Handling Bullies at School

[Easy Mac]

So my daughter is essentially being bullied at school, or at least as bullied as a 2 and a half year old can be bullied.

There's a little girl the same age. Evidently, according to my wife and kid, will take her snacks or breakfast, toys, pull her hair or what not. Not sure why the teachers aren't doing anything or what, but what do we do?

We'd try to talk to the mom, but she literally pushes her out the door when she drops the kid off in the morning and basically opens the door and the kid runs out on the off chance she's there when we pick our daughter up.

I took my daughter to school this morning, and she ran to the door and was all excited. As soon as she saw the little girl was the only other kid in the room, she was terrified. She clung to me and would not let go for the world. The teacher seemed completely oblivious. I tried to get her to sit down and eat her breakfast at another table, but the teacher made her sit 2 seats over from the other girl.

As long as other kids are there to play with, our daughter is fine, and she has a lot of friends, but she was crying her eyes out this morning.

It shouldn't be my job to say something, especially since I've never seen anything happen, I'm relying on what my kid tells me. I just can't understand how the teachers couldn't notice something that obvious or pick up on why my kid is terrified of this girl.

[gstelmack]

will take her snacks or breakfast

This seems the part that would be easiest for the teachers to take note of. What have the teachers / school had to say? You don't always get the whole story from your kids, but if that is the case then the teachers should be able to tell you exactly what is or is not going on, or should at least be willing to watch what happens while the kids eat. If the teachers CAN'T tell you what's going on, or won't work with you at all, find a new daycare center fast. Otherwise you and they ought to be able to get to the bottom of this.

[MacroGuru]

I would definitely go to the teachers and say something, that way they can be aware of it and keep an eye on it.

My 11 yr old when he was 2 and in day care he had the same issues and no one was paying attention but he hated going and when we figured it out we told the teacher. She was oblivious to it but was surprised it was going on but promised us she would watch.

The next day she pulled us aside and said she witnessed it, spoke to the other child and also pulled the other kids parent aside and explained what was going on.

We didn't have an issue after that.

[CraigSca]

I'd go the teacher route before talking to the parents. In most cases I've found that that mama bear/papa bear kicks in and their kid can either do no wrong, or they just don't care. Have the teacher watch for it and correct it.

[RainMaker]

Yeah, definitely go the teacher route. At that age it's probably not anything sinister and just having an adult keep a watchful eye over it should be enough.

[wade moore]

It shouldn't be my job to say something, especially since I've never seen anything happen, I'm relying on what my kid tells me.

This statement makes no sense to me.

You absolutely, without a doubt, talk to the school. I don't know the class sizes, but it's not atypical for a kid to be able to do these things without teachers noticing. If they don't know, they can't do anything about it.

It is 100% your job to say something.

[Blackadar]

Talk to the teacher. The children in question aren't going to know right from wrong and it's up to the teacher to correct misbehavior.

[hoopsguy]

At my kid's daycare, there are often multiple teachers that she sees throughout the day. There is certainly a "primary" one that we see nearly every day that will be in the same room rather than rotating between rooms - I assume that is the one you are referring to as the "teacher".

If you aren't getting results talking to that person - and by results, I mean assurances that it will be addressed and seeing some kind of improved comfort from your daughter in the short-term - then I would make sure you also talk with the director or whatever title they have for the person responsible for the day care. That person should be the feedback loop if you do not feel that a teacher is addressing your issues.

We've certainly seen kids in day care who have behavior issues, but none that seemed particularly targeted at our daughter. In just about every case, the children we identified as the "instigators" were well known to the teachers already, but they still should be getting the feedback from the parents. The part about the teacher being "oblivious" is probably the thing that concerned me most in reading your post, much more so than a 2-3 year old acting out.

[spleen1015]

Talk to the teacher...

or teach your daughter karate.

[cody8200]

Talk to the teacher.

[Marc Vaughan]

Ask the teacher about your daughter and how she's getting on at school - then zero in on your concerns ...

Reason for taking a tactful approach is simply that it might not be quite the one way street that you might initially think it is ... nothing worse than going in all guns blazing and realizing your little Johnny was part of the problem.

[Easy Mac]

Exactly how I feel, per Marc's response. I don't want to go in there to aggressive and come off as one of "those" parents. I've heard from my wife that the kid is very aggressive towards my daughter, even with my wife there, but not necessarily aggressive negatively. Like the kid wants to play with her and starts touching her and getting in her face, which freaks my daughter out. I've also heard from my wife that my daughter will try to hang up her coat and the kid will take the coat hanger right before she gets to it.

