Werewolf LVIII: Clash of the Gods (GAME OVER)

[DaddyTorgo]

that's hugely game-unbalancing IMO. I hope somebody has a "kill 2 badguys automatically" action or something to rectify it.

[DaddyTorgo]

okay...i don't want to hijack the game with my bitterness. I'm done with it for now.

[DaddyTorgo]

VOTE RACER

no reason...just a placeholder.

[hoopsguy]

Lathum, one thing I was working through with posts as the deadline popped - you seemed to join RendeR on the Telle vote. He made a comment about following voices in his head.

Anything that I should make out of this? He isn't around to answer it, and I believe that Chief's later vote was survival-driven. So that leaves you to ask.

[hoopsguy]

VOTE RACER

no reason...just a placeholder.

Good idea to get it in early :eek:

[Lathum]

OK, well one conclusion we can draw is that the bad guys don't know who the monsters are.

[hoopsguy]

Scorecard:
Down four Olympians, one Titan, one Monster

Still out there:
Hades
Poseidon
Ares (Anxiety)
Hephaestus (Arlington)
Asclepius (Telle)
Heracles (Lathum)
Apollo (per Telle, other suggestions)
Achilles (per Telle)
Medusa (assumed, as Neon was stoned)
Atlas (assumed to be pounding Olympians at night)

That is ten identities for thirteen remaining players.

[hoopsguy]

Is there a published tie-breaker?

We can pretty safely assume that the players on Chief and Telle were being truthful with their one point each since Schmidty bit the dust. Certainly no one spent more than two points or else our Minotaur would still be alive.

[hoopsguy]

OK, well one conclusion we can draw is that the bad guys don't know who the monsters are.

This implies that you believe that Telle is bad, correct?

[Lathum]

Lathum, one thing I was working through with posts as the deadline popped - you seemed to join RendeR on the Telle vote. He made a comment about following voices in his head.

Anything that I should make out of this? He isn't around to answer it, and I believe that Chief's later vote was survival-driven. So that leaves you to ask.

He seemed so certain about her, I wanted to see if he had any inside information.

[Lathum]

This implies that you believe that Telle is bad, correct?

I think she is bad, yes.

[Lathum]

assuming it isn't an every other night action it may be time for the person who visited me night 1 to reveal so we can start a CoT but it is totaly up to them

[Neon_Chaos]

I hope whoever the seer is (if there's still a seer) scanned either me or hoops tonight.

[Poli]

Fight over. Sigh. Had it anyhow. What have I missed?

[hoopsguy]

Telle, did you get a new vision today?

[Neon_Chaos]

Telle, did you get a new vision today?

I think it would depend on how many points she had to use to get her visions. She spent all four on Schmidty for the vote, right?

[hoopsguy]

Neon, it isn't nice to answer the trap question for the intended target.

[Poli]

You all stand there, scratching your heads for a bit.. No one is quite sure what exactly is happening. The sun has set, but where is Uranus.... Finally he appears at the normal time, without any great answers himself... "Who gave permission for the sun to depart so early? Everything has its time and place... "

Uranus clearly looks quite troubled by the event , and finally points at Schmidty while saying," Very well, You don't belong here.. SCRAM!" As Uranus points to him, Schmidty explodes in what is best described as Cow chunks.... everywhere... Schmidty has been killed! He was the Minotaur, a monster!

As several of you wipe the gross remains of Schmidty off of your clothes, the table, the walls... well everywhere... One of you suddenly point to the crumpled up body that lies where Render used to be. Just like Zeus was, Render is crushed almost beyond recognition! Render has been killed! Render was Hermes, an Olympian!

Day 4 has started. Day 4's deadline will be 10:00pm EST Friday night (or so we think......)

Game note: I will be away alot of the day tommorrow, so anything I receive will be responded to in late afternoon. If you have any urgent needs, please PM them in the next 2 hours tonight!

OMG

[Lathum]

lmao

[Neon_Chaos]

Neon, it isn't nice to answer the trap question for the intended target.

Doh. :rolleyes:

[Poli]

What the heck happened?? You've got to be flipping kidding me. All I can say is this, I'd have gone all Daddy Torgo as well.

[hoopsguy]

So I'm working through the early deadline and trying to make sense of it.

If we had gotten a Titan, then I would suggest we got lucky as only one person voted for them and they couldn't max their vote and pull off that power, right?

However, if the bad guys don't know who the monsters are, then they may have been trying to save one of their own when they knew Telle had maxed out her vote on Schmidty. The problem with this is that it doesn't seem like a lock that the other candidates would all just cast one vote - seems risky.

So I don't know what to take from this. Do other people have thoughts on it?

[Poli]

VOTE TELLE

Just my placeholder.

[Telle]

I think it would depend on how many points she had to use to get her visions. She spent all four on Schmidty for the vote, right?

Yeah but you have one for your action, remember? And yes I had a vision, but not as useful.. learned a role that is NOT in the game. Should I keep it in my back pocket to counter a potential fake reveal, or do you all want to know it now?

[Poli]

I have no clue what to think of all this. Gaw dang. I've got to re-read what went on.

[Racer]

Wow. What a power.

[Neon_Chaos]

So I'm working through the early deadline and trying to make sense of it.

If we had gotten a Titan, then I would suggest we got lucky as only one person voted for them and they couldn't max their vote and pull off that power, right?

However, if the bad guys don't know who the monsters are, then they may have been trying to save one of their own when they knew Telle had maxed out her vote on Schmidty. The problem with this is that it doesn't seem like a lock that the other candidates would all just cast one vote - seems risky.

So I don't know what to take from this. Do other people have thoughts on it?

The above reasoning actually leads me to believe that Telle, Chief Rum, and AC as are likely to be good, and Telle/AC are telling the truth with their role reveals. Or that the wolves were going to orchestrate something close to deadline, and were foiled by the early deadline tonight.

[Neon_Chaos]

Yeah but you have one for your action, remember? And yes I had a vision, but not as useful.. learned a role that is NOT in the game. Should I keep it in my back pocket to counter a potential fake reveal, or do you all want to know it now?

I would not reveal the role that doesn't exist, Telle.

[Lathum]

So I think whoever used the power needs to step up, it would answer alot of questions about what was happening.

Plus I can protect them tomorrow night.

[Neon_Chaos]

So I think whoever used the power needs to step up, it would answer alot of questions about what was happening.

Plus I can protect them tomorrow night.

Why would ask him to reveal?

Whoever used the deadline-altering power today, don't reveal.

Too many reveals already, we're risking cutting down the number of candidates for the Titans to pick off Hades or Poseidon.

[path12]

I have to say I admire that game mechanic... I vote we make Alan run all the WW games here.

+1

[Neon_Chaos]

1) Render - Killed Day 3 Hermes / Olympian
2) Barkeep - Killed Day 2 Zeus / Olympian
3) Chief Rum
4) PurdueBrad
5) St.Cronin
6) Neon_Chaos
7) Lathum - (Claims to be Heracles)
8) ntndeacon - Lynched Day 2 Dionysus / Olympian
9) ArlingtonColt - (Claims to be Hephaestus)
10) Passacaglia - Killed Day 1 Athena / Olympian
11) Telle - (Claims to be Ascelipus)
12) Hoopsguy
13) Path12 - Lynched Day 1 Cronus / Titan
14) Anxiety - (Claims to be Ares)
15) Ardent_Enthusiast
16) Racer
17) DaddyTorgo
18) Raiders Army
19) Schmidty - Lynched Day 3 Minotaur / Monster

We need to concentrate on those who haven't revealed.

I am assuming that there are 4 starting Titans (considering 19 players), there should be 3 left. Which means 3 of 9 unrevealed players are Titans.

So they have an existing pool of 6 non-titan unrevealed players to bag Hades and Poseidon. That's a 1/3 chance of them nailing one of the big two. We don't want to cut those odds even further by having more reveals.

[Lathum]

Why would ask him to reveal?

Whoever used the deadline-altering power today, don't reveal.

Too many reveals already, we're risking cutting down the number of candidates for the Titans to pick off Hades or Poseidon.

Because we need to for some COT's here.

If the person who had that power reveals, plus the person who visited me night 1 and the other 2 people who they visited we could get a nice COT going.

[Neon_Chaos]

Right now, we have a 1/3 chance of nailing a Titan, most likely, if we go into the pool of unrevealed players. And yes, that includes myself.

[Neon_Chaos]

Those calculations above discount the possibility of non-evil Titans in the game as well.

