jones 2009 draft choice, what would you do?

[Skarecrow]

got a real tough choice for draft day here.

Quick background on this franchise. I'm trying to do this one 100% legit. no questionable actions or even draft sheets. I've done the ozzie jones draft path twice in the past but it has been a long time so I mostly don't remember who the good people are aside from the obvious big names.

I took over the bears after leaving my initial team. Didn't realize it at the time, but the 1-15 bears have pick #1 in the draft. What to do with it? our two biggest needs are by far QB and LE. we have no LEs at all, and our only QB is overall 68. I'm running a blitz-heavy 46 defense and a martz-based vertical passing offense, so both positions are vital.

I'm really torn here between QB Joe Kain or LE Marquis Acho. The most intelligent choice would probably be to take Acho at #1, get Noah Wyoming in round 2, and try and pick up Tristan Riley in two years. The problem with that is Kain is a Rothlisberger clone, and I love me a huge affable quarterback (played two steelers franchises and loved big ben both times). I've never had Kain before, but my limited scouting shows him to be more or less what I'm looking for. No guarantee I'll be able to get Riley either. I also hate waiting for my franchise QB. That leaves me in a deep hole lineman wise. I have one good DT, leaving me looking for another DT and a good RE, after I fill my LE hole.

Mock draft places them at #1 and #3, so I don't think there's any way I can get both without giving way too much and paying out the nose. LE Doki Somanu looks like he may be an alternative, but mock draft didn't put him much past Acho and Kain.

Draft day is probably tonight or tomorrow. Opinions? What would you guys do? what have you done in similar situations?

[mrs844224]

I'd get RE Caraun Lawrence-I remember speed ratings very high. Ozzie is also very good in a Spread-type offense.

[Skarecrow]

Quote: Originally Posted by mrs844224

I'd get RE Caraun Lawrence-I remember speed ratings very high. Ozzie is also very good in a Spread-type offense.

Just used one of my individual workouts on Lawrence, wow,yeah, that's pretty much exactly what I was looking for. mock draft thinks he's going to go in the early 20s too, so I may trade up for that.

I picked up HB rashard mendenhall in free agency, so I may try and get by with him until that beast (whose name I forget) shows up in 2011 or 2012. I've gotten ozzie before and been pretty underwhelmed by him. the lack of trucking/power has always been a problem for me. he just doesn't find open field often enough, even with EG's sliders.

let me know if you know of any other players worth scouting (I've got a few individual workouts left) that would fit my system.

[Byron Yatch]

TRADE DOWN TWICE(once to like 5 and then once to the 9-11th pick latest) then choose the best available guy that fills a need.
I dont remember the ozzie Jones path at all but knowing the bears, if you went preseason they dont need a back unless you really want ozzie around 20th pick.

They really need a QB and pass rusher like you said so whatever the best of those 2 are you should get, while hopefully getting a good amount of picks for later in that 2009 draft. If need or want be(for realism) make a couple of those picks traded for 2010 picks so you cant steal all the talent from the first draft.

I think QB is more important need than LE and you should prolly look for a new CB on that team(tillman slow vasher short).

If it were a RE that is a supreme pass rusher thats one thing. But I dont get a lot of production from the le unless I have an athletic stud(strength being the most important)

[Skarecrow]

I've had a lot of trouble in franchises past with trading down, especially from the #1, #2, or #3 slot.

a lot of times, i'll get an offer from maybe #8 or #14, and that's it. #8 isn't so bad, depending on the draft... but usually I can't get any of the major superstars at #8 that I might still have been able to get if I'd been able to trade #1 for #3 or #4 (which I've never seen). #14 is even worse, because all the marquee players are usually off the board and you're in the midst of the 1st round busts. At that point, I'm waiting for the semi-marquee "first round sleepers", like an ozzie jones in 2009 jones, a kenny phillips in 2008, a dane morrow in 2009 english, etc. Those players can usually be had at #25 or so though, so grabbing them at #14 is just wasting money... however if you try and trade down #14, nobody wants it!

I've even seen a lack of offers for positions like #3 in some drafts.

That said, I'm certainly going to give it a try. I usually do... but I'm not expecting much. I'm working under the assumption that I'll have no luck on trading down a handful of spaces to pick up Joe Kain at #3 or #4, so I'm expecting that I'll probably bite the bullet, grab him with #1, and then trade up to #20 or so to get Caraun Lawrence. Maybe I'll be lucky and some other really bad team will be interested in trading me their 2010 pick and I can use that to get alex hurst. I'm not expecting to have a winning season in 2009 anyway.

Come to think of it, I wonder if there's a good linebacker who could move to LE and perform well in a blitz oriented defense. I moved LOLB Joey Porter on my dolphins franchise to backup LE behind Xavier Cox, and Joey still put up insane sack numbers with my go-to man blitz play, the "SAM Blitz". 32 or 33 years old, and he still found a hole every single time.

[mrs844224]

The 1st Jones Draft is also really deep with WR and CB sleepers. You can pretty much set your receiving core with the 1st Jones draft.

[Byron Yatch]

If you're having trouble trading down, you're not putting enough people on the trade block. Some teams wont even entertain a trade offer JUST FOR PICKS if you dont have anyone up they'd be interested in trying to steal.

I frequently can get to 4-8. And then 10-12. But I usually have a gm with at least 4 in trade negotiations. I make that a priority so I can get more in deals or more deals to choose from.