But, I also know my daughter has 2-3 other girls that she almost exclusively plays with, it's very cliquey (spelling?) already. I don't believe this girl is part of the group, and I think she may be trying to get my daughter's attention. So I don't think this girl is a monster or anything, especially at that age.

Also, since race is always an undercurrent, the girl is African-American, so I'm also a little afraid of bringing it to the teachers (also minorities) and have them thinking we're trying to single out one of the children because of their race (there are I believe only 2-3 non-white children of the 15 or 16). I know kids don't really think in those terms, but it is still a sensitive subject when trying to discuss it among adults.

For the time, we've told our daughter if someone does something to her, to tell the teacher and to tell the other child no. My wife said she plans to mention something to the teacher tomorrow.

[Danny]

I think maybe you should stop worrying about how yiu appear to others and just worry about the well being of your daughter

[Toddzilla]

IMO don't just talk to the teacher - press them. It's sometimes too easy fora teacher to nod and agree and play along, only to forget it all the second you leave. Tell them you want something done about it and you'll follow up in a week and get the principal involved if needed. Also, the school should have a social worker or a counselor on staff - mention it to them right away as they often have more resources than a teacher to observer and get involved.

FWIW, I've got no fuse whatsoever for this kind of stuff, so when I walk through the door at my daughter's school they know I mean business ane take it seriously.

Yes, I am *that* parent and you should be, too.

[stevew]

This isn't like elementary school, where you have to accept a situation based in neighborhood geography. You pay to send your kid there. If she is having a bad time, and you cannot get the situation resolved, go somewhere else. all that stability and familiarity shit is overrated if she is having a bad time

(and I can't believe your daughter is 2.5 already...time flies)

[JonInMiddleGA]

I think maybe you should stop worrying about how yiu appear to others and just worry about the well being of your daughter

Ultimately, this.

I completely understand your various concerns but priority one IMO has to be not being in the position to use the words "she was terrified" again. That not something she should be going through at this age nor in that environment and it isn't something you should be reluctant in correcting.

[Chief Rum]

This statement makes no sense to me.

You absolutely, without a doubt, talk to the school. I don't know the class sizes, but it's not atypical for a kid to be able to do these things without teachers noticing. If they don't know, they can't do anything about it.

It is 100% your job to say something.

:+1:

I was pretty surprised to read that statement.

It's not a "shouldn't have to" thing. It's a "she's my daughter, and I can do anything I need to to make sure she's okay" thing.

[Chief Rum]

Wait, am I missing something? Y'all are talking like this is a day care center, but everything I have read from Easy Mac's posts indicates this is a school.

[Marc Vaughan]

IMO don't just talk to the teacher - press them. It's sometimes too easy fora teacher to nod and agree and play along, only to forget it all the second you leave. Tell them you want something done about it and you'll follow up in a week and get the principal involved if needed. Also, the school should have a social worker or a counselor on staff - mention it to them right away as they often have more resources than a teacher to observer and get involved.

FWIW, I've got no fuse whatsoever for this kind of stuff, so when I walk through the door at my daughter's school they know I mean business ane take it seriously.

Yes, I am *that* parent and you should be, too.

I disagree TOTALLY with this - you can often cause a lot of ruckus for something which is minor or totally incorrect.

Kids report things inaccurately, try and approach things on a sane level playing field and see how things go before you go ballistic.

Or to put it another way - if you act a prat then your daughter will be known as the 'daughter of the prat' and labelled as such, affecting not only how teachers treat here (ie. less affection and at arms length because they don't want to be around you) - but also her class mates, word gets around and I wouldn't be surprised if other parents also avoid you and her for the same reasons ....

[Easy Mac]

Wait, am I missing something? Y'all are talking like this is a day care center, but everything I have read from Easy Mac's posts indicates this is a school.

No, sorry, daycare.

[Marc Vaughan]

This isn't like elementary school, where you have to accept a situation based in neighborhood geography. You pay to send your kid there. If she is having a bad time, and you cannot get the situation resolved, go somewhere else. all that stability and familiarity shit is overrated if she is having a bad time

(and I can't believe your daughter is 2.5 already...time flies)

Depends entirely on the situation and circumstances imho.

Frankly speaking 'shit happens' - if you move your kids every time they cry and say they don't want to go to school ... well theres a good chance they'll be attending a LOT of schools during their educational career ;)

My youngest son HATED his last school during his two terms there, he was decidedly unhappy - but it was a good school and the teacher was great, only thing was he hadn't made any firm friends (combined with his English accent and speech issues that made him feel very awkward) and so was miserable.

