Werewolf XLVIII - The horror of sorcery hill (Game over)

[Alan T]

You live in a mundane world, where power is described as those with a military rank, or political position or a certain amount of money. Often the unexplainable will occure however, items will be misplaced, or some weird sense of deja vu. Commonly these occurances are chalked up to simply being the supernatural, but when most people say supernatural, what they really mean is something that does not exist. Most people do not believe in magic, much less great power or abilities to be found within it.

You were raised in a long line of tremendous sorcerors. Your forefathers had great powers to spy on others unknowingly, to shift shapes, to turn matter into other completely different objects, or to even kill if needed. The charge your family has held for longer than can be remembered is the same that others of your order hold dear. You remain hidden, telling no one of your heritage or what your family is capable of. Your power is used for good, never to harm innocent people or for self profit. Your power is true, it is just , it is noble...

The only problem, you have no idea how to use your power, or even if you posess it. Your parents have sent you off to the legendary school "Sorcery Hill" where the timeless schoolmasters there will help you learn to harness your abilities to their full potential. Without the proper training or combination of items and utterings, such power could have horrible adverse effects. Your parents have packed your napsack with everything that you will need for the next 10 months, you wave goodbye to them as they drive off and you enter into the huge school alone as is customary to school tradition.

You find your way to the great hall, and see others similar to you there waiting all alone. The class size is relatively small, as only those of proper heritage are welcomed here. The class is invitation only and as such, you know the other students likely have a similar family history as you. Suddenly, engulfing the entire room is a loud crashing sound, almost as if thunder struck the great hall itself. All of the lights in the room shine three or four times brighter than normal until they suddenly explode and the room is left completely dark.

Without a good reason why, just by instinct you get up from your seat, with napsack in hand and start trying to stumble your way to the entrance to the great hall. You stumble over someone or something and hit the ground hard... the entire room blacks out for you....

[Alan T]

Game complexity won't be as complex as my normal large games, it will likely be comparable in complexity to barkeep's last game.

Day Cycles unless otherwise stated: 9am - 10pm EST
Night Cycles unless otherwise stated: 10pm - 9am EST

Current plan for the schedule around all of the july 4th stuff:


Plan B: (if we get enough sign ups by July 2nd)

July 2 - Roles will be sent out in the evening and Day 1 starts.
July 3 - Day 1 ends 10pm EST
July 4th/5th - Extended July 4th play. Night 1 ends 11am EST on July 4th. Day 2 ends July 5th 10pm EST
July 6th - Day 3 ends 10pm EST
July 7th/8th - Extended Weekend play. Night 3 ends Saturday noon EST, Day 4 ends Sunday 10pm EST. (Night 3 conditional orders will be encouraged for people who won't be around)
July 9th - 13th Normal Day/Night cycles

Please state in signup if you can't start play until the 5th.
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Sorcery Hill Layout -

You are trapped within the school's great hall. The giant doors leading out are jammed shut either by something extremely heavy or some spell. Adjacent to the great hall are three other rooms that remain accessible for you, the kitchen, the library and the storeroom.

The sides -

Good - There are those of legendary heritage, a long line of wizards and sorcerors. They have come to learn how to harness their abilities fully.
Evil - A dark and sinister sect of your order has recently wanted to use your power to take control of the entire world, forsaking the guidelines passed down from generation to generation, they have once and for all decided to shut down the school and remove any who stand in their way.

Winning Condition -

Those that remain true of heart shall win by eliminating all who belong to the evil sect. Those that are evil shall win by killing off everyone who is good and shutting down the school once and for all.

Initial role PM -

Below is the initial PM sent out to all of the students of sorcery hill (Good players):

You are a student of sorcery hill. Your family has a long line of heritage and has sworn to uphold good. You will win if you remove all of the sect members from the school. Your name is _________.
Those whom are sect members (evil players) will receive a different PM including who else is a member of the sect, the sect's winning condition (listed above), and what recipes they know at the start of the game.

Game schedule -

Unless otherwise previously stated each day cycle will run from 9am EST until 10pm EST. Any daytime activities must be submitted by 10pm EST or they will not count. Each night cycle unless otherwise previously stated will run from 10pm EST until 9am EST. The Night cycle will not be run early during this game, even if everyone has submitted night actions early.