[Lathum]

Right now, we have a 1/3 chance of nailing a Titan, most likely, if we go into the pool of unrevealed players. And yes, that includes myself.

you are also assuming that there are no fake reveals in there. A big assumotion to make

[Neon_Chaos]

you are also assuming that there are no fake reveals in there. A big assumotion to make

So you want to go after the guys who revealed their roles, then? I think we're wasting our time. I could be wrong of course, but then we have different views as to how to go about weeding out the Titans.

It's going to be easier to determine the alliegances of those who revealed their roles if they participate in the scrutiny of the unrevealed ones.

[Lathum]

So you want to go after the guys who revealed their roles, then? I think we're wasting our time. I could be wrong of course, but then we have different views as to how to go about weeding out the Titans.

.

I never said that, but it would be remiss to not factor in the possibility of a false reveal.

[Poli]

I'm going to bed soon. I'm heading to Illinois early in the morning.

I'm hoping to be home some time around 3-4pm central. If I am, I can probably stick around till 5pm before I head to the wedding rehearsal. I'll be gone through most of the night for that.

[Raiders Army]

Damn. Every time someone gets in my CoT, they die. Somebody protect DaddyTorgo. I will back Neon, Telle, and DaddyTorgo.

I think we need to look at cronin.

VOTE ST. CRONIN

Even if I do not have internet access tomorrow morning I will be around at lunch.

[Raiders Army]

I am telling you that if you vote for DT, Neon, or Telle, you are voting wrongly. Of course, I should be in that list as well. :)

[Neon_Chaos]

Anxiety, any idea on how you can confirm yourself to be Ares?

[Neon_Chaos]

Damn. Every time someone gets in my CoT, they die. Somebody protect DaddyTorgo. I will back Neon, Telle, and DaddyTorgo.

I think we need to look at cronin.

VOTE ST. CRONIN

Even if I do not have internet access tomorrow morning I will be around at lunch.

All up for that. He was part of my distrust list anyway.

Vote St.Cronin

[Abe Sargent]

Anxiety, any idea on how you can confirm yourself to be Ares?

Yes. Ask the person I visited on Day One.

[Abe Sargent]

Based on my action last night, I beleive I know who st cronin, is and he ain;t aligned with the bad guys.

[Abe Sargent]

I will not say more right now. Hope you can understand that. And oh, by teh way, AlanT:

That was a seriously awesome mechanic! You get props.

[Neon_Chaos]

Unvote st.cronin

Let's see where this goes then.

[DaddyTorgo]

what about someone like purduebrad or racer?

[Abe Sargent]

You all stand there, scratching your heads for a bit.. No one is quite sure what exactly is happening. The sun has set, but where is Uranus.... Finally he appears at the normal time, without any great answers himself... "Who gave permission for the sun to depart so early? Everything has its time and place... "

Uranus clearly looks quite troubled by the event , and finally points at Schmidty while saying," Very well, You don't belong here.. SCRAM!" As Uranus points to him, Schmidty explodes in what is best described as Cow chunks.... everywhere... Schmidty has been killed! He was the Minotaur, a monster!

As several of you wipe the gross remains of Schmidty off of your clothes, the table, the walls... well everywhere... One of you suddenly point to the crumpled up body that lies where Render used to be. Just like Zeus was, Render is crushed almost beyond recognition! Render has been killed! Render was Hermes, an Olympian!

Day 4 has started. Day 4's deadline will be 10:00pm EST Friday night (or so we think......)

Game note: I will be away alot of the day tommorrow, so anything I receive will be responded to in late afternoon. If you have any urgent needs, please PM them in the next 2 hours tonight!


Uranus was killed in the first post. How is he still alive?

[Neon_Chaos]

Uranus was killed in the first post. How is he still alive?

I have no idea, but apparently, he's the one mopping at the end of each day.

[Chief Rum]

I will be out again in the day and likely won't get on until much closer to deadline, since on Friday's I usually get my workout in before coming home.

I will be curious to see what direction everyone's talking about going. I am still most suspicious of Telle, but, like others have said, there are a ton of people pinging the wrong radar. I'm not locked into voting for her at all.

[Alan T]

Uranus was killed in the first post. How is he still alive?

You can't kill Uranus, you can only hope to contain him!

(seriously, just a broken story telling. Nothing to see here, move along!)

[PurdueBrad]

what about someone like purduebrad or racer?

Hey DT, my reveal is actually set up and out there from day one. I would prefer not to point it out, but if necessary I will. I am an Olympian.

[Telle]

Well I'm here but I'm going to be going back and updating my notes from where I left off last night.

[DaddyTorgo]

okay PB...i was just trying to point out people who may have escaped notice so far is all. not saying i have any strong suspiscions

[PurdueBrad]

DT, no problem. Telle had mentioned my name yesterday, you had last night and just wanted to clear it up.

[Neon_Chaos]

okay PB...i was just trying to point out people who may have escaped notice so far is all. not saying i have any strong suspiscions

*Looks around*

People like...

Schmidty?

:cool::D:cool:

*ducks, avoids HULK SMASH!*

[Lathum]

oK,

First off I am curious why RA thinks Telle, NeonChaos and DT are good.

And if we factor in people who have been semi vouched for we get/

NeonChaos
DT
Telle
RaidersArmy ( the vouchee)

factor in roles that have revealed who we assume good

Lathum
ArlingtonColt
Anxiety

That leaves us a group containing

Hoopsguy
St.Cronin
PurdueBrad
ChiefRum
Ardent
Racer

Now if any of those people can be cleared we can further narrow things down, or if anyone has information that can clear or damn one of the above now is a good time.

Now may be a good time to lay some cards on the table.

I just woke up and am doing this from the top of my head, so if I missed anything please speak up.

[Lathum]

dola- I won't be around much this weekend

We are flying home to Jersey today @2:30 and I won't be around until late. Tomorow and sunday I may be in and out but can't gurantee anything, we have to do our final wedding planning so it's gonna be a busy weekend. We are also flyong back monday. So assuming I am still alive I won't be around to much.

[Neon_Chaos]

oK,

First off I am curious why RA thinks Telle, NeonChaos and DT are good.

And if we factor in people who have been semi vouched for we get/

NeonChaos
DT
Telle
RaidersArmy ( the vouchee)

factor in roles that have revealed who we assume good

Lathum
ArlingtonColt
Anxiety

That leaves us a group containing

Hoopsguy
St.Cronin
PurdueBrad
ChiefRum
Ardent
Racer

Now if any of those people can be cleared we can further narrow things down, or if anyone has information that can clear or damn one of the above now is a good time.

Now may be a good time to lay some cards on the table.

I just woke up and am doing this from the top of my head, so if I missed anything please speak up.

You missed Schmidty.

Hoopsguy
St.Cronin
PurdueBrad
ChiefRum
Ardent
Racer
Schmidty

[Lathum]

ummm, schmidty blew up last night

[Neon_Chaos]

ummm, schmidty blew up last night

Oh yeah, I forgot. Lol. :)

[st.cronin]

VOTE CHIEF RUM

I'm still very much in the dark, this game.

[Telle]

That leaves us a group containing

Hoopsguy
St.Cronin
PurdueBrad
ChiefRum
Ardent
Racer

Ok, so let's start from the top. Thoughts on Hoops? I've had positive feelings regarding him, but nothing concrete. He's been doing a bit of digging and analysis.. but that's no guarantee that he's a good-guy. But I also haven't noticed anything suspect about him.

[st.cronin]

For me its between CR and Hoopsguy today. Could change, I guess.

[hoopsguy]

I'll answer whatever questions people have about me, just like always.

I'm not sold on the people who have revealed all being in the clear, as they continue to advance without being the night target. But the kill of RendeR last night was also in line with the Night 2 kill, which seemed like it was made to take down the most trusted player.

[Telle]

I'll answer whatever questions people have about me, just like always.

I'm not sold on the people who have revealed all being in the clear, as they continue to advance without being the night target. But the kill of RendeR last night was also in line with the Night 2 kill, which seemed like it was made to take down the most trusted player.

Unfortunately I don't know what to ask that would help. Your voting record isn't much help to us since you couldn't vote Day 2 and you missed the early-ending vote Day 3. Do you have anything that you could say that would help us know whether or not you're to be trusted?

[hoopsguy]

OK, here are some more thoughts around Apollo:

1.) Neon has floated the idea that Apollo is scanning people. Neon, do you know this for sure? I think having the knowledge that the seer is in the game is valuable in terms of making assumptions at this point.

2.) It has been suggested that Apollo is responsible for the early deadline last night

3.) We are working off of a trust list provided by Raiders Army with three names, which might suggest that he is Apollo. Don't shoot me for posting this, the bad guys can pull this stuff up as well. If we are going to have a good conversation about this then we need to understand what we are analyzing. If he can clear three people and another one today (potentially - he did have his vote in play) then that is exceptionally valuable for us.
I don't think that Apollo would be able to both scan a person yesterday and to take an action that ends the day early. That action screams "4+ points" to me, probably 4 points with a once/game restriction.