If you dont feel comfortable moving down twice, move down once to 9. Forgot who, might be ebon or someone else but they said 9 is the breaking point for contracts. At 8 you'll still pay an arm and a leg, 9 it drops to more reasonable figures.

[Skarecrow]

I usually have just about every non-starter with a potential 80 or under on the trade block. they're garbage as far as I'm concerned, but sometimes teams want them. I don't think they made much difference.

So, here's how day 1 panned out. Pretty damn happy with it all things considered.

Trade down from #1 overall to #6 overall, picking up the raven's 2010 1st round pick in the process.

traded up from #6 to #5 to pick up QB Joe Kain. also lost my 2010 #1 pick to do it. That seemed like a HUGE tradeoff to get only one spot higher, but the fact that Kain was the only big "name" left means that anybody else that took the #5 pick from the browns was doing it to get kain, so it had to be me. As long as the ravens do worse than we do this year, I come out ahead in the end since I've still got their #1 pick.

Traded up to #20 to pick up RE Caraun Lawrence. A steal here in my opinion. I didn't have to trade much to get it either.

Picked up MLB Freddy Bates at my regular #33 (1st pick of round 2).

Day 2 was a very mixed bag. I've just finished 2009 preseason game #3 and all my rookies have shown their true potential. at least half the people I drafted had potentials of 80 or under. It's been a long time since that happened. It's kinda... fun not to know for sure who I'm getting.

Team ended up somewhat unbalanced. I never did get a good LE, both the ones I drafted in later rounds sucked. I actually moved my VMI MLB to LE. He's undersized, but I don't think that'll end up being a huge problem since his agility is going to come in real handy.

I did end up with 6 wide receivers with a potential of 89 or above. it's crazy. I'll have to trade some of them away for draft picks.

[Byron Yatch]

I dont know how you have your philosophies set but the 46 runs WAY more 34 than 43(if you let the coordinators call the plays by dismissing them). That might be why your other de's didnt "pan out"(depending on how you're asking them to play). I know the ravens run versatile 3-4 de but they're difficult to find sometimes. Try to get a guy compared to Richard seymour(?) and luis castilla. They are good 3-4 des, couple others as well but I cant remember the names.

On a side note, I might suggest moving dt's to de if you're gonna run the 46 and cant find anyone suitable. Sure when you're running a 4-3 play they might not be as fast around the edge but they usually have much higher strengths which allow your lbs to flow to the ball more effectively in any formation. On 3-4 plays, they open the lanes for the blitzing safety and lbs, and force tackles to respect the end rush so the cbs can get there without being touched.(I run the 46 with the bears myself)

I noticed one year of the english draft I picked 2 ends for their strength numbers alone and the difference between them and the recent set is ridiculous. They never put up sack numbers or even tackle numbers to be proud of, but they made holes for the blitzing linebackers(like an ol for a rb). To see tackles get pushed back so far is radical when usually my ends were getting dominated.

I decided their overalls werent high enough or something and i kind of regret it now to be honest. With more time to learn the plays, they may have become better pass rushers, who knows... Besides, Who cares if everyone on your team can get 95 potential when you can win with 80-85s that did the job well enough?

As for the trading thing, you have to put people on the list that are in the 90s(at least 85 and up). Under 80 or 80 wouldnt be high enough to entice someone to talk about moving out of their space when they can draft a 90-95 most likely with that pick.

Again, Im not saying you have to actually trade them but they have to be on the block to get those teams to talk to you in the first 2-5 picks. You'll know you put someone good enough up when you see their name a lot in the offers while trading up so high in the draft.

For example, on my bears franchise I offered kruetz and hunter hillenmeyer and a 2nd rd pick THE NEXT YEAR(not even that same year), and I was capable of trading with arizona for the third or 4th pick to draft javon jackson(I regret that too cause I thought he was the athletic freak but forgot thats selvin lankford in the next draft).

All Im saying here is teams will usually offer to trade down more often when they know someone "great" is available on the trade block. Could be speculation, could just be seeing something I want to see. But I(personally) see more teams willing to trade out of 1st rd picks when I have even an old 90 ovr player(like kruetz) IM trying to get rid of for cheap new guys.

[Skarecrow]

So an update to this thread. I think I chose well, at least as far as day one goes.

I have no more doubts about not waiting for tristan riley. Joe Kain is the man! hes exactly what I want in a qb. He's closing in on 6000 yards this season. In our last game against the packers, he threw for 549 yards, 4 passing touchdowns, and rushed for a 5th. He won League MVP, offensive rookie of the year, and came in second in both offensive player of the year and qb of the year. He's flat out amazing. I've had some pretty marquee QBs, including Jack English, Dane Morrow (twice), Andre Woodson, Ben Rothelisberger (also twice), Josh Johnson, and Tom Brady... and Joe Kain is as good as anybody. His completition percentage on long bombs is CRAZY.

Caraun Lawrence did well, but Freddy Bates is the one who pulled in the defensive rookie of the year award, and he did it after I moved him to LOLB from MLB no less.

I finished up the last game of the regular 2009 season. What a game it was. we were behind the Packers in the division by an entire game, but as fate would have it, our last game was against the Packers. The Vikings were up a half game on us so they had to lose and we had to beat the packers. Suffice it to say, we're playoff bound! Amazed the hell out of me, especially after our 0-4 start, we ended the season at 9-7. I still have yet to build my coaching staff!