Let's talk online "Fair Play"

[CM Hooe]

I'm all in favor of fair play online. The one thing I will mention, however, is that fake field goals and fake punts shouldn't be barred from happening, particularly in a range where a fake might actually occur (~from own 40-yard line forward).

[Playmaker24]

Quote: Originally Posted by cdon2k

I am not for a "cheese rating" or "player ratings" ala NBA 2k period. The system didn't work and here's why. After someone loses they are never going to say "he played a great game, nice game, I think I'll give him an excellent rating!". They get so pissed off because of the loss that they give you a bad rating for revenge, "I'll show this guy, I'll give him a uses exploits rating to get back at him." Add to that everyone has a different definition of what "cheese" is... I can see someone giving me a "cheeser" rating for using audibles lol. "He keeps changing the play all the time!!!!!!" lol. think about it.

Yeah, that is completely true. So many people get pissed off due to losses player ratings almost means jack crap.

For example, I've played players with good ratings who glitch and bad rating who don't.

Also creating a cheese rating won't deter any "cheesers" and could possibly screw some straight players. Let's say I have pension to go for the win in a close game, I go for two.

If I play a straight game but I prefer go for the win is that really cheesing?

[USC-Trojans]

There should be a fair play option when playing online.

Fair play - Yes or no

[Joborule]

Honestly, I have played enough online games that fair play doesn't feel necessary. When they do go for it on 4th down, usual it's 4th and short. QB sneaks are the usual call or some run play call that can normally get you 2 yards. If the QB sneak issue was dealt with, then those 4th downs may be harder to come by.

When it's 4th and a few yards, normally they just punt it. If they do go for it, sometimes they get it (good play call or effective route used), sometimes they don't.

Like I said, if you dealt with the issues that currently the offense has an animation and AI advantage over the defense right now, fair play shouldn't be necessary at all. Not fot a football game that wants to be the ultimate, realistic, simulation football game.

[Dynamite]

Until it is the ultimate realistic simulation of football, fair play is at least necessary as an option for those who want a straight up game, rather than 100 plays of hurry up offense and going for it every fourth down.

Of course, if the FB/HB dive plays were a bit better balanced then we wouldn't have so many 4 and 3 calls where guys go for it on their own 20, but since that isn't the case, Fair Play steps in to make sure. With better tuning, it could be a great option for those looking for a straight game.

Also, contrary to your other post, it's not about one team being better than the other, because Fair Play works against both sides, but it is about keeping a game cheeser/bad sport free.

[SomeStrangeSin]

well for hurry up offense you should just make the defence have more options including player matchups maybe have a different audible book for hurry up defence? some nfl teams will use hurry up offence the whole way down the field untill they score soo i dont think you should limit that unless its once every other offensive possesion.

as for going for it on 4th down if im down 34 - 7 with 3 minutes left in the third that means in the game i have 8 minutes total left if your playing 5 minute quarters if i cant go for it on forth when theres only 8 minutes left and im down a ****load of points i should be allowed to go for it on 4th down anywhere on the field.

[ChubbyBanana]

I'd be all for a fair play option. At least if you wanted to use it it would be available.

The way it is right now unless im in a league with a close group of friends I don't really play online due to cheese.

[jfsolo]

Quote: Originally Posted by Joborule

Fair Play just doesn't feel right since you have a game the restrict you of your coaching options. That should never be done. In fact, fair play made up faults in the gameplay that allowed players to get 4th downs to easily. Plus at times when going for 4th down made sense, it restricts you (4th & 4 on opp 37, too far for kicker range, to short for punt range, might as well go for it). Plus the games are so quick with 5 min quarters, sometimes when you get behind you want to take the risk so you aren't behind to long before the gap gets larger and time gets smaller... If the AI and animation system is better programed so Qb sneaks, dropping to far back and always rolling out, and no huddling all the time won't be such an effective tool anymore (while done in realistic matter). Then there shouldn't be a need for Fair Play at all because if your getting beat on 4th down with some yards to go, you're just being outplayed. I just don't think Fair Play would be necessary if those mention points were dealt with. Those who still complain aren't just good as their opponent or something then.