However, if Apollo is out there scanning people then he/she should only be able to validate two people plus whatever for today.

So if Raiders is Apollo and has a trust list based on this, then he can't have been the person who changed the deadline. Because he provided three names yesterday. Which means that these are separate roles.

Lathum also has included a visitor to him on Night 1 as trusted up to this point, but that can't be Raiders as Raiders did not list him as trusted.

So this is my best attempt to help us create a better trust list today. Other things that could help with this would include:
- Arlington Colt giving someone the weapon he has been crafting
- Anxiety having multiple people who can vouch for him, as he has suggested he is using his unique powers each night

[hoopsguy]

Telle, if you want to look at my voting record you should see that I voted Neon Chaos on Day 1 near the end. If I was a Titan I had the opportunity to try and save Path at that stage and did not.

I did cast a vote yesterday and it was towards Neon. It just came three minutes after the surprise deadline, before Alan posted that there was a surprise deadline. I don't know for sure that I would have stayed on Neon, because I was exploring the posts where RendeR seemed adamant about voting for you and I saw Lathum following him. So I might have changed it, but my suspicion level on Neon Chaos has been high all game long. I posted about his Day 3 play in depth yesterday prior to putting my vote on him.

My actions have also been curtailed by being kidnapped on Night 1 (no actions or votes Day 2) and the deadline last night, which will cause me to only be able to vote one point today. So there isn't much of a report that I can give to help my cause.

I do have some information that I could share, along with a role reveal, but I don't think it provides enough value for the group in terms of making a good vote today. A role reveal, without some level of information that can be validated, doesn't bring much to the table in my opinion.

[Neon_Chaos]

OK, here are some more thoughts around Apollo:

1.) Neon has floated the idea that Apollo is scanning people. Neon, do you know this for sure? I think having the knowledge that the seer is in the game is valuable in terms of making assumptions at this point.


Unfortunately, no, I don't know this for sure, hoops. I was only floating this idea yesterday considering that all the oracles of greece had temples to apollo.

If Apollo was responsible for last night, I doubt he's a seer as well.

[hoopsguy]

The last thing that I would say in my defense is to try and trust your read on me if there isn't anything else to help make the decision. I always feel like there is a significant difference in my good-guy/bad-guy play, but that rarely seems to be clear to others when I am a good guy based on the amount of scrutiny I get in mid-game stages.

I'm definitely playing to help the Olympians win and I think that my death would be a bad thing for us. I would like to see us focus our efforts elsewhere so we might catch a Titan, but I understand that examination of fellow players is part of the game and how we eventually build towards good decisions. So I'll be as forthright as I can, while still trying to understand the dynamics of this particular game in a larger sense.

[Telle]

Unfortunately, no, I don't know this for sure, hoops. I was only floating this idea yesterday considering that all the oracles of greece had temples to apollo.

If Apollo was responsible for last night, I doubt he's a seer as well.

Apollo IS a seer, since he scanned me (and he wasn't a "visitor".. I sensed him scanning me while I was in my mind-altered state from the potion). So then he probably wasn't responsible for last night.. because I'd think being both a seer (which is generally considered a pretty powerful role) and having power over the deadline would be a bit much for a single role.

[hoopsguy]

So if it wasn't Apollo, then who was it?

Does that sound like a power that would be associated with Hades or Poseidon? I don't think so ...

So, who would have this power and why would they use it at this juncture in the game? I don't want to see us get sidetracked on the balance implications of the power, but understanding why it was used at the point it was seems important when there was still a lot of uncertainty in the vote.

Intuitively, I would want to use the power when I felt comfortable with the present choice in the vote but feared what might come to pass in next few minutes leading up to deadline. Screwing a few people on actions both that day and the following day is either a nice secondary benefit or an unfortunate casualty of the power, depending on your perspective.

[Neon_Chaos]

Anxiety, you said that you visited someone. By this visit, can you confirm that the person you visited is a good guy? And what are the reasons that you feel that st.cronin is good as well?

Also, ArlingtonColt, is the weapon you're making ready?

[Neon_Chaos]

Apollo IS a seer, since he scanned me (and he wasn't a "visitor".. I sensed him scanning me while I was in my mind-altered state from the potion). So then he probably wasn't responsible for last night.. because I'd think being both a seer (which is generally considered a pretty powerful role) and having power over the deadline would be a bit much for a single role.

Ok then. Telle is the only confirmation right now that Apollo is the seer, and that he's scanning people. We can choose to believe her, or not.

I, for one, am only leaning into putting more trust into Telle at this point.

[hoopsguy]

My guess on the person who put the action into play last night. The Titan Hyperion.

From Wikipedia:
"Of Hyperion we are told that he was the first to understand, by diligent attention and observation, the movement of both the sun and the moon and the other stars, and the seasons as well, in that they are caused by these bodies, and to make these facts known to others; and that for this reason he was called the father of these bodies, since he had begotten, so to speak, the speculation about them and their nature." —Diodorus Siculus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diodorus_Siculus) (5.67.1)

[hoopsguy]

I'm all for listening to other viewpoints on last night, but if it was a Titan then the early nightfall seems pretty sinister.

There are a couple of things you can take from this:
1. They were just fine with the vote leaders at that moment, not realizing that Telle was going to put the max-vote in for Schmidty. This is even more likely when you factor that my vote count posts didn't list Telle's action, as I missed it
2. They did know that Telle had four votes in (this scenario has her as a Titan) and were willing to take the chance that all of the voters with 2-3 votes were just one point votes. This seems very unlikely to me

If you accept Scenario #1 above, then you would also buy in that the Titans had their action submitted already - why would they screw their teammates?

Again, lets have some discussion around these points because while this makes sense in my head I'm up for having other people poke holes in it before pushing too hard with this set of assumptions.

[hoopsguy]

Also, if it was a Titan then there are at least two left - Hyperion and Atlas (assumption). Atlas because of the idea that the gods are getting beat to pulp. Hyperion because of the action last night.

Clearly the killing Titan got their action in and had a one point vote. So if we want to hunt for Atlas and Hyperion (two Titans) I think it makes the most sense to look at people who had their votes in and are not trusted.

Obviously this can be seen as self-serving, since I didn't have my vote in play. But attack the logic if there is a rebuttal - would the Titans put in an action that damaged their ability to act the next day? Maybe if there is one left, but I don't think a team of people (even if the team is only two) makes that goof when they have had three days to consider this move.

[Neon_Chaos]

My guess on the person who put the action into play last night. The Titan Hyperion.

From Wikipedia:

So if we're basing on your guess... the Titans are assuming that they had the necessary votes last night? Hmmm.

If the deadline alteration last night was a bad guy's doing... it's safe to assume that the Titans were able to put their votes in for the day.

We would need to look more into the unrevealed and unvouched-for players... specifically those who were able to put in their votes yesterday if it were the case.

Telle - Render (1127), Lathum (1141), Chief RUm (1157)
Hoopsguy - St.cronin (946), Neon_Chaos (1063)
arlington colt - Racer (1076) Raiders Army (1091)
Chief Rum - Anxiety (1028), Ardent Enthusiast (1066), Arlington Colt (1098)

By just cross-referencing Lathum's list... here are the players who are part of the unrevealed/unvouched for, and were able to put in their votes last night.

[hoopsguy]

I would really like to hear from Raiders Army at this point to hear more about his trusted list. If we can build off of each of these lists then I think we are in a really strong position right now.

Neon, note that the three names you highlighted there each had zero votes yesterday at the time of the deadline.

[Neon_Chaos]

I would really like to hear from Raiders Army at this point to hear more about his trusted list. If we can build off of each of these lists then I think we are in a really strong position right now.

Neon, note that the three names you highlighted there each had zero votes yesterday at the time of the deadline.

Exactly.

Maybe I'm overthinking it... but maybe the Titans didn't need to get any "correct" vote count... because noone was in danger of being lynched.

I also would like to hear from RA, as to why I'm trusted.

[DaddyTorgo]

nice thinking hoops.

so we have a "visitor" that visited lathum, and apollo scanning from afar. doesn't really add up IMO.

lathum...is the person who "visited" you dead or alive at this juncture? trying to understand what happened to you versus what happened to Telle. I find it doubtful that you're both telling the truth.

[Telle]

Everyone "knew" that I had all my votes on Schmidty.. I posted as such when I voted for him. But even I didn't think that was going to be enough to save my butt last night.. RendeR had said that he had used 2 votes each day previous to that, and so I really thought that he would have used at least that last night. And maybe he even did and I just won the tie breaker?

