Penn State Scandal Thread

[Chip Douglass]

Quote: Originally Posted by ex carrabba fan

The bystander effect seems like a completely different situation. When it's just you and the victim and the molester, it shouldn't be too difficult to contact the police.

And he didn't. He diffused responsibility and reported it to Paterno, in the hope that Paterno would take it to the police.

It's not exactly the same as the bystander effect (diffusion of responsibility would be more appropriate), but my general point is that this event is perfectly explainable if you've studied psychology 101. People aren't intrinsically heroic; they want others to take action.

[Dayman]

Quote: Originally Posted by olliethebum85

Maybe he wasn't sure what he saw right then. You are going to be mentally shaken. It's easy to sit behind a keyboard with a clear head and know exactly what to do, but there is obviously a reason he wasn't charged with failing to report it like the AD was.

Even if you're not totally sure what you saw, you looked in the shower because you heard sexual sounds, and then saw a man and a child.

No excuse. And besides, he called Paterno. Told Paterno what he saw. So he was able to tell someone. How that someone isn't a 911 operator, I have no ****ing idea.

[Dayman]

Quote: Originally Posted by Steelerfan2k1

To me, the grad assistant followed the chain of command. The head coach and AD were given the information they needed to do something about an incident involving the DC. You can't expect the grad assistant to bypass reporting an incident involving a superior to his higher ups.

The chain of command when you think a man is raping a child is this:

You -> Police

Because there's a law being broken. If you see someone murder someone, you don't tell your boss, you call the cops.

[Chip Douglass]

Quote: Originally Posted by olliethebum85

Maybe he wasn't sure what he saw right then. You are going to be mentally shaken. It's easy to sit behind a keyboard with a clear head and know exactly what to do, but there is obviously a reason he wasn't charged with failing to report it like the AD was.

Seriously.

I know people like to think they'd act heroic in that situation, but the typical response would be to contact an authority and leave it alone.

He did the right thing; the morally derelict AD is to blame here.

[Steelerfan2k1]

Quote: Originally Posted by Dayman

The chain of command when you think a man is raping a child is this: You -> Police Because there's a law being broken. If you see someone murder someone, you don't tell your boss, you call the cops.

OK - but it wasn't a murder. He saw a coach in the shower with a kid. "There's a law being broken" - seriously? That's your standard?

You are completely ignoring the organizational context around this. You are being really unfair to the grad assistant.

The grad assistant sees his respected boss (Sandusky was a god at Penn State and revered throughout college football) in a compromising situation with a child. At that moment, the grad student faces a tremendous challenge - should I, a young coach with career aspirations in college football, report my superior on an incident that I witnessed or should I just move on and pretend like nothing happened (i.e. protect myself).

To the GA's credit, he drove to the home of Sandusky's boss and told HC Joe Paterno what he saw. That's a courageous act. He could have easily sat back and said nothing, but chose to call out the behavior to Sandusky's boss.

The GA took it on himself to say something to his superiors about a guy who is way up in the organization/profession. Think about it - how is the GA any different than Sharon Watkins of Enron, who was the only Enron employee who spoke up to her superiors about what she had witnessed (legal/ethical violations)?

[soltrain]

Quote: Originally Posted by Steelerfan2k1

OK - but it wasn't a murder. He saw a coach in the shower with a kid. "There's a law being broken" - seriously? That's your standard?

...You just made me really uncomfortable with that statement.

And for the rest of your post...

There is no "organizational command" when someone is SEXUALLY ASSAULTING A CHILD.

[Steelerfan2k1]

You just made me really uncomfortable with that statement.

And for the rest of your post...

There is no "organizational command" when someone is SEXUALLY ASSAULTING A CHILD.

Huh??????

Again - way to completely ignore the basic fact that you have a Graduate assistant being expected to report on one of the most respected men in all of college football.

OK - instead of me trying to convince you - here is what Pennsylvania's ATTORNEY GENERAL Linda Kelly (has to say on this issue:

“The failure of top university officials to act on reports of Sandusky’s alleged sexual misconduct, even after it was reported to them in graphic detail by an eyewitness, allowed a predator to walk free for years - continuing to target new victims,” Kelly said the news release. “Equally disturbing is the lack of action and apparent lack of concern among those same officials, and others who received information about this case, who either avoided asking difficult questions or chose to look the other way.”

No, wait- according to Dayman and Soltrain - it's not the top university officials who are at fault, it's the low status graduate assistant who bears responsibility for not reporting this incident to the authorities.

Well, guess what Dayman and Soltrain, the PA Attorney General sees it the same way as me.

[Chip Douglass]

Quote: Originally Posted by soltrain

...You just made me really uncomfortable with that statement. And for the rest of your post... There is no "organizational command" when someone is SEXUALLY ASSAULTING A CHILD.

Again, easy to say in hindsight in front of a computer screen.

I'll put down cash money on the vast majority of people not acting any differently than the GA in that situation.

[Gotmadskillzson]

Hell that is just the kids he did at Penn St......this guy also ran an At Risk Kids program since the 1970s.....Who knows how many at risk kids he abused over the decades as well.

[soltrain]

Quote: Originally Posted by Steelerfan2k1

You just made me really uncomfortable with that statement. And for the rest of your post... There is no "organizational command" when someone is SEXUALLY ASSAULTING A CHILD. Huh?????? Again - way to completely ignore the basic fact that you have a Graduate assistant being expected to report on one of the most respected men in all of college football. OK - instead of me trying to convince you - here is what Pennsylvania's ATTORNEY GENERAL Linda Kelly (has to say on this issue: “The failure of top university officials to act on reports of Sandusky’s alleged sexual misconduct, even after it was reported to them in graphic detail by an eyewitness, allowed a predator to walk free for years - continuing to target new victims,” Kelly said the news release. “Equally disturbing is the lack of action and apparent lack of concern among those same officials, and others who received information about this case, who either avoided asking difficult questions or chose to look the other way.” No, wait- according to Dayman and Soltrain - it's not the top university officials who are at fault, it's the low status graduate assistant who bears responsibility for not reporting this incident to the authorities. Well, guess what Dayman and Soltrain, the PA Attorney General sees it the same way as me.

When did I ever say that top university officials weren't to blame?