Magical Items -

Each day many of you will "find" items or ingrediants that can be put together to form a more powerful item or potion. There will be multiple combinations possible, one of which would be a powerful new item or potion to use for good. However be warned that combining the wrong magic can be a deadly process and in doing so may actually create a tool for evil. Also there is always the possibility of the end result being useless all around.

Players will find that they need to rely on each other to combine pieces to make the more powerful potions/magical items in the game, by passing ingredients they may hold to other players they trust.

Each magical item will be made up of: 1 unfinished item, 1 potion
Each potion will be made up of: 1 beaker, 1-2 ingredient(s)

A potion can either be drunk by yourself, passed to another player or thrown at another player (smashing against them)
A magical item can either be used or passed to another player to use.
All potions are usable during the day cycle only. I will notify players when magical items can be used at their creation.

**Magical items used during the night are private and only the player whom uses the item and the player who gets the item used upon them are aware of it. (in some cases the receiving party is unaware of the action however)
**Potions used during the day are publically done with everyone being told of the action via GM's public post with results of the action.

In order to pass an ingredient, item, potion or magical item to another player, please PM with the playername and which item you wish to pass. In order to use an item either yourself or against another player, you should PM that to me as well.

For the purpose of the game, the following definitions will be used:

item = unfinished mundane, non-magical item
magical item = an enchanted item that has been created by the players by combining the proper ingredients
ingredients = normal mundane ingredients that themselves hold no magical properties, but combined together in the proper manner can create powerful potions or magical items
potions = a magical liquid that can either be drunk, used to create a magical item or used against another player by throwing.

As none of you have mastered the spells you are using, you may find many of the items, magical items, ingredients or potions to be unfamiliar for you. There might be help available for those that choose to spend their time at nights in the library looking through the ancient texts. You will decide if you wish to use an unknown magical item or potion or not wait to find out more about it.

A player with a magical item or a potion can not receive a second one until the first is either passed or used up.

List of magical items/potions/spells -

Potions:

Antidote
Silencing potion
Poison potion
silent oil
blinding potion
invisible powder
health boost
vitriol
holy water
sleeping potion
paralyze potion
Mind Control
Eternal bond potion
potion of persuasion
potion of illusion
potion of inspection

Magical items:

Poison knife
acid knife
Holy Shield
Crystal ball


Spells:

Protect
Mind Read
Death
Remove Poison
Command
Illumination

Daytime actions -

During the day you have the ability to vote for a fellow student that you do not feel is pure. The player with the most votes at the end of day risks being put to death by the student body. The student body may also choose to vote for no death, and no student will die if the majority chooses such.

To vote, simply post in the thread:

Vote Alan T

Also during the day time is when students may combine ingredients and items in order to try to create powerful magical items or potions. You may pass multiple times during the day and attempt to create a magical item or potion at any time. The person creating the magical item or potion must posess all of the ingredients to do so however.

To create a magical item or potion, send me a PM stating which ingredients/item you wish to combine and your result will be sent to you. Please keep in mind the following rules:

Each magical item will be made up of: 1 unfinished item, 1 potion
Each potion will be made up of: 1 beaker, 1-2 ingredient(s)


Night time actions -

At night time each of you may send in a PM stating which room you wish to spend the night in (The great hall, the library, the kitchen or the storeroom). The room you choose may have some effect on the type of item or ingredient you receive. Players that do not submit any selection will by default spend the night in the great hall where they can work on enhancing their abilities as well as study any magical item or potion they may have.

Also during the night time some players may have special actions or items that allow for special actions. The results of these actions will be posted at the end of the night phase. All night actions should be sent to me via PM.

Death -

Players killing another player at night time will gain all items/ingredients/potions/magical items that player may have had.

Ingredients and items of players who are killed by the daily vote will be randomly given out to those whom voted for them. Any potions or finished magical items will be given to the "deciding" vote on the player. For game purposes, the deciding vote in a 7-4 vote would be the 5th vote for that player. In addition, only the original vote for that player will count for each person when it comes to the deciding vote only. Players who unvote then revote for someone will not get a later vote in efforts to try to be the deciding vote.

Other -

I reserve the right to make modifications if needed to ensure the spirit of the game remains intact. Any rule changes or modifications would be posted for all to know.

Contacting the GM -

As normal, the standard method of contacting me to submit orders, requests or ask questions is by using the forum's PM system. However I also use AIM regularly and all questions can be asked there as well. Please do not send orders via AIM however as they could possibly be forgotten or not included. If you don't have me on your AIM list already, please drop me a PM to let me know your AIM screenname as I likely will need to add you to mine in order to receive messages from you.