If there's only two titans left then they're most likely both amongst those who voted. But if there's three.. I could see a case for one purposely not voting before the early deadline in order to attempt to gain trust.

[st.cronin]

How do we know a Titan, or any player, was behind the early deadline? It could have been something Alan programmed behind the scenes, that if some combination of things happened, the next day ends early.

[Telle]

How do we know a Titan, or any player, was behind the early deadline? It could have been something Alan programmed behind the scenes, that if some combination of things happened, the next day ends early.

Maybe the Triton sighting the day before signaled it? I dunno.. grasping at straws..

[hoopsguy]

Cronin, do you really think that is the most plausible explanation?

Or does it make more sense that in a game where every player has some kind of powers, that this was a player activating their power?

If you accept the first premise (it was player-activated) then would you still suggest that it is an Olympian if it is not Apollo?

[PurdueBrad]

I'm putting my placeholder out now, just in case. I'm picking one of the people that has been pinging my radar, albeit not super-strong. Oh, and in case you were wondering, it'll only be one point because I'm in the penalty box today.

vote St. Cronin

[hoopsguy]

Maybe the Triton sighting the day before signaled it? I dunno.. grasping at straws..

Again, Wikipedia is your friend:
Triton is a mythological Greek god (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_mythology), the messenger of the deep. He is the son of Poseidon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poseidon), god of the sea, and Amphitrite (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amphitrite), goddess of the sea. He is usually represented as a merman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merman), having the upper body of a human and the tail of a fish.

Like his father, he carried a trident (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trident). However, Triton's special attribute was a twisted conch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conch) shell, on which he blew like a trumpet to calm or raise the waves. Its sound was so terrible, that when loudly blown, it put the giants to flight, who imagined it to be the roar of a mighty wild beast (Hyginus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaius_Julius_Hyginus), Poet. astronom. ii. 23).

I would argue that Hyperion sounds a lot more likely to create that event than Triton.

[st.cronin]

Cronin, do you really think that is the most plausible explanation?

Or does it make more sense that in a game where every player has some kind of powers, that this was a player activating their power?

If you accept the first premise (it was player-activated) then would you still suggest that it is an Olympian if it is not Apollo?

I think early deadline being a player ability is the least plausible explanation. Just my own $.02.

[hoopsguy]

Oh, and in case you were wondering, it'll only be one point because I'm in the penalty box today.

This is a good point. I think we are going to have to build a fair amount of consensus on our pick for today because the Titans are likely to have points for power-voting where a number of Olympians (me included) will not.

Again, I want discussion on the merits of this idea but this seems pretty straight-forward to me if you accept that the Titans controlled the deadline last night.

[Abe Sargent]

Anxiety, you said that you visited someone. By this visit, can you confirm that the person you visited is a good guy? And what are the reasons that you feel that st.cronin is good as well?

Also, ArlingtonColt, is the weapon you're making ready?

No I cannot confirm that they are a good guy. They get the nightly message of success, not me.

Last night, I had an interaction with st. cronin due to my ability, and the pm description of st cronin led me to beleive that I know his role, and if correct, he would not be a titan. My knowlegde of Greek mythology is decent, but not amazing, so its possible I could be wrong, but I'm confident enough in my beleif that I mention it here.

[hoopsguy]

I think early deadline being a player ability is the least plausible explanation. Just my own $.02.

Guess we'll find out in the post-game. But we are fundamentally opposed on this point. In a game where everyone has unique powers, I just don't understand how you would hold this viewpoint. My thoughts are about the intent of the player, not if it was moderator vs player action.

[Neon_Chaos]

I think early deadline being a player ability is the least plausible explanation. Just my own $.02.

So far, no event has happened without a player influencing it in some way or another. And it doesn't seem that AlanT would just change the deadline on Day 3 for no reason whatsover if only to screw with people.

[st.cronin]

Note that I don't think a player did not influence the event. I just don't believe anybody sent a pm to Alan that said "lets make deadline end 40 minutes early today." I think its entirely possible that the player who influenced the event was caught with their pants down.

[Lathum]

lathum...is the person who "visited" you dead or alive at this juncture? trying to understand what happened to you versus what happened to Telle. I find it doubtful that you're both telling the truth.

alive.

and if they want to come forward and have me vouch for them now is the time since I will be spotty for the weekend.

[Abe Sargent]

Need to get a vote out there for now, since we saw what happened yesterday.

Nothing's changed from this vote:

Vote Chief Rum

[Abe Sargent]

alive.

and if they want to come forward and have me vouch for them now is the time since I will be spotty for the weekend.

Good point. I'll come forward now.

[Lathum]

Good point. I'll come forward now.

it wasn't you.

[DaddyTorgo]

ooooh!!! interesting twist!!!!

[DaddyTorgo]

lunch. back later

[Lathum]

So Anxiety, wanna explain?

[Abe Sargent]

it wasn't you.

I thought that my action created your message, and in fact, I thought you even dropped me a hint in a post yesterday that you wanted me to do it again when you told me you guarded me, and you dropped a further hint that you knew it was me when you said that you would believe me.

I guess now I have to fully reveal my role, and you can at least verify that much.

I have the ability to make someone use their power, at whatever level of strength I have. On Day One, I used this power on Lathum to target Barkeep. I do not learn what Lathum can do, and if he ha several powers, he can chose which. At the time, I didn;t trust Barkeep much, so i was hoping I coul dget hims scanned or soothsayinged. I aslo was under the mistake impression that this would be in addition to that person;s nomral role.

This power was described to me as part of me being the God of Bloodlust.

I later had it clarified that it is not in addition to their normal power, it just redirects their power. Thus, if I force LAthum to guard hoopsguy, for example, it would override his normal action, not give him two. THis makes my power much less interesting, and I found this out last night when I asked several clarifying questions.

I've never seen a role before that allows you to trigger a person's power, so I think its neat, but without the ability to double up, it's usefulness seems much less impressive. I could try to get a titan to kil a titan, but without knowing who they are, I'm just as likely to hit one of the big three I suspect.

Anyway, that's my ability and role. I would prefer not to divulge what happened last night, that would give too much away regarding other gods.

[st.cronin]

That actually sounds plausible to me.

[Lathum]

man, I was very popular on night 1

[Lathum]

OK, I will be leaving soon and unles the airport has WiFi I won't be on until after the deadline.

VOTE RACER

Every scenerio where there is a group of people not trusted he comes up in.

[st.cronin]

UNVOTE HOOPSGUY

VOTE RACER

I'm going to follow Lathum; it was actually I who visited him on night 1, and I visited Anxiety last night.

I can't be too sure that either one is good, but to the extent that I have a COT it is those two.

I visited Barkeep on night 2, got there too late.

[Abe Sargent]

And I trust st cronin from last night, and by extension through him, Lathum.

[Lathum]

dola- At least the good thing about not getting my action in last night was I have a clean slate to work with

[Lathum]

It was Cronin who visited me last night

[Lathum]

I mean night 1

[Poli]

In early. Stupid construction company didn't have the conduit ready. We wired the taps at the controller and got the wiring ready for...Wednesday. I have about 4.5 hours before I'm heading down to Perryville.

[PurdueBrad]

Alright, removing my placeholder.

unvote St. Cronin

vote Arlington Colt to placehold.

[st.cronin]

I just want to clarify that I don't FULLY trust either Lathum or Anxiety... I can't actually clear anybody.

On night 1 I actually prevented Lathum's vote from counting. This is why I was so skeptical of all the vote analysis that followed. That was a one-time ability.

I won't say my other abilities are, other than that they are relatively minor in their effects, and what I tried to do to Anxiety last night actually failed.

[Lathum]

why ArlingtonColt?

[Poli]

I just want to clarify that I don't FULLY trust either Lathum or Anxiety... I can't actually clear anybody.

On night 1 I actually prevented Lathum's vote from counting. This is why I was so skeptical of all the vote analysis that followed. That was a one-time ability.

I won't say my other abilities are, other than that they are relatively minor in their effects, and what I tried to do to Anxiety last night actually failed.
Hmm.

[PurdueBrad]

why ArlingtonColt?

He has been on my radar a few times for various things he said. Let me go back and dig up somebody else's post that outlined a few of them. Like I said earlier when I put my placeholder on Cronin, I have four that I'm curious about but none are jumping out ahead of any of the others.

[Telle]

UNVOTE HOOPSGUY

VOTE RACER

I'm going to follow Lathum; it was actually I who visited him on night 1, and I visited Anxiety last night.