Last term of the first year a new boy joined the school, they instantly hit it off and from then on he loved the school passionately .... he's moved onto a new one thanks to the school board rezoning us*, but he still harks on about how great his old school was.

Simply put you're the adult - act in an adult fashion and get the full picture before jumping off the deep end; one of the lessons you need to teach your kids about life is that sometimes things suck ... stay positive and keep going, you'll get through it.

*Don't get me started on this side of things in my county - seems ludicrous to me.

[Marc Vaughan]

PS - My kids were terrified of many things I didn't stress over at the age of 2 1/2 ... including the monster under the bed.

At that age imho their best friend one day can be their worst enemy the next ... all it takes is them holding a toy when the other one wants it ;)

[I. J. Reilly]

I think you definitely should talk to the teacher, but try not to use the word bullying when you do. That word is pretty charged right now with all the media hype, and also I’m not sure this qualifies. It sounds like the other girl simply doesn’t know how to go about trying to be friends with your daughter, which at that age is no surprise. If the teachers can’t address the situation then by all means move on, but you should at least give them a chance.

[johnnyshaka]

Yeah, full story needs to be sorted out before any drama should ensue. Heck, my 6-year old still doesn't give me a good enough picture of what goes on at school so I doubt a 2.5 year old can do it.

But encouraging your daughter to say "no" and/or tell the teacher when she feels threatened is a good start because at some point things will escalate to where a teacher needs to be involved whether the No's get gradually louder and/or multiple trips to the teacher telling to tell her she's frustrated should definitely get their attention.

[Lathum]

Wait, am I missing something? Y'all are talking like this is a day care center, but everything I have read from Easy Mac's posts indicates this is a school.

a lot of people refer to daycare as school, I know we do

I disagree TOTALLY with this - you can often cause a lot of ruckus for something which is minor or totally incorrect.

Kids report things inaccurately, try and approach things on a sane level playing field and see how things go before you go ballistic.

Or to put it another way - if you act a prat then your daughter will be known as the 'daughter of the prat' and labelled as such, affecting not only how teachers treat here (ie. less affection and at arms length because they don't want to be around you) - but also her class mates, word gets around and I wouldn't be surprised if other parents also avoid you and her for the same reasons ....

I agree with this, there are a lot of ways to solve problems. IMO rushing in and being the aggressor isn't always the best way, especialy without all the facts.

I think the obvious route is let the school know. It is likely a developmental thing. It is always good for the parents to be aware, but at that age you have to catch the kid in the act for the message to sink in, so there isn't anything the parents can really do. As for the race issue, if they really have an issue with that you shouldn't have you kid at that school and better you know.

[Subby]

IMO don't just talk to the teacher - press them. It's sometimes too easy fora teacher to nod and agree and play along, only to forget it all the second you leave. Tell them you want something done about it and you'll follow up in a week and get the principal involved if needed. Also, the school should have a social worker or a counselor on staff - mention it to them right away as they often have more resources than a teacher to observer and get involved.
In other words, bully them.

[Ben E Lou]

We found out this fall from our child's regular teacher that Carter had been fairly regularly pushing other kids to the ground on the playground for a fair bit of the summer, and we hadn't heard a thing about it. Her regular teacher--who is more old-school and direct than, I suspect a great majority of teachers at any level today--noticed the behavior quickly this fall, and said something to us within a week or two of them starting back and asked to meet with us. In between the time of letting us know initially and the time we met, she also asked the teachers who had worked in the summer program (she doesn't) and found out that it had been going on during the summer and no one had said anything to us. They were hoping it would just stop on its own. (The fall teacher characterized it as non-malicious, just your standard toddler "Oh, wow. These people work like my toys. When I push the little button on Elmo, he talks. When I push my playmates to the ground, they cry" cause/effect learning behavior, and nothing to particularly worry about.)

Anyway, when we asked her regular teacher why on earth the others wouldn't have said anything, she said that it's because too often these days, the parents don't believe the report of the teacher, so it's useless. And as a result, they will "ignore" these sorts of behaviors at that age in hopes that they work themselves out. (She said that *she* doesn't do that, but that to be fair to her colleagues, quite often that sort of behavior does just stop on its own.) Anyway, obviously I have no idea if something similar is going on in your situation, but I though it to be a data point worth mentioning.

[Desnudo]

Do 2.5 year olds have a developed sense of right and wrong or personal space/safety? Not saying the the issue doesn't need to be addressed, but i don't know if a 2.5 year old would even know how to bully. Semantics maybe, but this sounds addressable through simple discipline once you tell the care giver.