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Quick cheat sheet for day/night actions -

For those that skim through the rules.. this is what you should do each day/night.

Day - Submit a vote for who you think is evil. (Post vote in thread)
Day - Have others pass you items/ingredients or you pass others items/ingredients to make more powerful potions/magical items. (Create magical items/potions or pass items/ingredients by PMing me)
Each item/ingredient can only be passed a max of 2 times each day period.

Night - Choose which room you wish to spend the night in (PM me)
Night - Use any magical items that have a special night ability attached to them (PM me)

[Alan T]

Day 1 start (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/showthread.php?p=1492711#post1492711)
Day 1 end (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/showthread.php?p=1493589#post1493589)
Night 1 end (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/showthread.php?p=1493765#post1493765)
Day 2 End (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/showthread.php?p=1494883#post1494883)
Night 2 End (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/showthread.php?p=1495055#post1495055)

Game roster:

1) Swaggs - Killed night 3
2) Chief Rum
3) Daddytorgo - Killed night 1
4) Passacaglia - Killed night 4
5) Ardent Enthusiast - Killed Day 4 (Sect member)
6) Lathum - Killed Day 3
7) Barkeep
8) Path
9) Hoopsguy
10) Render - Killed Day 5 (Sect member)
11) Lonestargirl - Killed night 5
12) St.cronin - Killed night 2
13) Ntndeacon
14) Izulde - Killed day 2

[Swaggs]

I'll give it another try.

[Chief Rum]

Indio.

Hopefully I last longer than the last two times.

[Chief Rum]

And the holiday shouldn't affect my availability for play (other than how my two jobs usually does when I work both).

[DaddyTorgo]

in

[Passacaglia]

(This space reserved for Passacaglia to say he is in)

[Poli]

yo

[Lathum]

in

[Barkeep49]

I can play and am available to start before or after the 4th.

[path12]

Inny. I'm out of town on the 4th only, can start before that.

[hoopsguy]

In and around all week.

[hoopsguy]

Any set number of players for this one?

[Alan T]

Any set number of players for this one?

Leaving it a bit flexible due to the changing WW game size the past few weeks. I can run it with 9 if thats all we get, or if more sign up, I have a few modifications that will be made to whats included in.

I think its more important to keep the games rolling than to wait for a set number (if that makes sense)

[Barkeep49]

Alan you so lie: My game was definitely simpler. Never thought I'd see the day where I'm running the simple game :)

[RendeR]

sign me up!

[Alan T]

I set the schedule in the post above, as we have 10 people signed up, we'll start the game July 3rd. We'll leave sign ups open monday to get anyone else who wants to play and then close signups monday evening around 9pm EST.

I'll send out roles for everyone some point between 9pm and midnight EST and we'll start day 1 on July 3rd.

[LoneStarGirl]

I will play...

Why doesn't somebody message izulde and tell him to play? He said in the extenction thread he wanted back in

[st.cronin]

In, and I hope to play on the 4th, since I'll be stuck at work.

[hoopsguy]

In, and I hope to play on the 4th, since I'll be stuck at work.

What kind of work do you do that you are going to be stuck there on the 4th?

[Poli]

He's a fiddler on the roof.

[hoopsguy]

I'll get this out of the way early this game - even before receiving the PM! I'm a villager/good guy/wizard. I'm hoping that we can round up some wolves/bad guys/sect members.

If I'm really lucky, then this message will have one of the secret keywords from the upcoming PM and clear me for the remainder of the game :)

[Alan T]

I'll get this out of the way early this game - even before receiving the PM! I'm a villager/good guy/wizard. I'm hoping that we can round up some wolves/bad guys/sect members.

If I'm really lucky, then this message will have one of the secret keywords from the upcoming PM and clear me for the remainder of the game :)


I'm going to make sure I try to quote this post as best as I can for the pms that I send out.

[Lathum]

VOTE HOOPSGUY

[ntndeacon]

in like Flint

[Izulde]

Sounds like a good time to hop back in the WW thing, so I'll jump in on this one :)

[hoopsguy]

I'll get this out of the way early this game - even before receiving the PM! I'm a villager/good guy/wizard. I'm hoping that we can round up some wolves/bad guys/sect members.

