Followup on the Gang Tackling Response

[moose1619]

Quote: Originally Posted by moose1619

Looking at the videos it looks like some of the olind d line interaction problems comes from the motion capture. I mean most lineman stand straight up, this is not what they do in the game of football. Couldn't some new mocap with lineman help at least with the look of the line interaction. Couldn't EA at least get some kick step animations for pass blocking in there so the line can look like it would in a game. Also some mo-cap of a lineman down blocking, pulling, and zone blocking. To me this would abe a great start of getting the oline/dline interaction right. I know most colleges and nfl teams have extensive endzone cameras and this would be a great tool to start with. And then mo cap some new animations to resemble a real line. Also doesn't some of the animations still look real jerky? I'm liking everything else except the tackle along the sidelines when the RBs legs are taking out and it looks like he is almost trucked backwards. Keep up the good work Ian.

I went and looked at some more video and I did see some kick step animation for OT's. But the bid old guards look like they still stand straight up, but seeing this made me feel better.

[mrnoobie]

Quote: Originally Posted by Scott

Hopefully it'll be changed in the future

with Ian around my confidence in the series has been rekindled

its already taking some strides imo..

[Danimal]

Any comments on the WR/DB thread?

Sorry secondary play is my passion

[BrianFifaFan]

Quote: Originally Posted by TheFuture15

Great question. There's good news and bad news with this one. The bad news is that we didn't create branching animation tech for defenders engaging with offensive guys. There are 2 points of good news: - We now actually have our disengaged special moves working really well so if you hit LB/L1 BEFORE you get engaged you can beat the blocker without the "suction dance". Once you get engaged though, it's pretty much the same as last year. - We DID put these windows for defenders on tackling to go for the strip. This means that in basically every tackle you can try to strip the ball away from him after that tackle has started (you can't if you aren't near the ball obviously). It's a pretty good balance - defenders can go for the strip and risk losing their grip on the ballcarrier, and ballcarriers can try to use a special move out of it but now they're open for fumbling more as they fight for more yards. But I think you've pretty much figured out how we'll be approaching OL/DL play for next year though. We love our new tech.

It's cool. I do like the new tech. I'm a Fifa junkie and have been really excited as to how I'm seeing it's influence on Madden. (the animation tech, that is) I'm patient enough to watch this game go through the progression, especially knowing there are guys who really want to grow this game into something really special. But I still have to give a rib-poke. You guys are still the second best EA Sports studio right now. (cough, EAC,cough) What you gonna do?

[moose1619]

Quote: Originally Posted by TheFuture15

This is good fodder for me to showcase in a video...we actually re-captured nearly all of our line moves for this year but the dev-side task got cut (as you know). The new mocap is actually quite good.

Ian, I am by no means a rocket scientist, escpecially video game programming or any thing close. My question is can rules base logic be programmed to certain positions. Example, on an certain offensive play, the rule for the lineman is on a 3 step drop man on man blocking, but on 5 step it is more of an area blocking to prepare for stunts and twist? Or is the program just block the guy over you? This could also be on certain defensive schemes like man for man coverage, example, the corner covers the #1 reciever the Safety # 2 and the backer may have number 3 out of the backfield to his side, not just assigned to a guy presnap. I'm sure i could think of other examples, but the main question is, is this possible, or is it already implemented. And if it is a dumb question just disregard.

[jfsolo]

Quote: Originally Posted by Briankingsfan

Ok Ian, had to make sure I read all of the posts as not to be repetitive. Here's my question regarding the breakout window for breaking a tackle on offense. Is the same window afforded to the defensive player? Meaning as if we are playing D can I, as a defensive lineman or LB break engagement with my skill moves as not to get caught in the suction dance as years previous? Or is all this work Offensive-side only this year?

This is one of the things that has alway hurt football and basketball games. Users(or even the CPU) have not had the same level of control or freedom with defensive players because they haven't programmed the defenders with access to the same animations or at least a comparable amount of animations thus making them much more stiff and robotic. Its good to hear that this will likely be a major focus for next year.

[WDOgF0reL1fe]

Thanks again Ian. Keep em coming!

[Ian_Cummings_EA]

Quote: Originally Posted by SteelerSpartan

Someone mentioned this earlier, but can the left stick stutters actually throw the CPU defense off??? Or is that mainly for Human against Human and you'll still need to hit the juke button to really get by the cpu??

Just on a random note, I wanted to post our "motivation" behind the stutter step feature...it was this video:

[BrianFifaFan]

Quote: Originally Posted by TheFuture15

Just on a random note, I wanted to post our "motivation" behind the stutter step feature...it was this video:

That's ankle breakin' jockstrap on the turf jukin.......

[Ian_Cummings_EA]

Quote: Originally Posted by moose1619

Ian, I am by no means a rocket scientist, escpecially video game programming or any thing close. My question is can rules base logic be programmed to certain positions. Example, on an certain offensive play, the rule for the lineman is on a 3 step drop man on man blocking, but on 5 step it is more of an area blocking to prepare for stunts and twist? Or is the program just block the guy over you? This could also be on certain defensive schemes like man for man coverage, example, the corner covers the #1 reciever the Safety # 2 and the backer may have number 3 out of the backfield to his side, not just assigned to a guy presnap. I'm sure i could think of other examples, but the main question is, is this possible, or is it already implemented. And if it is a dumb question just disregard.

Our current blocking AI is ridiculously complex. If we told LBzrule to just post basic rules of pass blocking it'd probably take up 4 pages...so now imagine converting that into C++ code. To answer your question, it's mostly all handled algorithmically instead of situationally - the reason for that is that it has to be flexible for user input (i.e. a user-controlled guy on defense blitzes 9 guys from one side or whatever). But moving forward, we do need to have specific situation stuff like the drop back and specific stunt / twist handling.

The other big wrinkle is in animations...the best AI does nothing if the animations aren't there to back it out...which I think is actually a lot of our problem - the logic isn't perfect but it isn't bad, but we don't have adequate animation support for it.