[Easy Mac]

My wife went in this morning and talked with one of the teachers and told her what she had witnessed and what our daughter had told us. She said the teacher kind of laughed it off. The teacher said it was because the other kid wasn't left with food in the morning and just hovers, but they don't let her take anything. She said she would watch them, but we shouldn't worry.

So obviously I feel much better.

[corbes]

Why is your daycare center allowing a child to go hungry at snacktime?

[Izulde]

will take her snacks or breakfast

don't let her take anything

Hmm.

[Lathum]

Why is your daycare center allowing a child to go hungry at snacktime?

A lot of day cares wont give a child food because of allergy liabilities, etc... It is up to the parents to send their child with the food they want them to eat. Perhaps this childs parents prefer to feed the kid breakfast at home instead of at school.

[Danny]

My wife went in this morning and talked with one of the teachers and told her what she had witnessed and what our daughter had told us. She said the teacher kind of laughed it off. The teacher said it was because the other kid wasn't left with food in the morning and just hovers, but they don't let her take anything. She said she would watch them, but we shouldn't worry.

So obviously I feel much better.

From what I am hearing, i would consider looking at other day cares. For one, if this other little girl is bothering other students they need to help her find something to be engaged in. They also should be teaching her the skills to interact with other children, function in this type of setting and then providing positive reinforcement for those behaviors, not just watching over her to make sure she doesnt take anything.

I also would never ever laugh off a parent's concern for their child and that is very inappropriate.

[JonInMiddleGA]

I also would never ever laugh off a parent's concern for their child and that is very inappropriate.

Ding ding ding.

I'm not entirely sure that response wouldn't have resulted in my kid leaving with me on the spot.

[Logan]

Yeah I hope "kind of" laughing it off was a bad interpretation by your wife. If not, you should be out.

I don't know much about where you live, but this sounds like glorified babysitting compared to what I hear about how my nieces' teachers function at day care in NY and PA.

[spleen1015]

I'm actually surprised that the school isn't providing food, based on my experiences.

The pre-school that my daughter went to had a form that we filled out that talked about food. They used the information to get funding from the state. After my daughter started going there for summers after she started going to school, they asked us to say on the form that she ate breakfast there every day so that they could get more money even though she ate breakfast at home.

[Drake]

When people you're paying to provide a service laugh off your concerns about their service, it's time to hire someone else.

(My boss tells me that all the time, but he's never fired me.)

[stevew]

http://nuckingfutsmama.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/donald-trump-youre-fired.jpg

That's what trump would do

[Senator]

Gracie Games. For boys or girls. Best thing I ever taught my son. Other than the veer.

[Mizzou B-ball fan]

Rough story that has a great ending.......

Boys' bullying of woman on bus sparks amazing compassion campaign (VIDEO) | The Lookout - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/bullying-bus-monitor-sparks-amazing-compassion-campaign-video-143135242.html)

[Rizon]

Rough story that has a great ending.......

Boys' bullying of woman on bus sparks amazing compassion campaign (VIDEO) | The Lookout - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/bullying-bus-monitor-sparks-amazing-compassion-campaign-video-143135242.html)

Damn ...

[SteveMax58]

I saw that story this morning as well.

WTF is wrong with a kid to not realize how despicable that is? Its one thing for them to joke with their friends or whatever but to say those things to an old lady?

[Ben E Lou]

Interesting note from reading the article: the kids went to Greece Athena Middle, so it's the same community where J-Mac gained his 15 minutes of fame.

[miked]

Yeah, we all know the school board wouldn't do it but I think it would be a valuable lesson for the kids on the bus and their parents to all sit in a room together and watch it 2-3x. I think that seems to be missing in all these stories that the parents don't seem forced to take on any of the responsibility.

[AENeuman]

Rough story that has a great ending.......

Boys' bullying of woman on bus sparks amazing compassion campaign (VIDEO) | The Lookout - Yahoo! News (http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/bullying-bus-monitor-sparks-amazing-compassion-campaign-video-143135242.html)

My first reaction was: wow, that's a sad horrible thing. Then it was: that lady clearly should not have been hired to do that job.

As someone who has spent nearly a decade doing middle school summer camp bus riding, I can tell you, anyone with that type of response to bad behavior will get crushed.

The killer was her saying that she did not report it. If not for the YouTube video, by a kid, it would have never gotten out. What type of behavior would have had to occur for a paid bus monitor to report something? As a parent of a non-abusing kid, I would have been very upset with the lack of engaging adult supervision.