I can't be too sure that either one is good, but to the extent that I have a COT it is those two.

I visited Barkeep on night 2, got there too late.

Pssst.. you were actually on Chief Rum, not Hoopsguy.. per post 1313.

[st.cronin]

Doh.

UNVOTE EVERYBODY, INCLUDING CHIEF RUM

VOTE RACER

[st.cronin]

1 AP going to that vote.

[Lathum]

I <3 Cronin
lol

[Poli]

I never understood the <3 thing.

[PurdueBrad]

why ArlingtonColt?

Lathum, apparently I made up the post in my head as I can't seem to find it. So, until I either find it or find an argument to vote for him, I'll be moving my vote off AC.

unvote Arlington Colt

[Lathum]

He has been on my radar a few times for various things he said. Let me go back and dig up somebody else's post that outlined a few of them. Like I said earlier when I put my placeholder on Cronin, I have four that I'm curious about but none are jumping out ahead of any of the others.

It was me who outlined those reasons.

I think the best course of action with him is see if he actualy passes the so called weapon to someone.

Allthough if it doesn't happen tonight I would be skeptical, I can;t imagine an ability that takes until night 5 to go into effect.

[Lathum]

with that I am out.

I may or may not be back on depending on if the airport has internet access.

[Neon_Chaos]

Arlington, any update on the weapon?

[PurdueBrad]

Lathum, I'll go and re-read it (hopefully I can find it although I admittadly looked fairly quickly). That is where I was coming into today, I thought it was odd that something would take four days but I'll give him one last benefit of the doubt. Although it will be concerning if somebody can't step up and vouch for him tomorrow.

[ArlingtonColt]

The only problem with that is my AP's were borked last night... thus screwing me tonight..... I was considering using my Ap's to self preserve (most of the day i was close to vote lead) and didnt change my AP's in time when it looked like I was safe....

I really think the move last night was a move made by the titans. It seemed that most of the olympians got screwed by it in the end... which made it a huge power play. I'm going to vote against Racer tonight.. He seems like the most likely candidate to use that power (voted way early and then wasn't seen again) He probably tipped off his fellow titans as well

[ArlingtonColt]

Vote Racer

[Raiders Army]

I would really like to hear from Raiders Army at this point to hear more about his trusted list. If we can build off of each of these lists then I think we are in a really strong position right now.

Neon, note that the three names you highlighted there each had zero votes yesterday at the time of the deadline.

Exactly.

Maybe I'm overthinking it... but maybe the Titans didn't need to get any "correct" vote count... because noone was in danger of being lynched.

I also would like to hear from RA, as to why I'm trusted.

My trust list remains the same: DT, Neon, and Telle. At this point, I understand that most can read between the lines, so you know what my role is. Unfortunately, I did not use my power yesterday (combo of drinking beer and just thinking about voting). I will add another person to my trust list today, possibly two.

[Neon_Chaos]

Pink - No Character reveal
Green - W/ Character reveal

Update on things that have happened:

1) Render - Killed Day 3 Hermes / Olympian
2) Barkeep - Killed Day 2 Zeus / Olympian
3) Chief Rum
4) PurdueBrad
5) St.Cronin - (No claimed Role) (Claims to have the ability to visit someone; visited Lathum/Anxiety)
6) Neon_Chaos - (No claimed Role) (Claims to be able to vouch for Telle)
7) Lathum - (Claims to be Heracles) (Confirms he was visited by st.cronin, says he is the bodyguard)
8) ntndeacon - Lynched Day 2 Dionysus / Olympian
9) ArlingtonColt - (Claims to be Hephaestus)
10) Passacaglia - Killed Day 1 Athena / Olympian
11) Telle - (Claims to be Ascelipus) (Claims that Apollo scanned her, and she knows Achilles is a role in the game, she also knows of a role not in this game)
12) Hoopsguy
13) Path12 - Lynched Day 1 Cronus / Titan
14) Anxiety - (Claims to be Ares) (Claims to have been able to force someone to use their action against their will.)
15) Ardent_Enthusiast
16) Racer
17) DaddyTorgo
18) Raiders Army - (No Claimed Role) (Has come out to say that Neon Chaos, Telle, and DaddyTorgo are good.)
19) Schmidty - Lynched Day 3 Minotaur / Monster

Based on the above, I think the noose is definitely tightening.

We need to consolidate our votes.

Has anyone cleared Chief Rum?

I think we should explore the possibility that there is a titan or two among Chief Rum / ardent enthusiast / Racer.

Fortunately, I can put in 4 points on my actions today, if warranted.

As a placeholder.

Vote Racer

[Abe Sargent]

I don;t know. I never get this stuff.

[Raiders Army]

My vote is still on cronin. I must've missed it, but did Lathum and Anxiety corroborate his visits to them?

[Neon_Chaos]

My vote is still on cronin. I must've missed it, but did Lathum and Anxiety corroborate his visits to them?

Lathum did, RA.

[Neon_Chaos]

Anxiety as well, in fact.

[DaddyTorgo]

i think racer is a very strong candidate for tonight, as well as possibly AE. what he said after I went all bonkers after the early-night about how if he hadn't gotten a vote in earlier he would have pulled a me...that comes off now to me sort of as a titan thumbing their nose a little...

as for CR...he's been helpful, but we know CR can be a helpful-wolf, so he's certainly not clear of anything by virtue of that.

[Neon_Chaos]

ardent, now that you're here, what are your thoughts on Racer, Chief Rum, and quite possibly, to an extent, PurdueBrad and/or hoopsguy?

[Raiders Army]

Okay then.

UNVOTE ST CRONIN

I'll be back before the deadline.

[Poli]

?

It was joke DT. Meh. I'm taking a nap before I head down for the rehearsal. I smell a setup brewing...one where I end up getting lynched while I'm powerless to defend myself.

[DaddyTorgo]

?

It was joke DT. Meh. I'm taking a nap before I head down for the rehearsal. I smell a setup brewing...one where I end up getting lynched while I'm powerless to defend myself.

oh i assumed it was a joke too. no hard feelings AE.

just as the list narrows and you're still on it...one could see it in a different light.

FTR...my vote is on Racer and has been since right after the end of the day and I don't think I'll be moving it.

[Poli]

NC: Racer's been...I don't know, hit and miss. I really thought we had him with ntn's statement he got racer drunk, but racer refuted it well enough.

CR: Thought he provided excellent analysis on the first day, but I haven't seen much out of him since. I understand he has different hours like Schmidty did, but for all the help he's been, he hasn't been of late at all.

PB: No read on him whatsoever. First game with him.

Hoops: I was just commenting to my wife last night (before the friggin fight) that I thought hoops seemed strange. I know I've leaned on him in the past to help me through games, but I haven't seen him be of that much help...at least I don't see him to be.

[Poli]

oh i assumed it was a joke too. no hard feelings AE.

just as the list narrows and you're still on it...one could see it in a different light.

FTR...my vote is on Racer and has been since right after the end of the day and I don't think I'll be moving it.
If Neon had said it, I was have just said, Pulled a Neon. You understand.

I do realize the list is narrowing, but I hardly believe in all the role reveals, and I'm sure as hell not revealing mine.

There's an outside chance that I can be back from the rehearsal, given there's not a WTF ending like last night, before the deadline. We have some dinner afterward. If it lasts less than an hour, I could possibly be back in time.

As for now, I've got to try and decide who I'm going to cast my final vote for and how to handle a night action that might not even happen.

[Poli]

UNVOTE RACER

[Poli]

I will be voting again in the next couple of hours, that's for sure.

[hoopsguy]

Anyone have a vote count? I'll start putting one together if the answer is no.

Like I said earlier, I think we need to have a pretty united front as Olympians with several people limited to one point today. So based on skimming through this, I'll be joining the Racer bandwagon. Both him and Ardent seem like pretty reasonable shots based on the RA trust list, the reveals, and my set of assumptions on Hyperion.

[Neon_Chaos]

You're looking more and more suspicious to me, ae. Very suspicious.

[Poli]

?

[Poli]

I'm sure I do. I'm likely not to be around at the deadline, so of course I'm suspicous.

[PurdueBrad]

I'll go with the crowd here. I was leaning CR but I'll put my vote on racer with my whopping, game-changing one point. My vote really feels like a pinball today.

vote Racer

[Poli]

Screw this. Time to catch up on some sleep.

[DaddyTorgo]

when did AE vote Racer originally? am i crazy, or was it right after me, late last night.

because if it was and Racer turns up a titan, then i think maybe we look at AE and say "he was trying to hide a vote on racer with me, but then pulled his vote when racer got in trouble"

but that's only if racer turns up a titan

[Neon_Chaos]

when did AE vote Racer originally? am i crazy, or was it right after me, late last night.

because if it was and Racer turns up a titan, then i think maybe we look at AE and say "he was trying to hide a vote on racer with me, but then pulled his vote when racer got in trouble"

but that's only if racer turns up a titan

His pulling his vote off of Racer just set off alarms ringing in my head.