Quote: Originally Posted by TombSong

As usual our culture is conditioned to take care of the roach infestation buy nuking the house. Fair Play solves nothing and overlooks the real problem....the roaches. If the roaches are never killed the houses will always have them. roaches are gonna always do what they do...eat your food. The real issue is WHY do I need fair play ? 1. People going for it on 4th down. Why should people not be able to go for it on 4th down ? Thats a choice in the real game it should be a choice in this game. A better fix would be what AP2K8 has.(Theres that game again) On 4th downs the Star players seem to get a (undocumented boost) to their stats. The defensive line brings WAY more pressure and LB's play the run more aggressively. After a while of playing under those condidtions, YOU are conditioned to FEAR going for it on 4th down. It becomes a big risk, but if you do manage to make it, you should be rewarded. 2. Hurry up offense. Again, If a coach wants to do this why should the game stop them ? The cure is to make player fatigue more profound on the offense when they are in the hurry up. Also if they ran it alot in the 1st 3 quarters the offensive players ratings should take a -5 point hit going into the 4th quarter. I am sure the game can track how many times that hurry up button was used, if it was used for more than 50% of the plays ran through the first 3 quarters, the 4th quarter rating reduction function should kick in.

These are the most important points here IMO. The main reason we're having this discussion at all is because the game is tuned to be ultra forgiving to people who don't use football fundamentals.

The one year I did play online, Fair Play ironically ended up being a huge negative for me. A lot of players knew an exploit where they could block punts every single time, so since I was locked into punting on most plays, it was a 100% guaranteed block for them.

That was the last straw for me and online play. No more playing people I know, hunting sim games, screw all that, I'll just wait until Fair Play is a natural byproduct of the gameplay and A.I.. And if it never happens, then I can live with never playing online again.

[dkp23]

In the NFL, you have an option to go on 4th, just like a lot of people saying in this thread already, whether its 4 and 1 or 4th and 25 at your own 15, you should have the option to go for it.

Same goes for no huddle, the solution to no huddle offense is apprpriate fatigue for players on the offense. Oline dont hold blocks as long and prone to false starts, quarterbacks accuracy is a little off, WR/RB lose some speed, etc etc....That would be the most reasonable solution.

[NiNjaPoOn619]

I don't think it is the matter of "Fair Play" but more of a matter of the nitty details to the gameplay that could prevent people from cheating or overusing something unfair. I think people can do whatever they want online as part of the gameplay. For example, people going for no huddle. The colts in the nfl always do no huddle even if it wasn't the two min warning. Like the people suggested, i think there should be a reasonable way to counteract that like a fatigue issue making the players less "skillfull" in their ability or allowing the defense to quickly response to the adjustment. I like how EA impliments the fatigue rule this yr w/ the defense so that the defense won't sub out as much.

Also I see people overusing the QB sneak goaline play whenever they are within two yards. I think this play is too powerful such that there is no way to stop them to gain one or two yards. In the real nfl you don't see QB sneak on every 3rd and 1 or 4nd and 2, etc. Rarely do you see QB sneak within two yds of the goaline. I think people are overusing this play. Even if you do Jam Middle and adjust ur line to the middle and do Run Commit, they still get two yds out of it. In the nfl, you don't see such a successful rate. QB might get an inch or even lose yd and fumble most of the time. I don't see that in madden. It is like an automatic play to get easy yard.

Another issue to gameplay is probably the onside kick. I don't mind stupid people doing offside kick in the first or third quarter because the success rate is not nearly as high as a QB sneak but at least allow the opponent the opportunity to defend it by many in the play selection scene to alert players that the other player is doing an onside kick.

Finally the last thing I want to point out is the disconnecting when losing. In the 20 games I play so far online, about many 40% of the people that were losing disconnect from the game. Obviously, I don't think the opponent had some kind of a "disconnection" problem but more like they don't want to take it like a man and lose. I think of the people who actually disconnects, 99% of the ppl intentionally does it just to prevent a loss. Correct me if I am wrong but some people that disconnects don't even record them as a loss and that some people actually was winning and had their opponent quits on them don't get the win some of the time either. I think this issue should be fixed. For example, the "cheater" should be suspended for a period of time if they got "disconnected" and if they continue to do so, the suspension should be longer. And after the third quarter, if someone get disconnected, regardless if it was an internet problem or if the person is being a quitter, should be counted as a loss and the opponent who was winning should be counted as a win and w/o having the finish the game w/ the cpu.

In conclusion, I don't think it is the matter of having restriction of the number of "plays" they can do or the numbers of no huddles they can use. But it is the matter of ppl having more ways to counteract that usage. Players should have their freedom to do whatever they want but we can "limit" that by giving the other players the weapon to prevent such "unfair plays."