IU-UK Series

[jake44np]

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-bask...collapse-again

So IU came up with senario in which both schools could have what they want and UK still wont play them??

According to a letter obtained Wednesday by The Associated Press, the two athletic directors reopened negotiations May 10. Two weeks later, the letter said, Kentucky rejected Indiana's offer for a four-year extension that would have put the first two games at Lucas Oil Stadium, which Wildcats coach John Calipari wanted. The third game would have been played at Kentucky and the fourth at Indiana.

Cal just needs to come out and admit that he wants no part of playing IU and no I am not saying he is scared of them. But it is pretty obvious he doesnt want to play IU. Just say it and we can all move on. IU has done everything they can to continue this series and UK doesnt want to play anymore.

[Bighoff]

I totally agree, Cal just doesn't want to play IU. I would love it if Indiana and Louisville decided to play every year.

[PhantomPain]

The only thing I will say about this is that Cal refuses to schedule anyone for longer than 2 years at a time. Not saying I agree with it, but it's his team. Roster changes significantly from year to year so he doesn't want to put his team in a bad spot.

Again, as a fan I would like to see the series continue. But Cal doesn't want to do a home and home right now and won't schedule beyond 2 years. IU wants a home and home and offered to compromise with a 4 year deal. UK is still saying they can and will play IU this upcoming season but in Indianapolis. IU doesn't want to do it.

It's dead. Let's move on.

[phenom1990]

It's because Indiana Kentucky is great for the sport especially with Indiana reemerging into the national scene. Since UNC Kentucky won't be happening this year,I really hope they can figure this out.

[jake44np]

Quote: Originally Posted by PhantomPain

The only thing I will say about this is that Cal refuses to schedule anyone for longer than 2 years at a time. Not saying I agree with it, but it's his team. Roster changes significantly from year to year so he doesn't want to put his team in a bad spot. Again, as a fan I would like to see the series continue. But Cal doesn't want to do a home and home right now and won't schedule beyond 2 years. IU wants a home and home and offered to compromise with a 4 year deal. UK is still saying they can and will play IU this upcoming season but in Indianapolis. IU doesn't want to do it. It's dead. Let's move on.

And thats just crap.
He doesnt want to put his team in a bad spot???
Your UK when are you going to ever be in a bad spot?
If there in a bad spot its his fault.
Bottom line is this latest proposal would have given both schools what they said they wanted and Cal still wont do it.
I never would have thought in a million years that Cal would duct anyone but that is exactly what he is doing. And we the fans are the ones losing here!

[PhantomPain]

Quote: Originally Posted by jake44np

And thats just crap. He doesnt want to put his team in a bad spot??? Your UK when are you going to ever be in a bad spot? If there in a bad spot its his fault. Bottom line is this latest proposal would have given both schools what they said they wanted and Cal still wont do it. I never would have thought in a million years that Cal would duct anyone but that is exactly what he is doing. And we the fans are the ones losing here!

I don't understand how all IU fans just put 100% blame on Cal/UK. IU wouldn't budge from their stance just as much as UK wouldn't budge. IU called UK to cancel the series, not the other way around. UK immediately went into negotiations with Baylor and potentially duke. Also renewed the series with unc starting next year. IU came back to UK with a compromise, but UK already had other obligations and as I said, Cal doesn't want to schedule too far in advance, like it or not it is his prerogative. You can't say UK/Cal are ducking IU when UK is still offering to play them, just not at IU. I can just as easily say Crean is ducking UK if he won't play them on a neutral court in their own state. It goes both ways.

In the end, the series is dead for now. You can twist it and spin it any way you want, but the fact of the matter is, IU and UK have both offered compromises and neither accepted them. Stop acting like UK/Cal is afraid to play IU. Personally I don't think either team is afraid of the other, they just have different plans for their teams that doesn't gel with each other.

As for your other point, how does it not make sense to you? UK has shown that every year they will have a near completely new roster. So far it has worked out well, but what happens when it doesn't? Scheduling is extremely important to a team's success. Cal's job, and every other major coach's job, is to put the best team on the floor and setting them up for success. It's a little harder to do that when you aren't sure what your roster well look like in 2 to 3 years. UK is in a position where they can control this stuff. They have fans that travel more than anyone which means high revenue for UK and the opponent. They are, these days, a top program every year. And everyone wants a chance to beat the big bad cats of college basketball. Remember, in the end this is nothing more than a business.

I do agree that the fans are the ones that are hurt the most, but please stop acting like Crean/IU are such victims here and this is all UK's fault.

[Koolie G]

I wish UK and IU would play. But that being said, there is more to this story.

1. The letter that you mention in the first post was sent AFTER the IU AD had said PUBLICLY there was no agreement and they were not going to play because IU would not agree to play 2 neutral site games in the state of Indiana at Lucas Oil Stadium.

2. UK then scheduled Baylor and are working on a yearly series with Duke. When IU came back with the 2 neutral site games and the 2 home games, UK said no thanks, we have other games now.

3. UK dropped UNC from the schedule this year ONLY, the series will renew next year so that both teams could balance their home schedules, ie UK will now have UNC at home one year and then Louisville at home the next.

4. The UK administration is not happy with the way the crowd was controlled in Bloomington this year. The stories are out there if you want to look them up, but UK fans were not treated well and it was a hostile environment, much more so than your normal rival away game. I don't care if they rushed the court, it was a big time win for IU and if they want to rush the court that is fine, but they can't complain if UK is worried about safety if they came back. Maybe that's a good reason, maybe it's not, but if you add it on to the list of other reasons, it doesn't weigh in favor of going back to Bloomington.

