

Let's take Madden out of the equation and think about the average football fan: do they understand principles of OL/DL battles? Do they know the signifigance of a stunt? Do they even know what a kickslide is? Sure some fans do, but a significant number could care less.

Hell, I think we're just now seeing some fans want to dig deeper into the game as evidenced by the emergence of hardcore sites such as profootballfocus.com. Even here at OS, you can tell who knows about trench work and who's just regurgitating what they've read from other knowledgeable OSers.

So again, I don't think it's as cut & dry as going with the sexy pick (borrowing your draft metaphor). We all understand that the end-game is to move units. I think it makes more sense to make necessary changes to the passing game as more people are going to notice and appreciate those.

That said, I firmly believe OL/DL is on their immediate radar.
 
# 104 LBzrule @ 04/27/12 03:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rgiles36
I'm not going to present anything that's going to change anyone's mind, but I would like to respond to this.

Here's something Taz just stated in another thread:



(for context, he was talking about something that had to do w/ the OL/DL interaction)

All things being equal, we'd all agree that both the passing game and OL/DL interactions needed an overhaul. Ideally, we'd like both addressed in the same cycle. If that can't happen, then a decision has to be made and I think that's the signifigance of Taz's post.

If they had the flexibility to only address passing or OL/DL, then I think they went with the right option. It's not so much about working outside/inside or going with the sexier option (although that's probably part of it). I think what sways a decision is bang-for-their-development-buck.

Let's take Madden out of the equation and think about the average football fan: do they understand principles of OL/DL battles? Do they know the signifigance of a stunt? Do they even know what a kickslide is? Sure some fans do, but a significant number could care less.

Hell, I think we're just now seeing some fans want to dig deeper into the game as evidenced by the emergence of hardcore sites such as profootballfocus.com. Even here at OS, you can tell who knows about trench work and who's just regurgitating what they've read from other knowledgeable OSers.

So again, I don't think it's as cut & dry as going with the sexy pick (borrowing your draft metaphor). We all understand that the end-game is to move units. I think it makes more sense to make necessary changes to the passing game as more people are going to notice and appreciate those.

That said, I firmly believe OL/DL is on their immediate radar.
I think you are right with respect to the fans. Most of them are not going to even look at it. The other thing I will add is that I think the decision they made to not overhaul it this year is because OL/DL is the most difficult work to do in a football game. WR/DB was/is easier to deal with pending on how deep a developer wants this to be. I hope it will have some depth to it. Back to OL/DL. Once you make the decision that your DL and OL are no longer tied to each other, now you open up a big a$$ can of worms that you better know what the hell you are doing once you go down that road. It took 2k 2 years to write that for 2k8 and they were going to add to it. It is by far the best pass blocking to date and they were not done with it. But with their play system the way it was, namely OL/DL already not tied together that made it a bit "easier" for them to pull off. EA will be starting from the ground up with OL/DL. Pivotal decisions will need to be made from the jump. Do they leave the play system alone or do they now decided to go with tiered defensive play calling? Lots of decisions have to be made before they jump into this.
 
# 105 GiantBlue76 @ 04/27/12 03:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LBzrule
I think you are right with respect to the fans. Most of them are not going to even look at it. The other thing I will add is that I think the decision they made to not overhaul it this year is because OL/DL is the most difficult work to do in a football game. WR/DB was/is easier to deal with pending on how deep a developer wants this to be. I hope it will have some depth to it. Back to OL/DL. Once you make the decision that your DL and OL are no longer tied to each other, now you open up a big a$$ can of worms that you better know what the hell you are doing once you go down that road. It took 2k 2 years to write that for 2k8 and they were going to add to it. It is by far the best pass blocking to date and they were not done with it. But with their play system the way it was, namely OL/DL already not tied together that made it a bit "easier" for them to pull off. EA will be starting from the ground up with OL/DL. Pivotal decisions will need to be made from the jump. Do they leave the play system alone or do they now decided to go with tiered defensive play calling? Lots of decisions have to be made before they jump into this.
Russ and LB - great posts...

The bolded text is something I find VERY interesting... I guess my question is, why was 2k able to do this (obviously several years ago) and the big mammoth company who has endless resources and the exclusive license still has not?
 
