the os ladder crying, complaining thread(with a tad bit of strategy)

[CreatineKasey]

Quote: Originally Posted by elgreazy1

I think if CAPs are included it should be a seperate ladder tourney. Honestly, it wouldn't hurt to have two different ladders to climb. In fact, it would adhere more to APF's strengths. Think about it: Classic APF Ladder where you are "limited" be pre-set parameters (ie: in-game Legends, less rules, etc). This is how APF devs created the game, stock, for quick pick-up games, different team looks, learning & implementing how real Legends played to their strengths, etc. Custom APF Ladder where the users take full power of what APF offers (CAPs, unique team builds, unique Legend-personel usage, etc). These tiny nuances is how the devs added depth & replay value to the game. Maybe for fun each team would set up a top 10 or standings on each tourney's first thread page. Ya know, update it once a week or so to show current standing/leader boards. Hmm, in fact, if I had a way to screen capture games (besides with a digital camera) I could create us some graphics banners/placeholders & use them as extra credit for my Digital Imaging class. LoL Who knows, maybe once every 2 tourneys we have an inter-league mini-tourney for APF supremacy or bragging rights. Kinda like mini-leagues within leagues ie: AFL (not Arena) vs NFL

I like this. If anyone wants to put together and run a Custom APF ladder, have at it. I really like the set up for this ladder being so user friendly, and it appeals to me the most. I'd definitely be up for a championship match between ladders or something. I'd join the custom ladder too probably, but I want THIS ladder to use legends.

[Phobia]

Quote: Originally Posted by DavonBrown

I thought the same thing. But think about it, some guys just flat out deserves those abilities. All of the abilities you mentioned above only have about 2 or 3 guys that has the ability. I agree with the Speed Burner and Break Away Burst combo, but I gave it to guys who can flat out run like Devin Hester, Ted Ginn, and Chris Johnson. Only a couple people such as Brandon Jacobs and Michael Turner have the Branching Tackles ability because their legs never stop moving and it is rare that one guy brings them down alone. Peyton Manning is the only QB who deserves the Cadence ability. Nobody has the Signal Stealer ability or the Finesse and Power ability. How can you deny guys like Brees, Warner, Pennington, and Manning the Laser Arm ability. Pennington is the most accurate QB ever. Also, how will you separate the elite QBs from the average Trent Edwards if that ability isn't used? I don't use the finesse ability. Brandon Jacobs, Marion Barber, and Jamal Lewis are the only guys with power ability. Reggie Wayne is the only guy with the Route God ability and I don't mind changing it to Possession Receiver. I never use Scissor Kick. What is wrong with Closing Speed? Why is it banned?

I am not saying your logic is wrong based on the description of the abilities. I am saying the abilities themselves are over powered. I will explain.

Cadence - Yes Manning might be the best at it but in the game it can be abused

Branch Tackles - Tapping A to break out of tackles happens enough on its own. Strength Bonus or work horse will net similar results. Matter of fact from a stat perspective I saw a huge issue with branch tackles. After branch tackles was removed broken tackles went down but stay realistic.

Laser arm - While the description talks about pin point accuracy. It really also adds more zip on the ball. This fully breaks the secondary. Routes that can't be covered because the ball is moving much to fast to the relation of the player speeds. Without it the defense has time to react. Gold QBs still have more power than silvers, silvers more than bronze. They have plenty enough accuracy to begin with. Don't let descriptions lead you to match it with a real life trait.

Route god - It makes wrs cut on a dime. The issue with this is that pass defense is all ready shady to start with. Then combine the fact there is no defense ability for defenders to cut and stay with them. You can really abuse this ability if you choose to.

Closing speed - One of the worst of the bunch. Just make a team of bronze defenders with closing speed. It is like having automatic come back on in racing games. The guy just out of no where runs at inhuman speeds. A bronze defender with closing speed is all you need and can have a very solid defense.

Power and Finesse - these are touch subjects. The ability them selves are fine. I just rather have a player use 2 slots for abilities rather than have 1 ability give them 2 to 4 abilities. But this one could be fine when used correctly when building a sim set like you are.

Anyones I missed that are in question feel free to let me know.

[ANDROMADA 1]

Quote: Originally Posted by DavonBrown

I'm glad someone agrees with me. I didn't want to give AP finesse and power because I thought people would complain online but he truly deserves it.

Its a no-brainer to me.There are only a handful of atheletes that fit a multitude of abilities,but when you have guys that are off the charts it poses problems,guys like Moss,Brady,Manning,AP,CJ,Patrick Willis,Felix,Andre Johnson,Calvin Johnson,and so many guys in between.There is no defense or offense to stop or expose these guys completely you can only hope to contain them.I've made a couple guys just to mess around with offline.It is fun but I wouldnt play somebody with them unless we were both doing it and just for fun of course.

[DavonBrown]

Quote: Originally Posted by Phobia

I am not saying your logic is wrong based on the description of the abilities. I am saying the abilities themselves are over powered. I will explain. Cadence - Yes Manning might be the best at it but in the game it can be abused Branch Tackles - Tapping A to break out of tackles happens enough on its own. Strength Bonus or work horse will net similar results. Matter of fact from a stat perspective I saw a huge issue with branch tackles. After branch tackles was removed broken tackles went down but stay realistic. Laser arm - While the description talks about pin point accuracy. It really also adds more zip on the ball. This fully breaks the secondary. Routes that can't be covered because the ball is moving much to fast to the relation of the player speeds. Without it the defense has time to react. Gold QBs still have more power than silvers, silvers more than bronze. They have plenty enough accuracy to begin with. Don't let descriptions lead you to match it with a real life trait. Route god - It makes wrs cut on a dime. The issue with this is that pass defense is all ready shady to start with. Then combine the fact there is no defense ability for defenders to cut and stay with them. You can really abuse this ability if you choose to. Closing speed - One of the worst of the bunch. Just make a team of bronze defenders with closing speed. It is like having automatic come back on in racing games. The guy just out of no where runs at inhuman speeds. A bronze defender with closing speed is all you need and can have a very solid defense. Power and Finesse - these are touch subjects. The ability them selves are fine. I just rather have a player use 2 slots for abilities rather than have 1 ability give them 2 to 4 abilities. But this one could be fine when used correctly when building a sim set like you are. Anyones I missed that are in question feel free to let me know.