[Poli]

I'm going to try very hard to not have you piss me off DT.

I had no idea what was going on last night as I was fighting with my wife. IF you can't understand that, then I should have realized I need to stay away from this stupid game.

[Neon_Chaos]

I'm going to try very hard to not have you piss me off DT.

I had no idea what was going on last night as I was fighting with my wife. IF you can't understand that, then I should have realized I need to stay away from this stupid game.

Whoa there, ae. I'm sure DT was only wondering about you pulling off your vote. Nothing personal. :)

[hoopsguy]

AE, I don't believe you had a vote on Racer. You voted for Telle in Post #1273. Or at least that is what I have written down.

Post #1253 - DT votes Racer
Post #1273 - AE votes Telle
Post #1290 - RA votes Cronin
Post #1293 - NC votes Cronin
Post #1297 - NC unvotes Cronin
Post #1313 - Cronin votes Chief
Post #1337 - Purdue votes Cronin
Post #1346 - Anxiety votes Chief
Post #1355 - Lathum votes Racer
Post #1356 - Cronin unvotes Hoops, votes Racer (invalid)
Post #1362 - Purdue unvotes Cronin, votes AC
Post #1368 - Cronin unvotes, votes Racer
Post #1372 - Purdue unvotes AC
Post #1378 - AC votes Racer
Post #1387 - RA unvotes Cronin
Post #1392 - AE unvotes Racer
Post #1398 - Purdue votes Racer

[hoopsguy]

Also, here is what I show for the vote, as of Post #1404:


Racer - DT (1253), Lathum (1355), Cronin (1368), AC (1378), Purdue (1392)
Chief - Anxiety (1346)

[Neon_Chaos]

Ah there you go. :) So my suspicion on ae drops down. I thought you had had a vote on Racer and pulled it off. ;)

[Poli]

I'm about this flipping close to just revealing who I am and getting it over with.

[Poli]

Shoot. I didn't even remember who I voted for. It was a long night.

[hoopsguy]

Ardent, I'm probably at least as suspicious of you as I am of Racer. Mainly because I have more of a track record of you as a player than I do of him, and I was concerned early in the game with how little you posted. As the game has moved forward you have posted more (heavy on vote counts one day) but I can't remember much in the way of theories or consistent behavior. And that worries me with a player that I consider a good thinker.

I'm guessing you are either a Titan or one of the big two Olympians and gripping your cards a little too tight. I've got to figure out for myself if 1.) I want to take a chance on you as a Titan 2.) if I'm willing to take a risk of hitting one of the big two Olympians.

[Poli]

UNVOTE TELLE

Since apparently that's who I voted for.

[DaddyTorgo]

I'm going to try very hard to not have you piss me off DT.

I had no idea what was going on last night as I was fighting with my wife. IF you can't understand that, then I should have realized I need to stay away from this stupid game.

yeah. nothing personal man. didn't realize you were having issues last night, okay?

shit...i'm not even voting for you right now...i'm voting for RACER. In fact, in some sense I get the feeling I'm leading the charge on Racer.

Relax?

[Poli]

Actually, hoops, now that I think of it, I haven't played with Racer either. I guess my feeling on him is based on the heat he has drawn.

[Poli]

No worries, DT. IT just pissed me off to no end last night that I thought I had it taken care of only to have her blow up on me last night. I wasn't around for about 2 hours last night for that reason...maybe closer to 3. When I got back, all heck had broken loose. I know I saw your place holder and thought, "How smart is that? I need to do that."

[Poli]

Then to see the..."did AE copy me" (not exactly what you said, but how I perceived it)...dude, just rubbed me the wrong way.

Sorry.

[DaddyTorgo]

It's all good man. Sorry things blew up on you.

And see, I wasn't even right. You placeholdered on Telle and not RaceR.

No hard feelings hmm?

[Poli]

I won't get into the fact that I'm missing a football game for a team I scout/consult for tonight. My consolation? I'll be picking up a dvd of the game tomorrow after the wedding.

[Poli]

No hard feelings, DT. I'm trying hard to be mellow yellow AE.

[PurdueBrad]

Hoops, your read on AE is the same problem I'm struggling with on most of the people I'm looking at. Do you take the risk of lynching a god to try and get a Titan but we're really getting down to that. What honestly worries me though is as we get close to a lynch is if someone comes out and says essentially "you can't lynch me because I'm one of the big two..." and then my fear is this: If it is a fake reveal, then our real one may have to out themselves and there are obvious problems here. At the same time, if we go through with the lynch, we would likely be wrong. I guess, as somebody (Hoops perhaps) said earlier, with the loss of AP last night by a few of us and the need to try and avoid hitting a God, we need to coordinate tonight as much as ever. I'm on Racer now, but am up to five that I would be willing to risk the vote on. Then for the rest, the jury is still out. My intuition is just off or something and my power does not help in getting any kind of read on people.

[Telle]

Also, here is what I show for the vote, as of Post #1404:


Racer - DT (1253), Lathum (1355), Cronin (1368), AC (1378), Purdue (1392)
Chief - Anxiety (1346)

You're missing Neon voting for Racer in post 1380.

[Poli]

Personally, I'm thinking I'm voting for Chief before I head out.

[Telle]

I'm not sure I'm liking this run on Racer. Having a bandwagon like that makes it really easy for wolves to hide. So while I don't have much to say for either Racer or Chief Rum, I'm going to put my vote on the latter at least for now so that we have more than one candidate.

VOTE CHIEF RUM

[Telle]

That leaves us a group containing

Hoopsguy
St.Cronin
PurdueBrad
ChiefRum
Ardent
Racer

Let's back up to this list for a moment. Now it looks like st.cronin has moved onto the "vouched for list", so that's one down. And from my perspective, everybody else is pretty much in the "can't say much good for them, but don't have much bad against them either" category.

Hoops already talked a little to help try and garner some support.. and PurdueBrad claims he hinted to something early in the game that will give him credibility if he reveals his role.

So that leaves us with Chief Rum, ardent enthusiast, and Racer. Thoughts anyone?

(And of course, this is all ignoring the potential for false reveals, etc)

[hoopsguy]

Telle, I would just argue that by the end of the day I think we need to unite on a candidate and take our shot. Because the Titans will most likely have at least eight votes they can throw our way to move the vote (four votes for two people). I don't think they would be that obvious if they can avoid it, but if they feel like they can cull our numbers quickly enough it might make sense to take their stand today.

If we miss on this vote, then the people who have information power should look to target our 2nd/3rd candidates and hopefully we come back tomorrow with an even better chance for a good vote.

[Poli]

Hoops, the problem I have with that...is I likely won't be here. There's a chance I can be back in time, but I doubt it.

[st.cronin]

I will also not be around tonight.

[DaddyTorgo]

well then we need to agree on a candidate now before you all leave *shrug*

roll the dice and take our shot

[hoopsguy]

Ardent, then I guess put your vote where you think it belongs, let us know that you are out for the duration, and those of us that are going to be around can factor that into our decision.

For what it is worth, I'm probably going to be putting my vote on you but be willing to settle for one of the other candidates if I can't get the support.

Racer - I have no idea how he plays as good/bad but he is very quiet. I think it is a lock that we'll come back to him tomorrow if he isn't cleared

Chief - I've seen him as a bad guy enough to think that he would put out more effort in terms of providing value over the last two nights when he doesn't feel like he can clear himself somehow. I would have loved to learn more about him last night as we moved towards the deadline, but I'm more inclined to think he is good than to think you are good based on play this game.

Heck, lets get it out of the way now.


VOTE ARDENT ENTHUSIAST

[Poli]

Sigh.

[Poli]

Hoops...you've got the wrong guy.

[Neon_Chaos]

ardent, put your vote on Racer then. The way things are shaping up, it's going to be between you or Racer today.

[Poli]

sigh.

[Poli]

Fair enough.

[Poli]

I'm just going to be screwed in the end. I know it.

[Poli]

FYI: Before I roll out, I will likely go ahead and say who I am.

[Neon_Chaos]

Lathum, if you're the bodyguard, you're going to have a tough choice tonight, if ae decides to reveal.

[Neon_Chaos]

ae, you wouldn't rather go one-on-one in a vote-off against Racer?

[Poli]

I'd rather not risk it, neon. No offense. I'm a good guy.

