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Welcome to Amidst The Blather, where I'll be blogging my way through the Operation Sports Forums. Sometimes I'll just be drawing your attention to interesting threads, sometimes I'll take the opportunity to weigh in on a debate going on there, and...{br}{br}View the Entire Article{br}

Member Comments
# 1 Sully @ 03/21/05 05:46 PM
Great idea!

Winning Eleven 8 is indeed a great game, but perfect it is not. The lack of online play alone is enough to justify a 4/5. Konami really dropped the ball by leaving out that feature.
 
# 2 fossen @ 03/21/05 06:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by fsquid
the blather?
Blather.
 
# 3 RustedWalleye @ 03/21/05 08:11 PM
Great article. Was a very good response to the negativity over my review. I had initially rated a 5/5, but after some discussion decided to change the end of my review and release it as a 4/5. To me that does the game and the series more justice then a 5/5 would have. Hopefully the 4/5 brings the attention that is needed from Konami so that they finally will get the game to the level it is striving so hard to obtain.

I almost bet that there is more concern from Konami over a 4/5 versus a 5/5 and the controversy around the score also has to help bring that attention to them as well.
 
# 4 sdrotar @ 03/22/05 06:39 PM
The "outside influence" was me.
It's kind of my job as Managing Editor...
 
# 5 mgoblue @ 03/22/05 11:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RustedWalleye
Great article. Was a very good response to the negativity over my review. I had initially rated a 5/5, but after some discussion decided to change the end of my review and release it as a 4/5. To me that does the game and the series more justice then a 5/5 would have. Hopefully the 4/5 brings the attention that is needed from Konami so that they finally will get the game to the level it is striving so hard to obtain.

I almost bet that there is more concern from Konami over a 4/5 versus a 5/5 and the controversy around the score also has to help bring that attention to them as well.

while I love the game, I agree with the rating...if it was on xbox live/ps2 online I'd say give it a 5, but that was a big thing left out for us....
 
# 6 BatsareBugs @ 03/23/05 03:50 AM
Very cool article. Makes me wonder how the heck I can miss the SFTP/etc. like this.
 
# 7 fossen @ 03/23/05 10:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgoblue
while I love the game, I agree with the rating...if it was on xbox live/ps2 online I'd say give it a 5, but that was a big thing left out for us....
Personally .... I'm not even sure basic Live implementation would bump it, were I doing the review. I think that, while ML was improved this year, it's still a needlessly obtuse franchise mode. It's a pretty nasty interface, and seems overly artificial.

Fact is, I considered throwing my name in the hat for the WE8 review .... already knowing that I would give it a 5/5 - I just needed to fill in the text. It's a knee-jerk reaction that it (and other) cult hits are "perfect", but I don't think that's necessarily the case.
 
# 8 devilsjaw @ 03/23/05 03:55 PM
Once again it shows the emphasis put on numbers of a review instead of the actual review itself. Read the damn thing people!! Like Sully said, no online equals a big negative, for a more or less stellar game...
 
# 9 part1sts @ 04/01/05 04:47 PM
well if people had friends they could play with they wouldnt complain about an online mode
 
# 10 fossen @ 04/01/05 06:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by part1sts
well if people had friends they could play with they wouldnt complain about an online mode
Classy.

Let me guess. You're under 20?

Whan you're a teenager, your friends live in your neighborhood and come over to play .... it's a little different when you're an adult.
 
# 11 Sully @ 04/01/05 06:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by fossen
Classy.

Let me guess. You're under 20?

Whan you're a teenager, your friends live in your neighborhood and come over to play .... it's a little different when you're an adult.
Fossen, he has a point.
BTW, I just booked a flight on Sunday out to Utah so we can get a game of WE in.
 
# 12 mgoblue @ 04/01/05 10:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sully
Fossen, he has a point.
BTW, I just booked a flight on Sunday out to Utah so we can get a game of WE in.
I just booked my flight to Utah, I have winner
 
# 13 Acid @ 04/01/05 10:28 PM
Utah?

Guys, I have WE:8, and I live in Southern California!!

Screw Utah.
 
# 14 UMDDogs @ 04/11/05 11:07 AM
My problem is not the rating, it is the rating system. Since the system only allows a high rating of 5/5 the game is definetly good enough to receive that score. It has less bugs and is more realistic than Madden or ESPN Football and should receive a higher score than those titles. On a scale of 5 it definetly deserves a 5. Now if your scale was out of 100, I would not think it would deserve a 100/100 score, more like 90/100.

But since your rating system doesn't allow that, I think it needs a 5/5. Giving it a 4/5 translates to me as 80/100 and it is a far better game than that.

Now I know you are going to say that your scores don't translate like that, which they may not, but this game is better than many games you have given 4/5 yet to casual gamers they will think the games are equal, which they are not.

Fix the system it ain't good.
 
# 15 fossen @ 04/11/05 11:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by UMDDogs
Now I know you are going to say that your scores don't translate like that, which they may not,
You're right .... they don't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by UMDDogs
but this game is better than many games you have given 4/5 yet to casual gamers they will think the games are equal, which they are not.

Fix the system it ain't good.
One of the most sucessful and well-knows review scoring systems in the world is a scale of 0-1 .... the 'Thumbs Up/Thumbs Down' of Siskel and Ebert. No one thinks that just because Citizen Kane and Spanglish both get a thumbs up that they are equally good movies.

At times I agree. Doing reviews, sometimes I have a hard time nailing it on a 5 point scale. Ridge Racer gave me fits. But I go back to our description of the scores, and it becomes an easy decision.
 
# 16 UMDDogs @ 04/11/05 11:31 AM
The one thing I will say is that you probably would have to put a lot more time into the game to rate it on a higher scale and the reviewers probably don't have time to do that.

Maybe doing away with scores altogether and letting the gamer decide on the written review would make it better. It would also take putting a score on it out of the equation for you guys and make the reader decide if what the review said makes them want to buy the game.

Anyways, I think you guys do a wonderful job with the site and your reviews, I always look here before buying a game. I will say that this particular game is the best sports game I have ever played and I am not a big soccer fan.

But then again I am just one person and others have different ideas of what works for them.
 
# 17 UMDDogs @ 04/11/05 11:33 AM
As for the Siskel and Ebert thing I usually like the movies that they don't and don't like the ones that they do. But again, everyone has there own preferences.
 
# 18 fossen @ 04/11/05 11:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by UMDDogs
The one thing I will say is that you probably would have to put a lot more time into the game to rate it on a higher scale and the reviewers probably don't have time to do that.
Personally, I've found I spend more time working on a 5 point scale. It makes for some tough decisions, and more analysis. It's easier to toss out a 87 than to decide between 4 or 5.

Had we still been on a 100 point scale, I would have given Ridge Racer a high 80's .... maybe even as high as low 90's. But with our scale, I needed to make a tough decision .... was it a truly exceptional title, or was it just really, really good?

Quote:
Originally Posted by UMDDogs
Maybe doing away with scores altogether and letting the gamer decide on the written review would make it better. It would also take putting a score on it out of the equation for you guys and make the reader decide if what the review said makes them want to buy the game.
Honestly, this is a fuction of the marketplace. We've considered dumping scores completely, but scores are important. The aggregators (gamerankings and the like) need scores, and they drive traffic.
 

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