Thanks for the understanding. I was just matching the abilities to the athlete by reading the description. I am gonna remove the Closing Speed, Cadence, and Route God abilities from my roster. I gave Michael Turner Strength so now Brandon Jacobs is the only guy with the Branching Tackles ability. I am still on the fence about the Laser Arm thing. Arm you telling me that my Gold tier QB with Pocket Presence would be more accurate than my Bronze tier QB with Pocket Presence? Also how do you feel about Adrian Peterson having the Finesse and Power ability?

[Phobia]

Quote: Originally Posted by DavonBrown

Thanks for the understanding. I was just matching the abilities to the athlete by reading the description. I am gonna remove the Closing Speed, Cadence, and Route God abilities from my roster. I gave Michael Turner Strength so now Brandon Jacobs is the only guy with the Branching Tackles ability. I am still on the fence about the Laser Arm thing. Arm you telling me that my Gold tier QB with Pocket Presence would be more accurate than my Bronze tier QB with Pocket Presence? Also how do you feel about Adrian Peterson having the Finesse and Power ability?

I think those are great changes. Not in regard to the descriptions but in regard to the realism of the sport.

Closing speed, Cadence, route god, laser arm, and quick release are big no no's in my book.

Yes a gold will be much more accurate than a bronze with pocket presence.

I also agree Peterson could have it. I think he is one of the only in the nfl worthy of that ability right now.

My dad ran with a created Saints team and he had Brees with Pocket presence, Laser arm, and Quick release. It was pure domination. Perfect accuracy, could not sack him, and pocket presence helps accuracy to begin with so it was pure god like.

Now his Brees now with Pocket presence, Leadership, and Pass threat(I rather Clutch for him). It is still a GREAT QB and rivals for the QB of the year in the league. But it is still in the realm of realism and does not seem like you are facing a immortal lol.

[ANDROMADA 1]

To:Phobia

I agree with a lot of what you say here.I would add that I am not a fan of ball hawk,clutch,or 4th qtr too boot.Mostly clutch and 4th qtr.Its like all of a sudden your legend defenders forget how to play when you need them most.smh

[Phobia]

Quote: Originally Posted by ANDROMADA 1

To:Phobia I agree with a lot of what you say here.I would add that I am not a fan of ball hawk,clutch,or 4th qtr too boot.Mostly clutch and 4th qtr.Its like all of a sudden your legend defenders forget how to play when you need them most.smh

I don't know Andro, I played with a guy with Clutch and I noticed very little difference in his game. Same thing with 4th quarter comeback. but you could be completely right and I just have not played with or against those abilities enough.

Now ball hawk I think is a great ability. Reason being because it is one of the few abilities to make the secondary little better. It gives you that fear of throwing to that side of the field. Which certain good Cb's do in real life. Plus in APF the QB is at the greater advantage than the defense so I see it being a decent ability for pass defense.

[wEEman33]

The only defensive abilities that really need to be limited in this game are closing speed and signal stealer IMO.

I feel like everything else is fair game on defense since the offense is at such a huge advantage to begin with in APF.

Offensively, I think the game is a lot more balanced without the following abilities:

Quote:

route god - makes even a bronze player completely unguardable branching tackles - there are plenty of branched tackles in this game by default; this just makes it even worse workhorse - like the branching tackles ability, this just creates way too many broken tackles. speed burner + breakaway burst - only NFL guy I'd give both to would be Chris Johnson. finesse and power - only NFL guy I'd give it to is AP. cadence - this is a known exploit in the game that can give you free first downs pretty much at will. rocket arm + laser arm - only NFL guy I'd give it to would be Peyton Manning. quick release - give this to a bronze and he's basically a silver in disguise. Give this to a silver or above and he becomes a god.

Everything else is fair game for offense so long as the abilities are within reason.

I don't have anything against laser arm so long as it's not paired with rocket arm or quick release. Laser arm by itself is helpful but not overpowering IMO.

For a good example of that, try playing with a silver or bronze QB who only has the laser arm attribute, and you'll see that they are still quite mortal due to their lack of arm strength and slow release.

[ANDROMADA 1]

Quote: Originally Posted by Phobia

I don't know Andro, I played with a guy with Clutch and I noticed very little difference in his game. Same thing with 4th quarter comeback. but you could be completely right and I just have not played with or against those abilities enough. Now ball hawk I think is a great ability. Reason being because it is one of the few abilities to make the secondary little better. It gives you that fear of throwing to that side of the field. Which certain good Cb's do in real life. Plus in APF the QB is at the greater advantage than the defense so I see it being a decent ability for pass defense.

Try playing a combo of Staubach to Rice or whats his name the bronze wr...Leadership+clutch+4thqtr=automatic TD.You will play okay till about the 4th qter and them like majic..Everybody is W I D E Open...Its laughable.I dont like ball hawk only because sometimes they seem to not attack the ball well.I go for just coverage. or quick feet instead.I've made some spectacular Ints with Renfro.

[NFLHITMAN]

I think Signal Stealer is in the same area as Cadence IMO.