[hoopsguy]

Lathum, if you're the bodyguard, you're going to have a tough choice tonight, if ae decides to reveal.

Lathum, I have very strong thoughts on who you should guard tonight but I don't want to say it any closer to the deadline than required. I'm hoping that you will take suggestions as well as let us know when you are going to have to put in that order.

[Neon_Chaos]

I hope the deadline doesn't end up being 40 minutes early again. :mad:

[Racer]

Okay, I've been gone all day so I've got some catching up to do.

[Neon_Chaos]

Okay, I've been gone all day so I've got some catching up to do.

To sum it up in a nutshell:

The choice of votes, right now, are between you, ae, and chief rum.

[Telle]

Current vote count:

Racer- 6 - DaddyTorgo (1253), Lathum (1355), st.cronin (1356/1368), ArlingtonColt (1378), Neon_Chaos (1380), PurdueBrad (1398)
Chief Rum - 2 - anxiety (1346), Telle (1421)
ardent enthusiast - 1 - Hoopsguy (1427)

[Poli]

VOTE HOOPSGUY

[Neon_Chaos]

AE. What are you doing? Why hoopsguy?

[Poli]

All I can think he's doing is trying to set me up.

[Telle]

Well that was unexpected.

[Poli]

I'm 95% sure that vote's not moving unless Alan T says otherwise.

[Neon_Chaos]

You do know that this is going to lead to people voting for you, right? You can just place the vote on Racer.

[Poli]

I have a feeling hoops is going to lead a charge on me in about 2 hours after I leave, so it doesn't matter. I want my vote in for the record when this game is over.

[DaddyTorgo]

didn't see that one coming

[hoopsguy]

Ardent, I would argue that I'm already trying to lead a charge against you. It isn't some kind of sneak attack while you are away from your computer. I put it out there with the intention of giving you the opportunity to respond.

If you are a good guy then I understand you thinking I'm a bad guy gunning for you. If you are a bad guy that feels threatened by my actions, then I completely understand why you are voting for me.

However, if you are a good guy and can supply any kind of information that should help us separate you from Racer and Chief Rum in the vote today that would be really helpful. I'm not sold on this vote (good guys without the benefit of reveals rarely are, right?) but I think it is the best one for reasons I outlined in Post #1427.

[st.cronin]

Ardent are you being forced to vote a certain way?

[hoopsguy]

Ardent, I would argue that I'm already trying to lead a charge against you. It isn't some kind of sneak attack while you are away from your computer. I put it out there with the intention of giving you the opportunity to respond.

If you are a good guy then I understand you thinking I'm a bad guy gunning for you. If you are a bad guy that feels threatened by my actions, then I completely understand why you are voting for me.

However, if you are a good guy and can supply any kind of information that should help us separate you from Racer and Chief Rum in the vote today that would be really helpful. I'm not sold on this vote (good guys without the benefit of reveals rarely are, right?) but I think it is the best one for reasons I outlined in Post #1427.

[Poli]

I'm actually a little peeved that cronin hasn't visited me. From my understanding, he would not have been able to clear me, but at least someone could say something on my behalf.

I'm very likely to reveal my role before I leave in less than 2 hours. And no, Neon, I'm not taking one for the team.

[Poli]

As for what I've done at night? Nothing. I've been holed up. As far as I know, no one can vouch for me. Everyone's too busy visiting Lathum, it appears.

[st.cronin]

I'm actually a little peeved that cronin hasn't visited me. From my understanding, he would not have been able to clear me, but at least someone could say something on my behalf.

I'm very likely to reveal my role before I leave in less than 2 hours. And no, Neon, I'm not taking one for the team.

Heh, I actually had submitted your name initially on both days 1 and 2. Both times I changed it at the last minute.

[Poli]

I pity the fool that tries to kill me at night, though.

[Neon_Chaos]

I will let this develop and see what happens. It's basically unrevealed guy #1 exchanging votes with unrevealed guy #2, while the majority votes are on unrevealed guy #3.

[Poli]

Heh, I actually had submitted your name initially on both days 1 and 2. Both times I changed it at the last minute.
MOTHER F"ER

I WANT MY HAT.

[Poli]

And no cronin, I'm voting this way because I'm pissed.

[Poli]

gah flipping rehearsal's been moved up 30 minutes

[st.cronin]

Ok, I just didn't understand what Alan had to do with that.

[Racer]

Telle, I would just argue that by the end of the day I think we need to unite on a candidate and take our shot. Because the Titans will most likely have at least eight votes they can throw our way to move the vote (four votes for two people). I don't think they would be that obvious if they can avoid it, but if they feel like they can cull our numbers quickly enough it might make sense to take their stand today.

If we miss on this vote, then the people who have information power should look to target our 2nd/3rd candidates and hopefully we come back tomorrow with an even better chance for a good vote.

I'm not finished reading the thread, but if the Titans were to do that, wouldn't someone with a lot less votes tonight getting lynched draw a lot of suspicion for whoever voted for that person? I don't think the Titans would do that if they were the ones who moved up the deadline last night. That train of thought seems suicide to me.

[st.cronin]

I'm not finished reading the thread, but if the Titans were to do that, wouldn't someone with a lot less votes tonight getting lynched draw a lot of suspicion for whoever voted for that person? I don't think the Titans would do that if they were the ones who moved up the deadline last night. That train of thought seems suicide to me.

I thought about that, too.

[Poli]

Ok, I just didn't understand what Alan had to do with that.
You'll likely understand what I mean by that in about...1 hour.

[DaddyTorgo]

RaceR makes a good point. Unless as Hoops says, they felt they were already so close to the tipping-point that they could withstand it (doubtful, as the two mega-olympians are still out there and they're not close to a 1:1 ratio anyways)

[DaddyTorgo]

You'll likely understand what I mean by that in about...1 hour.

AE...if you are indeed a good olympian why are you being so cryptic?:confused:

[Poli]

You'd rather me just spill it?

[hoopsguy]

Racer, it depends on how many Titans are out there. I'll see if I can work through it in this post and see how well the idea stands up.

Titans:
Atlas
Hyperion
???

Monsters:
Medusa
???


Heroes:
Heracles
Achilles
???

Olympians:
Hades
Poseidon
Ares
Hephaestus
Apollo
Asclepius
???

We know of six Olympians, two heroes, one monster, and two Titans (there are a couple of assumptions in those numbers) which total 11 out of 13 players. The ??? under each leaves open the potential for there to be additional members of this group.

We've lost four Olympians, one monster, and one Titan.

Starting ratios out of 19 players:
10 Olympians
3 Titans
2 Heroes
2 Monsters
2 left to be defined

If the Titans feel like they can get an Olympian today, and there are several revealed ones to pick from, they can take their shot with controlling the vote today and claiming another one tomorrow night. Ideally they can do this without having to max out their votes, as that might limit their night actions, but if we head into tomorrow with four Olympians against 3+ Titans/Monsters are we going to win that showdown?

I don't know what the ratios are and I would be a little surprised if any faction in this game knew exactly what they were. But if there are still three remaining Titans and Medusa aligns with them then this strategy makes a lot of sense for them.

I think this is worst-case thinking, but I would rather prepare for the worst than be ambushed by it. Which is why I still think we should try to come to a consensus today on our candidate, whoever it is going to be. I think there is enough information out there that we can make good decisions going forward without the benefit of a broad voting record from today.

[DaddyTorgo]

heading home. will be off for like ~ 2 hours

[Poli]

Hoops, take the question mark off the heroes. I'm a good guy.

[Racer]

oK,

First off I am curious why RA thinks Telle, NeonChaos and DT are good.

And if we factor in people who have been semi vouched for we get/

NeonChaos
DT
Telle
RaidersArmy ( the vouchee)

factor in roles that have revealed who we assume good

Lathum
ArlingtonColt
Anxiety

That leaves us a group containing

Hoopsguy
St.Cronin
PurdueBrad
ChiefRum
Ardent
Racer

Now if any of those people can be cleared we can further narrow things down, or if anyone has information that can clear or damn one of the above now is a good time.

Now may be a good time to lay some cards on the table.

I just woke up and am doing this from the top of my head, so if I missed anything please speak up.



Okay, I'm going off this list. Someone said St. Cronin has now been vouched for. Chief Rum hasn't been around, right? In my opinion, he's played this game similar to the only other game I've played. He hasn't posted quite as much in my opinion, but again I'm pretty sure I read that he wouldn't be around much today. His analysis seems way to valuable for us to get rid of right now. That leaves me with Hoopsguy, PurdueBrad, and AE. I'm a bit more suspicious of PurdueBrad and AE then Hoopsguy at the moment. I'm going to reread stuff before making my decision, but for now I'll got to take off for a bit. I think everyone else should also look at them before deciding whether or not to keep their votes on me. I'm a good guy and have a power that can be useful to the Olympians.

