Very good Statement...

[CupCrazyManiac]

Its from the offficial EA Sports Forum and its still NOT CLOSED!
So pls Mods over here do NOT Close it 2.

http://forum.ea.com/eaforum/posts/list/7695784.page


I absolutly agree what he said. Enjoy the read!

11/03/2011 16:20:14 Subject: Dear EA Sport.
Luc Wolfe Joined: 11/01/2011 14:31:21 Messages: 7 Location: Ottawa, Ontario Offline	I've been lucky enough in the past years to get invited to the EA facility and talk with the Dev about the game and how to make it better. There’s a bunch of great guys on the team, and they are all guys with good values. For that I thank you! Sadly while playing NHL 12, I feel cheated, ashamed, and think my contribution gave nothing to the series. I gave a lot of feedback over the past years, I never really heard a thank you or our ideas been being implied to the game. You see hockey is a great sports, this game isn’t great. I hear a lot of times the dev team telling the NHL Gaming World to play fair and don’t use the flaws of the game. Now I’m smart enough to know that every game has a flaw and EA, 2K, Midway and all the other video game company makes flaws, we know no company can’t make a perfect product, you can’t please 100% of the customers. Meaning a lot of exploits should of been taken care of 2 games ago. Although, I see no effort from the development team. I’m also wondering if they are even playing their own game. Like I would feel proud to be working on a title where many hockey fans sitting on their couch, having a beer or a pop have a blast. But this game is a shame to all of us. Year after year we see the exact same thing happening. Don’t even try to say the opposite. Look at the gameplay, to what it is right now, the tuners seems to be rushed, the update has more issues then the previous versions. I don’t want to be negative person, I try to stay positive as most at the time. I’ve heard from a few guys over EA saying that: guys don’t be negative we won’t take consideration of your feedback”. Well I’m sorry but how can we be positive when we play a game that’s going downhill. You guys will be getting positive feedback when you deserve it, but at this time, you deserve to be facing the music. You give us a game where fans feel abandon. Remember around 7-8 years ago where EA was on top for the best NHL game, then 2K Sports showed more pride in their product, and they took the lead. Well guess what! I sure hope it happens again! EA Sports Game Changers: To be honest with you guys, I have no issue with you. You’ve all earned it to be recognized by the NHL community. Sadly kissing EA’s “you know what” is getting quite old. I know some of you, believe me you are all great person, although some of you ain’t helping the community, development team, the fans in general. What I think went wrong with the NHL Series? I think by adding many games modes and never fixing the gameplay. You can add as many game mode in a year, but if you don’t touch your gameplay you’ve actually went backwards then progress. I’m sorry but often at looking at the goals going in, I think, not much change since NHL 07. Yeah I’ll give you this year that on the break aways is harder to score, but it be nice to see the goalie stop a puck from the blue line with no traffic in front. Oh yeah it ends up as a five hole goal too! By the way the legends was the biggest mistake ever made! Plain stupid, you made yourself looked bad from all the reviewers. You guys, have great ideas, but the choice that this year the biggest improvement was to add overrated copy-paste players is disappointed. Now trust me it's sweet to play as the great one, but the unlockable era, have done it's time. Give us the ability to play them from the start or simply nevermind. I'm sure this feature would of been more appreciated if it was in the first to be announced. Which makes me sad is mostly the cost of that being on to the product where it was so much needed elsewhere. What does mostly of the NHL gaming fans want to see? - We all want to see an authentic game where the total of shots might make a difference, meaning a fatigue team for always being in their zone. - Most hockey games scores are, 2-1, 3-2, 3-1, 4-0 not 9-8, 6-5, 7-3, 11-3 with 12 shots vs 44. Yes I totally understand you might get the odd game where everything works your way, but not all the time, that’s fantasy. We aren’t play football, hockey is a hard game to score points, especially with the talent of today. - Passing, if there’s something hard in hockey is a tape to tape passing between 3 players, but with this game its either a joke, or the pass doesn’t even go near its receiver. -Momentum means a lot in hockey, this game has none, no penalty after the wishtle, meaning u can do what ever you want , theirs no penalty, and the good guys aren’t rewarded. Fighting has very few affect unlike the real life. - Rivalry between teams, well there’s none; I think NHL 2004 had done a better job! (8 years ago) - Hitting, EA Sports were bragging about their new collision system 2 years ago. Hey I’ll be honest I brag too all of the NHL gaming community they were in for a treat since you guys were doing an awesome job. Today’s it’s a totally different opinion, why does the dekes disable to ability to get hit, that’s where all your cheap goals get score. 1) you can’t hit 2) poke check will end up tripping the opponent 3) poke check will deflect to poke to the opposition stick since it’s a magnet like all previous years. - Puck Physics: well its sad, puck will go through a crowd, poke check doesn’t even make sense it ALWAYS ends up on a stick, never it will be loose in the play. - Goalies are live, Nope! It’s awesome you finally made it happen to hit the goalie but sadly, there must be a condition, its either the puck is near him. - Hockey is fun, this is far from being fun. -Stop creating new game modes, just stop and focus on gameplay and you’ll see all other game modes be a lot better by not touching them. What do I want to see from this topic? 1) I don’t want to see this close 2) I’d love to hear from EA Sports directly. 3) I want EA to learn from this so they can continue I mean restart doing a good product to their fans. I’m not a fan favourite, and I don’t plan too. I don’t kiss anyone “you know what”. I just give my opinion. I really hope the future for NHL games is better than this! Sincerely, Luc Wolfe
	EA Sports NHL Series Community Leader ctn founder // http://www.crashthenet.ca/community