If I'm really lucky, then this message will have one of the secret keywords from the upcoming PM and clear me for the remainder of the game :)

VOTE HOOPSGUY

Clearly a wolf move. Of course you would want to get rid of the only known good villager at this point in the game.

[Poli]

Throw in the word goob and I'll be your best friend.

[ntndeacon]

goob

[Lathum]

Throw in the word goob and I'll be your best friend.

huh?

[hoopsguy]

Lathum, I think AE was talking to Alan (post #24). If not, then I'm as lost as you are in post #31.

[path12]

Post count padders. :D

[hoopsguy]

Post count padders. :D

Whatever :rolleyes:

[Lathum]

Post count padders. :D

maybe you missed the memo but they don't count

[Poli]

Clearly, hoopsguy is a goob. He didn't even realize I was talking to him. If he threw in the word goob in the post before mine, we could be best friends. I'd even go to an Illini game with him, provided he cough up for the tickets like Data King.

VOTE HOOPSGUY

[hoopsguy]

You couldn't pay me enough money to go to a Tennessee basketball game as long as Pearl is the coach there.

AE = goob
Pearl = Satan

VOTE ARDENT ENTHUSIAST

[Poli]

See, that's where I'm compassionate. I feel sorry for the Illini basketball program.

[Barkeep49]

Wow. We're at Day -1 and I don't know who to vote for, that almost never happens at this point in the game. I think we need to think about consolidating our votes a little to establish a good pattern for later on.

[hoopsguy]

Day -1 almost always feel random, barring the semi-standard "pre-game seer reveal".

Of course, don't take that as me trying to out our seer before the game starts. Because anyone who does that is clearly working against the interests of the village.

[st.cronin]

What kind of work do you do that you are going to be stuck there on the 4th?

I work for a conglomerate of hotels. We'll almost certainly be shortstaffed on wednesday after everybody calls in sick etc., so I'll be filling in somewhere most of the day, not sure where.

He's a fiddler on the roof.

Yeah, that too.

[st.cronin]

Look, we all know that Lathum's a wolf. I don't know why we pretend otherwise.

[Alan T]

Signups are locked, I am using random.org to assign all of the roles currently. Role PMs should be sent out some point after the little one is asleep in the next two hours.

[Barkeep49]

Day -1 almost always feel random, barring the semi-standard "pre-game seer reveal".

Of course, don't take that as me trying to out our seer before the game starts. Because anyone who does that is clearly working against the interests of the village.
See I don't think they feel random at all. Day -1 votes to me are all about revenge or making a point. Normally I'm upset with someone from the previous game or want to bring someone down a notch or even just want to make a humorous point of some sort. I'm just not feeling that here.

[DaddyTorgo]

PM received. Need to read the rules to figure out if I have any powers or anything. But I am on the side of good.

[DaddyTorgo]

looks like we need some people to spend some serious time in the library to work out spells. I'm slightly worried about this mechanic, as it seems like something random.org could have a field day with...we could end up finding a ton of spells that unbalance the game...i guess i'll hafta trust the GM.

FWIW...I have mercury. And I guess I'll be going to the library to try to figure out what I can do with it.

we also need to be careful i'd think, to some degree, as wolves could be posing as villagers to try to get items from us to make potions for evil.

[Poli]

See I don't think they feel random at all. Day -1 votes to me are all about revenge or making a point. Normally I'm upset with someone from the previous game or want to bring someone down a notch or even just want to make a humorous point of some sort. I'm just not feeling that here.
+1, Alan T, you're going down!

[Alan T]

As the sun starts to shine through the large windows in the ceiling of the great hall, you come to and realize there still are others in the great hall with you. You make a start to the door, but once there realize that the doors are immovable. Either some huge object is blocking the doors from opening, or some form of spell has been placed upon the door.

"It's useless to try to get out, we've been trapped within these walls", a voice crys out from the other side of the hall. An older man wearing a brown robe like you would expect some type of monk to wear stands there. "The only explanation is the evil sect of our great order has come to challenge us directly. They are in for quite the suprise I believe."

The man glances about the room and then looks over each of you before continuing, "You would not be here if you didn't have some tremendous power within just waiting to be called upon. We still have access to our various suplies in the adjacent rooms that we should be able to put together quite an offensive I would think. Go now and gather materials so that we can put together magical items and potions that might help us in our quest." He pauses before warning,"However do not be so hasty to use them just yet. Your power is undiscliplined and combining the wrong ingredients might be fatal. You can likely find guides to what to make in the nearby library as well...."