[Poli]

Screw it. I'm Odysseus. I know for a fact Achilles is in the game. I've spent my AP each night asking the gods where/who he is.

[Neon_Chaos]

Straw-grasping now on-going.

[Poli]

Hence, I'm a good guy, Hoops.

[hoopsguy]

If AE is on the up-and-up then we have:
10 heroes
3 titans
3 heroes
2 monsters

I think it is fairly likely that there is one last monster out there instead of another titan, but again there is a lot of guesswork involved with this list.

If the reveals that we have had are in fact solid, then we should be in great position to win this game.

[Neon_Chaos]

ae, if you're a hero, then you made a horrible play today. Your death would not have put the Titans in any advantage whatsoever. Heroes would have been expendable if put in a run-off vote against a possible Titan, since you don't count as an Olympian, and, therefore, even deter the Titans' winning conditions.

Man.

[Poli]

Now there's a flipping dress code for this thing. Seriously? Screw WW and weddings.

[Neon_Chaos]

Ok, AE, kindly explain how does your nightly action work? What results have you achieved?

[Poli]

If I find Achilles, then I can kill a monster.

[hoopsguy]

Screw it. I'm Odysseus. I know for a fact Achilles is in the game. I've spent my AP each night asking the gods where/who he is.

As long as you've already come out with this, why would Odysseus have the ability to locate Achilles? I'm going to Wikipedia to see if this is something that should be obvious, but if you can shed light on it that would be great.

[Poli]

For 4 AP, I can ask the gods if X is Achilles. I started doing that after night 1. I haven't had success.

I have had the choice of hiding out (4AP) and waiting to see if I'm the target of a night kill. If I am, then I instead kill the person attacking me. I did that the first night, but decided to go with the Achilles route afterwards.

[Neon_Chaos]

As long as you've already come out with this, why would Odysseus have the ability to locate Achilles? I'm going to Wikipedia to see if this is something that should be obvious, but if you can shed light on it that would be great.

Odysseus was the guy assigned to look for Achilles, who was hidden by his mother from being drafted into the Greek army.

[Poli]

I've got about 20 minutes to get dressed and hit the road.

[Neon_Chaos]

Do you know of any monsters in the game, though? Or do you have to figure out which one is a monster too?

[hoopsguy]

Think I found something to back the notion of Odysseus finding Achilles:

Odysseus and other envoys of Agamemnon travelled to Scyros (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scyros) to recruit Achilles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achilles) because of a prophecy that Troy could not be taken without him. In most accounts, Thetis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thetis), Achilles' mother, disguised the youth as a woman to hide him from the recruiters because an oracle (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oracle) had predicted that Achilles would either live a long, uneventful life or achieve everlasting glory while dying young. Odysseus cleverly discovered which of the women before him was Achilles when the youth stepped forward to examine an array of weapons (some accounts say that Odysseus arranged for the sounding of a battle horn, which prompted Achilles to clutch a weapon).

However, what value would this bring you? Would you get PM rights with this person? Do people learn that you visited them?

[Poli]

I was told there are 2 monsters. Look back and you'll see I said I believe there are monsters in this game and they are not powers.

I wasn't told of PM rights with Achilles. I was told I ask the gods, so I'm assuming people don't realize I've asked. I'll refrain from saying who I've asked.

[Poli]

And I'm out.

[hoopsguy]

OK, based on Day 1 there was a reason to believe that there was both a Minotaur (Schmidty) and a Medusa. So the two monsters part resonates well enough.

However, if there was a hero with the ability to kill a monster I would think that Perseus would be the most likely to do this as he was the one who killed the Minotaur. Allowing him to search each night for the Medusa and kill it makes more sense than Odysseus having to find Achilles so they can kill a monster.

[Neon_Chaos]

Okay, I'm going off this list. Someone said St. Cronin has now been vouched for. Chief Rum hasn't been around, right? In my opinion, he's played this game similar to the only other game I've played. He hasn't posted quite as much in my opinion, but again I'm pretty sure I read that he wouldn't be around much today. His analysis seems way to valuable for us to get rid of right now. That leaves me with Hoopsguy, PurdueBrad, and AE. I'm a bit more suspicious of PurdueBrad and AE then Hoopsguy at the moment. I'm going to reread stuff before making my decision, but for now I'll got to take off for a bit. I think everyone else should also look at them before deciding whether or not to keep their votes on me. I'm a good guy and have a power that can be useful to the Olympians.

We'll cross the PurdueBrad/Hoopsguy bridge when we come to it. Yeah, everyone's a good guy in this game, apparently.

[Poli]

One last thing, I have to send in my AP before I hit the road


All 5 AP are going on hoops tonight.

[hoopsguy]

If there is someone in the game who is Achilles maybe this description from Ardent will mesh with their character. Telle has said that Achilles is in fact in the game, so there seems like a reasonable chance that he can help/hurt this reveal.

If AE is telling the truth here then I guess I'm surprised with the way he has played this game. He has the chance to be very aggressive as a human, as removing him from the board doesn't help the bad guy win conditions (1:1 ratio with Olympians). I understand wanting to stretch out the game personally, but why not have fun while you are playing?

I don't have nearly enough votes to get AE myself; I'm limited to one vote. If people don't want to look here and instead want to line up on Racer or Chief Rum I'll follow closer to deadline. But with what I know right now I feel OK about my vote on AE.

[hoopsguy]

One last thing, I have to send in my AP before I hit the road


All 5 AP are going on hoops tonight.

If you are a human like you say you are then you are making a mistake with that vote, unless you have a win condition that is separate from the Olympian win conditions. A max vote on me would only help the Titans. I hope you reconsider.

If you do, don't post it in the thread. Just send in the one point and see if you can trap anyone else who jumps on me as a vote tomorrow if I show up lynched with fewer votes than someone else when they try to pin it on you.

[Poli]

I'll reconsider it if I get back in time. As is I'm running late.

[hoopsguy]

Votes as of Post #1494:

Racer - DT (1253), Lathum (1355), Cronin (1368), AC (1378), Neon, (1380), Purdue (1392)
Chief - Anxiety (1346), Telle (1421)
Ardent - Hoops (1427)
Hoops - Ardent (1443)

Ardent has indicated he will be using a max (4) vote.
People who are limited with their vote today: PB, Hoops, DT

[Neon_Chaos]

ardent, you should hold off on that vote for hoops and try looking for Achilles one more time. If you are Odysseus, you shouldn't be concerned about being killed, it can only serve the village well to build a strong CoT if you do find Achilles.

[Racer]

Screw it. I'm Odysseus. I know for a fact Achilles is in the game. I've spent my AP each night asking the gods where/who he is.

Uh, I'm Odysseus. I don't want to reveal my power because I think it can really benefit the Olympians, but I will if it means saving my own skin.

[Racer]

This makes my vote tonight pretty easy,

Vote Ardent_Enthusiast

[Racer]

Guys, I really urge you to take your vote off of me and place them on AE tonight. My power has the potential to be very beneficial to the Olympians.

[Racer]

Racer, it depends on how many Titans are out there. I'll see if I can work through it in this post and see how well the idea stands up.

Titans:
Atlas
Hyperion
???

Monsters:
Medusa
???


Heroes:
Heracles
Achilles
???

Olympians:
Hades
Poseidon
Ares
Hephaestus
Apollo
Asclepius
???

We know of six Olympians, two heroes, one monster, and two Titans (there are a couple of assumptions in those numbers) which total 11 out of 13 players. The ??? under each leaves open the potential for there to be additional members of this group.

We've lost four Olympians, one monster, and one Titan.

Starting ratios out of 19 players:
10 Olympians
3 Titans
2 Heroes
2 Monsters
2 left to be defined

If the Titans feel like they can get an Olympian today, and there are several revealed ones to pick from, they can take their shot with controlling the vote today and claiming another one tomorrow night. Ideally they can do this without having to max out their votes, as that might limit their night actions, but if we head into tomorrow with four Olympians against 3+ Titans/Monsters are we going to win that showdown?

I don't know what the ratios are and I would be a little surprised if any faction in this game knew exactly what they were. But if there are still three remaining Titans and Medusa aligns with them then this strategy makes a lot of sense for them.

I think this is worst-case thinking, but I would rather prepare for the worst than be ambushed by it. Which is why I still think we should try to come to a consensus today on our candidate, whoever it is going to be. I think there is enough information out there that we can make good decisions going forward without the benefit of a broad voting record from today.

Did I miss something? How do you know that Atlas is in the game?