[theLanky]

hate to say it, but this is what you're REALLY going to "see from this topic" (in red):

What do I want to see from this topic?
1) I don’t want to see this close (Good luck with that...i'm surprised it's not closed already)
2) I’d love to hear from EA Sports directly. (Again, good luck with that)
3) I want EA to learn from this so they can continue I mean restart doing a good product to their fans. (The game has shipped...they're selling better than ever...they're not going to fix ANYTHING)
I’m not a fan favourite, and I don’t plan too. I don’t kiss anyone “you know what”. I just give my opinion. (The way EA looks at it is, "opinions are like a-holes...everyone has one, and you're in the minority)

I really hope the future for NHL games is better than this! (if you want rock'em-sock'em hockey, then yeah, it'll get better than this...if you're looking for a "sim" type game where they cater to the hardcore player, you're better off creating a game yourself...EA isn't going to do it...it's not profitable)

[Money99]

I have to give Luc props.
He's a community guy and has been invited out to EAC for several years now.
He'll probably be removed from the list now.

But he deserves credit for telling it like it is.

While I think we all know the devs are great guys and try their best, it's obvious there are flaws with this game.
The skating is still super messed up and has been since NHL07 and yet I've seen nothing to indicate they want to fix it.
The CPU will still continue to perform moves that defy all logic and physics. But the AI needs to be able to do that in order to be competitive against the human player.

Same with presentation, arena's, graphics, etc. Nothing's really been touched for over 5 years now.

I'm glad Luc said something. His words carry weight because he always gets a free ride out to Vancouver to test drive the game months in advance. Regardless if you agree or disagree with his post, most guys would keep their mouths shut in order to continue riding the gravy train.

At this point though, this game will stay on the same rails it is now. Only next-gen consoles or perhaps another company making a hockey game will change that course.
But for now, expect NHL13 to be almost exactly like 12, 11, 10, 9....
We'll get the same commentary, presentation will be stale and you'll still see the CPU do things you'll never be able to.

[CupCrazyManiac]

@Money99
i agree. You and me know Luc is a loooong years BIG Hockey Nut and deserves credit for telling it like it is!
As you said, mostly off all would keep their mouths shut in order to continue riding the gravy train.

[catcatch22]

Just don't buy the game. You are wasting your time complaining. They made their commitment to what this game was gonna be years ago. Now it is just maintenance.

I did not purchase this year and probably will not for a long time. Believe me you will find there are other things to do than play a hockey game. If you find the game no longer fun due to the lack of improvements then it just means you have matured past the enjoyment for this "type" of game.

At this point they would seemingly have to start from scratch to get things right. If Madden will not do it why would the EA hockey team. Especially when there is no competition and the game is selling more units. If you are unable to stomach it now it will only get worst for you when it comes to enjoyment.

[Qb]

Luc raises some good points, many of which I heard him say in person at the NHL11 community event. As for "keeping mouths shut" and all that, the key is to stick to the criticizing the game, not the people who make it. It's all the crap about being lazy/stupid/dishonest/evil-money-hungry-corporation-intent-on-taking-over-the-world-while-programming-a-hunk-of-plastic-to-cheat-me-while-I-do-everything-perfectly that doesn't do any good that causes the good stuff to get overlooked.

I don't like the lack of communication/interaction this year any more than anyone else. And I'm disappointed with certain aspects of the game, particularly when some appear to take a step back or change due to design decisions (pass receptions?). I don't like the fact that we're seeing small incremental improvements in some areas and others that are mostly neglected or at best maintained.

But if anyone thinks the best way to go about it is to act like a jerk... it's not going to get you anywhere. All of the good stuff one might say will get lost in the sea of crap. I can think of many who have a lot of good ideas and valid criticisms who undermine their points by choosing to present their message in condescending, antagonizing, or otherwise indignant rhetoric.

Now if you'll excuse me, I have a gravy train to catch.