# 106 KyrieIrving @ 04/27/12 04:59 PM
Hat interception around 25-30 was amazinly played out, i hope we see that more often
 
# 107 LBzrule @ 04/27/12 05:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tazdevil20
Russ and LB - great posts...

The bolded text is something I find VERY interesting... I guess my question is, why was 2k able to do this (obviously several years ago) and the big mammoth company who has endless resources and the exclusive license still has not?
My biggest guess is that from the previous gen, 2k already had the plan of revamping the OL. They made that decision and went to work on it. Secondly, I think their play set for defense allowed them to make this decision easily. They went ahead and did the hard work of re-working the play set for defense when they did 2k4. This goes back to decisions made previous impact later decisions. I think EA may develop their own way or working out OL/DL. We'll see. Interestingly, I don't think they will renew the NFL license. They will finally have their game on next gen matching everything their competitor had on last gen so then they wouldn't care. Just my opinion. Can't be proved.
 
# 108 Senator Palmer @ 04/27/12 07:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rgiles36
Let's take Madden out of the equation and think about the average football fan: do they understand principles of OL/DL battles? Do they know the signifigance of a stunt? Do they even know what a kickslide is? Sure some fans do, but a significant number could care less.
It's a shame, generally speaking, that the lines aren't looked at with more awe. I find a certain beauty in what goes on in the trenches. It's where the game is made and broken in real life football and its virtual counter.

And speaking of the kickslide, I'm counting the days until I can see this in Madden:



...instead of this:



^This has got to go. I'm with rgiles in that I believe they feel the same way, Clint especially.
 
# 109 darknmild @ 04/27/12 09:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BezO
Not much to say about the vid that hasn't already been said. Thanks for saving me some time PG. Much easier to just like everything you said.
I see neither of you post here much, but this is the type of passive aggressive, immature nonsense that moves threads towards being locked. Have some respect for people's opinions. If you're happy with the imrpvoements, excellent. But don't insult folks that don't feel the same.

Many here are pretty good at expressing & explaining themselves. I bet if you address someone directly, they'd be happy to tell you why they're not as impressed as you.
it goes both ways.
 
# 110 darknmild @ 04/27/12 10:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by darknmild
it goes both ways.
Disregard my last post
 
# 111 PVarck31 @ 04/27/12 10:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by balcobomber25
As happens EVERY year, the EA fanboys see 3 minutes of carefully selected game footage and proclaim this to be the greatest game ever and jump all over anyone who proclaims otherwise....
You won't last too long around here calling people fan boys. Just sayin.
 
# 112 pcoz2000 @ 04/28/12 09:31 PM
Madden sucks!
 
# 113 Robby73 @ 04/29/12 01:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tazdevil20
This is exactly the post I was going to write. Thanks PG, you saved me the trouble of finding the right words. I'm what you would consider an "old timer". I started playing Madden in 1988, you know, probably around the time most of you were born. There was an incarnation of Madden on the computer before the Genesis version. I've played damn near every football game ever made. I had them all. This Madden LOOKS good, but nothing is REALLY popping out at me. It's the same MO, which is the frustration you are seeing from people in this thread. These improvements, if they work as advertised, are all great. However, basic player movement, warping, leaping, and ridiculous acts that defy every law of physics is what destroys this game. Basic line interaction which is done so perfectly in other older games destroys this game. Nothing tells me the players are actually alive. They are robots. I'm willing to bet that the same issue plaguing all of the other Madden's will be there as well - when the ball is about to leave the QB's hand, all 11 defenders will stop on a dime and begin to move towards the ball. EA sees dollar signs, but they can't see the forest through the trees. The videos they are showing do not look much different than the videos I saw for M11 and M12. It always looks impressive showing the high resolution replays and those finer details, but when you are actually playing the game, it doesn't look like that. No one has ever questioned how Madden looks. It looks AMAZING - the art team has done a tremendous job. It's when you start actually playing it where it all goes awry. As of right now, I'm passing on this game. People can label me what they want, but I'm not 12 so I don't subscribe to that ridiculous "*****" terminology. I'm a realist. I have no angst towards EA, I could care less about the company. I care about the football. The challenge system, penalties, player movement and cutting without momentum, warping/teleporting, terrible OL/DL interaction, no real pocket, etc. etc. are all still going to be left on the table and I'll be told to wait until "next year". Tiburon has their work cut out for them to keep their classic customer base. Maybe they don't care too, since younger kids today will be buying this game and think it's amazing. They can play as their favorite team and score 50 points on the Ravens defense. It will be exciting to watch catches in triple coverage, Patrick Willis cover Calvin Johnson step for step and have Adrian Peterson plow through an entire defense 4 times a game while zig zagging through defenders on his way to the end zone.

Oh well, there's always next gen.
talk about zig zag down field I remember when i was teen myself playing a game called tecmo bowl ,you older guys have to remember bo jackson. I tend to agree with what you say but at the same time i had alot of fun in my days with tecmo, lol and now you couldnt pay me to play it, but that was the game back then though and i loved it..
 