5. You can't say Calipari is ducking anyone when they agreed to play them in the state of Indiana both games. You also are not ducking anyone when the game this year was supposed to be played in Lexington. UK was willing to give up that home game to play in a bigger "football stadium" venue and split the revenue. Not only that but the stadium is in the capital of Indiana. How is that ducking IU?

6. UK's non-conference schedule next year includes, Duke, Maryland, Baylor, Notre Dame, and Louisville. The next year it will also include UNC.
I understand IU is going to be a top 3 team next and I would love for UK to play them, but UK doesn't need this game like IU needs this game and that is just the bottom line.

7. What's the big deal? I know this is a rivalry that has been played for many years, (more at neutral sites in the recent past and not on campus), but it is not going to ruin college basketball. There are plenty of marquee matchups, just look at #6. Maybe they will play next year, maybe they will play in 2 or 3 years.

When Knight was Coach at IU, he wanted to play neutral site games, now that Crean is there (and maybe more importantly the new AD) they want to play in Bloomington. The two school's positions have switched, why is UK the only one in the wrong? Doesn't make sense.

8. Finally, IU's STATED reason for wanting a home game is so their students can attend and have a chance to experience a game agaisnt UK. That is flattering, but I'm sure games against Mich St., Ohio State, etc. are great for the college experience of those students. And couldn't IU bus their students from Bloomington to Indianapolis for the neutral site game, where even more students could go to the game because the stadium is bigger? It is only 53 miles from Bloomington to Indianapolis, I just can't believe that IU students couldn't get to that game.

9. People in the know at both schools still think they may work out a deal to play this year. I'm not holding my breath, but I would love to see them play.

[jake44np]

Allright I have figured out it is pointless to argue with UK fans on anything so this will be my last post about anything related to UK basketball. I have enjoyed (usually trying to be as nuetral as I can) discussing UK bball with all the UK fans on this site but it has become obvious to me that you are blinded by Cal and his ways. Go back and look I came to UK's anc Cal's defense more than once on these boards when other schools fans were bashing them.
Bottom line is the loss at IU this past year put a really bad taste in his mouth and he never wants to taste that again. So he has decided to never play at IU again. IU came up with a plan that would give both schools what they wanted and Cal is being Cal and will not agree to it. Cal isnt getting exactly what he wants so he is taking his ball and going home.
Go read any article out there from a nuetral source and 99% of them will tell you this is on UK (REALLY ON CAL) and not IU. And IU does not need this series at all it is just a tradition they wanted to keep. Not sure if you guys know or not but the states have a long standing tradition of playing and the states are pretty close to each other. IU will be ranked #1 in most polls to start next year and play in a much better conference than UK so they dont "need" this game more than UK.

[PhantomPain]

Quote: Originally Posted by jake44np

Allright I have figured out it is pointless to argue with UK fans on anything so this will be my last post about anything related to UK basketball. I have enjoyed (usually trying to be as nuetral as I can) discussing UK bball with all the UK fans on this site but it has become obvious to me that you are blinded by Cal and his ways. Go back and look I came to UK's anc Cal's defense more than once on these boards when other schools fans were bashing them. Bottom line is the loss at IU this past year put a really bad taste in his mouth and he never wants to taste that again. So he has decided to never play at IU again. IU came up with a plan that would give both schools what they wanted and Cal is being Cal and will not agree to it. Cal isnt getting exactly what he wants so he is taking his ball and going home. Go read any article out there from a nuetral source and 99% of them will tell you this is on UK (REALLY ON CAL) and not IU. And IU does not need this series at all it is just a tradition they wanted to keep. Not sure if you guys know or not but the states have a long standing tradition of playing and the states are pretty close to each other. IU will be ranked #1 in most polls to start next year and play in a much better conference than UK so they dont "need" this game more than UK.

Jake, it's your prerogative for what discussions you participate in and I respect that. But seriously? This is the stance you take in a very civil conversation. UK fans here, at least in this thread, have all acknowledged that we would like to play IU annually. So I don't get why you are "taking your ball and going home." Nobody is being hateful and I think both fans have great points.

With that said, don't be ridiculous. It isn't like Cal had never lost a game. So because IU wins on a last second killer 3, he is now afraid to play IU? You answered none of my questions. How can UK/Cal be afraid to play IU when the offer is still on the table? Why is it that IU is of no fault on this when they aren't budging from their stance? The big ten is not that great of a conference and UK has several marquee games, so yeah, IU needs this more than UK. Again, IU cancelled the series, not UK. You want to argue with someone, go argue with them. IU is an incredible atmosphere and a great advantage for IU. Easy to see when you look at IU's record last year at home compared to away games.

You don't want to respond, fine. But this site has, for the overwhelming most part, rational and civil UK fans. Don't try to make us out to be the bad guys here. It's called a debate. Would you rather we just agree with everything you say? Would that make you feel better? Doesn't matter because that won't happen. And I do know and agree you are typically complimentary of UK/Cal. But in this case, you are drinking just as much kool-aid by saying this is all UK's fault. It takes 2 to tango my friend and IU is being just as stubborn.

[jake44np]

Like i said i am done agruing and talking about UK and Cal.
And this is not about UK-it is laughable and shows some blindness to say the Big Ten is not that good of a conference! lol
Go check out the final RPI rankings for last year my friend.
The big 10 had 5 of the top 15 teams, the SEC had exactly one. They also had 4 teams in the sweet 16.
You lose some credibilty when you blindly say the big 10 is not a good bball conference to try to deflate one of my points.