[Money99]

Quote: Originally Posted by Qb

Luc raises some good points, many of which I heard him say in person at the NHL11 community event. As for "keeping mouths shut" and all that, the key is to stick to the criticizing the game, not the people who make it. It's all the crap about being lazy/stupid/dishonest/evil-money-hungry-corporation-intent-on-taking-over-the-world-while-programming-a-hunk-of-plastic-to-cheat-me-while-I-do-everything-perfectly that doesn't do any good that causes the good stuff to get overlooked. I don't like the lack of communication/interaction this year any more than anyone else. And I'm disappointed with certain aspects of the game, particularly when some appear to take a step back or change due to design decisions (pass receptions?). I don't like the fact that we're seeing small incremental improvements in some areas and others that are mostly neglected or at best maintained. But if anyone thinks the best way to go about it is to act like a jerk... it's not going to get you anywhere. All of the good stuff one might say will get lost in the sea of crap. I can think of many who have a lot of good ideas and valid criticisms who undermine their points by choosing to present their message in condescending, antagonizing, or otherwise indignant rhetoric. Now if you'll excuse me, I have a gravy train to catch.

LOL!

Nice post QB. I agree with you on a lot of that. Personal attacks aren't warranted.

But do you think that the EA team honestly takes into consideration anything the community guys say?
I've been complaining for years about the lack of player separation from the CPU. And from what I can tell, a few of the community guys have mentioned this since NHL10.
And yet, they've done nothing to address it.
Or how about the problems with skating? We've seen that move the CPU does where it spins, pivots, changes direction without any loss of speed.
How come that hasn't been fixed yet? It's been in there since NHL08.

At this point, I don't think the devs are even able to do anything. EA knows it's going to make 'X' amount of dollars from their NHL series so why do anything drastic.
They probably cut their resources considerably ever since 2K left the arena.
It's status quo now.
The fact that they couldn't even get Thorne and Clement in there to lay down new audio on the Bruins winning a Cup proves that point to me.
They're mailing it in. As long as they continue to make new "Back of the Box" features, they're not going to be killing themselves to revamp, or drastically alter their engine or gameplay.

We'll all need to wait till the new consoles come out for that to happen.

[Qb]

Quote: Originally Posted by Money99

But do you think that the EA team honestly takes into consideration anything the community guys say? I've been complaining for years about the lack of player separation from the CPU. And from what I can tell, a few of the community guys have mentioned this since NHL10. And yet, they've done nothing to address it. Or how about the problems with skating? We've seen that move the CPU does where it spins, pivots, changes direction without any loss of speed. How come that hasn't been fixed yet? It's been in there since NHL08.

You know I share the same concerns on those issues and believe they were hammered home at the NHL11 event I attended. I think there were some small steps taken in both areas, but they still come up short. Part of it is the lumped together ratings across categories, but I believe there is very much an element of overall design philosophy that hinders a more realistic representation.

Depending on the context, yes, I think they listen. Hell, I had devs finishing my sentences at the event when I told them about feedback from OS, even naming names when I'd say "someone suggested..." But to what lengths they can use that feedback is often outside their control. When it comes to "big picture" changes, I suspect much of that is not up for discussion. Which leads to...

Quote:

At this point, I don't think the devs are even able to do anything. EA knows it's going to make 'X' amount of dollars from their NHL series so why do anything drastic. They probably cut their resources considerably ever since 2K left the arena. It's status quo now. The fact that they couldn't even get Thorne and Clement in there to lay down new audio on the Bruins winning a Cup proves that point to me. They're mailing it in. As long as they continue to make new "Back of the Box" features, they're not going to be killing themselves to revamp, or drastically alter their engine or gameplay. We'll all need to wait till the new consoles come out for that to happen.

I don't like to presume to know the inner workings of EA, but I suspect there is some level of truth to this. I do know the NHL team is stretched quite thin these days, or so I've heard from people who would know based on what they do. I think many can relate from their own work experience these days... as staff decreases and work increases, stuff falls through the cracks. It doesn't make it right or even acceptable, but it happens. Couple that dynamic with solid reviews & sales and there is little impetus (and to some extent ability) for sweeping changes coming from the top, which is where the big changes have to come from.

[canucksss]

great read and it feels great that someone like Luc has the guts to spell out to EA the real issue of the game. another post (2nd to original post) was a guy from IGN, agreeing with what Luc stated. but i dont get it with IGN, i dont know if he's the same guy who gave an 8.5 rating for NHL 12 in ign.com, but his complains (IMO) are not valid since he gave the game that high rating.

i love hockey.... and even with ALL the garbage present in NHL 12, i'll still play the game because i have no choice... i love to play NHL games. but i will really wait for 1-2 months next year before buying NHL from EA.

[Fiddy]

IMO they maxed out at what they can do with the NHL series.. this current group, again, IMO needs to go and some fresh guys brought in to take over the series. kinda like what Madden did years back!!

i cant wait to see if Luc is invited back to the community day stuff..

also, most of their game changers are a train wreck on their forums..

lastly, the captains for each teams rosters was the biggest waste of time. they dont post updates for the teams much at all. some teams are represented very well, but 80% of the league isn't!!

i love how ea nhl team want constructive criticism etc, when they havent listen to issues needing addressed for past 3 years or so.

like mentioned above, if these guys are still on board for next year or two, we just need to not buy their game.