# 114 baller_of_the_year @ 04/29/12 07:48 PM
The lip synching of Nantz and Simms is Laugh Out Loud horrible.

They GOTTA fix that.

I'll probably still pass on this year's Madden unless is mind bogglingly brilliant like NBA 2K11 and 12 were. After all, this is where Madden SHOULD be by now in it's seventh year on Next Gen consoles. Not in what is essentially a "rebuilding stage". That shoulda been in Madden 06. With the exclusive deal and the ESPN exclusivity the amount of potential squandered by EA over the years is quite simply embarrassing.
 
# 115 mrprice33 @ 04/29/12 08:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by baller_of_the_year
The lip synching of Nantz and Simms is Laugh Out Loud horrible.

They GOTTA fix that.
Now that's probably a product of being pre-alpha. That's something they should and probably will fix.
 
# 116 MrChainsaw @ 04/29/12 09:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by baller_of_the_year
The lip synching of Nantz and Simms is Laugh Out Loud horrible.

They GOTTA fix that.

I'll probably still pass on this year's Madden unless is mind bogglingly brilliant like NBA 2K11 and 12 were. After all, this is where Madden SHOULD be by now in it's seventh year on Next Gen consoles. Not in what is essentially a "rebuilding stage". That shoulda been in Madden 06. With the exclusive deal and the ESPN exclusivity the amount of potential squandered by EA over the years is quite simply embarrassing.
That being said, I'm sure you will still end up buying the game on release day.
 
# 117 johnnyg713 @ 04/29/12 09:56 PM
Positives - I love the new read and react system. Finally EA. Hope it works as well as advertised, but gotta give credit where it is due. Pass trajectories are awesome. All the NEW animations look great. The catch animations look really good. Even the drop back animations and throw on the run animations.

Negatives - Almost all the other animations beside the new ones. Regular Throw animations look untouched and look terrible. Running animations are bad. OL/DL WR/DB interactions need work still. Player models don't do it for me either.
 
# 118 GiantBlue76 @ 04/29/12 10:10 PM
My big beef about animations is not necessarily that the animations are all that bad, it's that they do not occur within the right context and it looks ridiculous. If a defender has his back facing the ball he shouldn't be able to suddenly flip around and reach out and make a one handed interception. Or how about a receiver snagging a pass with one hand over the middle and getting crushed by a safety and still holding onto the ball? Come on... This madden looks just like the other ones. It ALWAYS looks really good. When the demo comes out and I can try all of this out, I'll start believing if it's really there. There is nothing they can show me in videos, screen shots, or anything else they state that will be able to win me back into believing they are capable of making quality football. I need to see it for myself to believe it.
 
# 119 SageInfinite @ 04/29/12 10:17 PM
Did they remove the sig qb throwing animations? Everybody looks like they throw the same in this video. That's definitely a fail if they did.
 
# 120 baller_of_the_year @ 04/29/12 11:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrChainsaw
That being said, I'm sure you will still end up buying the game on release day.
I haven't bought a Madden game since Madden 04...lol

Seriously. I skipped Madden 05 and bought NFL 2K5 mostly because of the price drop and the screenshots I saw of Sportscenter. It was the best gaming decision I've made in my life. NFL 2K5 is the best football sim of all time only challenged in raw fun factor by Tecmo Super Bowl (yes, I know it's not a sim, but it's the funniest game ever made, imo).

It seems after 2005 EA Sports descended into a lazy, half hearted, arrogant company that felt they didn't hafta to work to sell their sports games (sans Fifa) all they had to do was stamp EA Sports on the box and throw money at the screen and voila.

2K captured my heart with 2K and 2K1 on Dreamcast but after Dreamcasts demise I went back to Madden (though I still played 2K and 2K1) my updates were Madden until the price drop when 2K won my heart back.

And EA has proven to not be worthy of the responsibility of being the sole provider of a sports sim. The fact that they released Madden 06 stripped down to the bare bones with NO COMMENTARY and NO REAL FEATURE SET after releasing what was a good game a year ago on PS2 was an absolute slap in the face to the fans, the NFL, and the Madden name itself. I've been disgusted with EA ever since. And sentiment has only grow with their half hazard efforts and lame excuses for piss poor products then sense.

So, no...I won't be buying Madden 12. Unless word gets out that is truly as revolutionary as 2K11 or 2K12. Til then, my fingers stay crossed for the eventual NFL 2K release.
 


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