FistofRages's 2010 Heisman Slider Discussion

[stewaat]

What is your play calling like?

[fistofrage]

Quote: Originally Posted by stewaat

What is your play calling like?

When I took Indiana into the swamp, I just used ask Corso because I didn't know their playbook.

I like to run the ball though. So I use all the running plays except out of shotgun. I, Weak, Strong, Ace, etc. I pass alot out of these run formations too. It keeps the AI off balanced. I'll do a PA Bomb on 2nd and 3, just to keep them honest so the safeties can't creep up every play.

If I'm in 3rd and long, I'll use either an Ace 3 WR set or Shotgun.

[doctorhay53]

I dont know about you, but I've found that the CPU pass rush / hum pass block reacts completely differently in playaction than they do in non-playaction. I've been trying out my hand at starting my own sliders from scratch and balancing the pass rush has been impossible.

One issue I have with pretty much every single slider philosophy I see out there is that you have to have almost no time to throw the ball. However, the way the game is set up, this means that the shortest route on the field is almost ALWAYS the one you have to hit to avoid the sack / floating duck. I completely disagree with this idea and its in almost every slider set.

I'm attempting to balance it so that you actually can throw playaction without getting sacked 50% of the plays, and you can actually hit a deep in every once in a while. If you give yourself more time, you have to have high CPU pass coverage or the passing game will be too easy. But all of the slider sets I've tried make the passing game hard by simply giving you no time whatsoever. While I agree that this is 'realistic', I think it's impossible to balance the game this way because many routes take longer to develop than they do in real life, and the insane pass rush merely takes the fun out of the passing game for me and reduces my playbook enormously.

Anyway I got sidetracked, how do you feel about playaction pass blocking?

[fistofrage]

Quote: Originally Posted by doctorhay53

I dont know about you, but I've found that the CPU pass rush / hum pass block reacts completely differently in playaction than they do in non-playaction. I've been trying out my hand at starting my own sliders from scratch and balancing the pass rush has been impossible. One issue I have with pretty much every single slider philosophy I see out there is that you have to have almost no time to throw the ball. However, the way the game is set up, this means that the shortest route on the field is almost ALWAYS the one you have to hit to avoid the sack / floating duck. I completely disagree with this idea and its in almost every slider set. I'm attempting to balance it so that you actually can throw playaction without getting sacked 50% of the plays, and you can actually hit a deep in every once in a while. If you give yourself more time, you have to have high CPU pass coverage or the passing game will be too easy. But all of the slider sets I've tried make the passing game hard by simply giving you no time whatsoever. While I agree that this is 'realistic', I think it's impossible to balance the game this way because many routes take longer to develop than they do in real life, and the insane pass rush merely takes the fun out of the passing game for me and reduces my playbook enormously. Anyway I got sidetracked, how do you feel about playaction pass blocking?

I feel my #1 WR averages 45 yards a catch because I set up the playaction through the run. If the Play Action is set up and it will tell you if it is, you get plenty of time to pass. If you run play action without setting up the run first, it doesn't work so well.

I'll have a decent slider set out within 2 days of the patch dropping. Check them out and lets see if we can get some good dialogue going on them.

[doctorhay53]

Quote: Originally Posted by fistofrage

I feel my #1 WR averages 45 yards a catch because I set up the playaction through the run. If the Play Action is set up and it will tell you if it is, you get plenty of time to pass. If you run play action without setting up the run first, it doesn't work so well. I'll have a decent slider set out within 2 days of the patch dropping. Check them out and lets see if we can get some good dialogue going on them.

I don't necessarily agree that you should have to get a play to 100% setup for the playaction to work, but your point is valid.

However, the way I am setting things up, by the time you get to your drop back point a pocket is setup, which quickly starts to cave in somewhere, against a 4 man rush, fairly even teams. Against even a 5man rush, you need to throw it more quickly and you may not even get to the dropback point before you need to do some avoidance. The point for me is to be able to throw the post-corner even occasionally before the rush is nailing me from 3 sides (non-playaction even). I found that even at Hum PB of 40 and CPU pass rush of 60, the second DE's engaged with T's they broke that block and headed straight for the QB. It was much too quick and very unrealistic.

I got alot of ideas from the thread in the madden slider forums about what the offensive and defensive sliders actually do....i.e, PB controls the ability of the OL to get on their blocks, while PR controls the ability for the rusher to get off of that block. While it's clear to me in NCAA that PB controls both in some ways, it made me think about 'realism'. What I am aiming for is that against a 4 man non-stunt rush, all pass rushers should essentially always (>90%) be engaged (this is not the case on most slider sets). Once engaged, they should not remain solidly engaged long enough for a reciever to run all the way across zone coverage very often. However, against stunts and blitzes people should sometimes be unblocked. The balance between the two scenarios is very fine.

I find that even if playaction is setup, sometimes this causes the LB to come up, an OL to get confused and try to block him, and a DL gets free before the animation is even over. I'm considering lowering my playaction playcalling to an extremely low amount if we can't find a balance.

[doctorhay53]

btw I hate waiting for 2 stinking patches before I can even consider seriously playing the game.

[fistofrage]

Quote: Originally Posted by doctorhay53

btw I hate waiting for 2 stinking patches before I can even consider seriously playing the game.

Yep, I bought this game in July to play it in July and really couldn't do that. No sense in starting a dynasty until the final version is released because I like to keep to one set of sliders and compare stats.

[leetdemon]

patch 2 is out get to work young man :P


jk just wanted to let you know

[fistofrage]

Quote: Originally Posted by leetdemon

patch 2 is out get to work young man :P jk just wanted to let you know

I'll start work on them tonight. I pretty much know what I'm going to do, so it shouldn't take long.

[Keyser Soze]

Quote: Originally Posted by fistofrage

I'll start work on them tonight. I pretty much know what I'm going to do, so it shouldn't take long.

please update your sliders here with what you are going to start with. I am going home for lunch and I will try them.