His voice trails off as he suddenly clutches his throat... He appears to be having issues breathing, and you can't do anything but watch in shock as he falls to his knees right before you. Someone has casted a very formidable spell upon him which killed him! Perhaps the elder school master was not correct and you won't be up to the task.

Day one has officially started. Deadline for Day one is Tuesday July 3rd 10pm EST.

During day one you may do the following:

Vote to kill one of the fellow students in hopes of finding a sect member by posting in thread:

Vote AlanT

You may also choose to pass items that you posess to another player by sending me a PM stating which item and to whom you wish to pass it.

[LoneStarGirl]

Are we going to have another thread or are we playing in this one? Cuz I have my role and a student of the school and am good :D

[LoneStarGirl]

answers that question....

[Passacaglia]

Student checking in.

[Poli]

Student, yo. Mercy, there's a lot of reading to do.

[Alan T]

This should have been posted in the day 1 start post, but wanted to make sure everyone understand you may also vote No Kill for the day too. If the majority votes no kill, then no kill will occur this day.

[Alan T]

Also in the ingredients listed in the rules, Holy water has been renamed to Spring water. The properties of the ingredient or any recipe it is in has remained unchanged, only the name was changed.

[Izulde]

Student here and I have noo idea what my item does.

[Barkeep49]

Our choices to sleep are the library, great hall, kitchen, or storeroom?

[Barkeep49]

In some ways I think revealing what our ingredients are, before we know what they do, is beneficial, in that the bad guys won't know what they should lie about having. As such I'll start off and say that I have soured milk.

[hoopsguy]

How do people feel about volunteering info up?

I've got a name that makes me think I got sand kicked in my face in the wizard schoolyard.

I've got an item, but I'm not sure that full disclosure on this stuff makes sense yet. I'm hoping that some discussion emerges with people giving pros/cons on whatever position they establish on this point.

[Swaggs]

Checking in real quick. I am a student of the hill.

I still need to read over the rules in the first few posts.

[Barkeep49]

How do people feel about volunteering info up?

I've got a name that makes me think I got sand kicked in my face in the wizard schoolyard.

I've got an item, but I'm not sure that full disclosure on this stuff makes sense yet. I'm hoping that some discussion emerges with people giving pros/cons on whatever position they establish on this point.
That's real lame hoops. I'd expect you to be giving pros or cons. Especially as I already gave the pro I see: it's not known how items combine so let's start figuring out who has what now so we can combine to make things good for the villagers when it becomes known what we're looking for.

[Swaggs]

I'm with Barkeep on this one.

I have some mushrooms.

Does anyone think there is anything to be gained from revealing our names?

[Lathum]

got my role, need to read the rules

[Poli]

I'm out for the night and most of the day, I'll be back sometime in the afternoon. Heading to Hannibal's hospital (some friggin' 2.5 hour trip one-way) for about 3-4 hours of work and then heading back home.

[hoopsguy]

That's real lame hoops. I'd expect you to be giving pros or cons. Especially as I already gave the pro I see: it's not known how items combine so let's start figuring out who has what now so we can combine to make things good for the villagers when it becomes known what we're looking for.

You know I'm going to have pros/cons - I just figured it would be interesting to see what other people are thinking.

My concern with full disclosure is that the bad guys are going to learn stuff as well. And they are going to be able to communicate with each other about their findings and selectively share information with us. So if we reveal a full roadmap of our items, they can pick and choose who to eliminate that have threatening items to them (potentially unbeknownst to the good guys).

That's the downside. I think it is pretty clear that we need to communicate with each other, but I'm not sure that a full reveal at the outset is the best way to do this. I would rather have someone reveal how to build an item that has usefulness and then see if we can choreograph our movements around getting it constructed - either publicly or privately.

I'm generally a guy who favors the free flow of information. I just think that, based on my interpretation of the rules so far, this may not be an optimal strategy this game. We already have three people who have revealed their items. I agree that there is equal lack of info right now, but I worry that those people may be putting a target on themselves by the start of Day 2.

[Lathum]

I think revealing names shouldn't be an issue.

Mine is Ardkis.

As for items I am more of a fan of keeping things private for the time being.

I also think we should vote no kill for at least a night until we can get a handle on tthe whole spell making thing

[hoopsguy]

I'm a hair concerned about revealing names as well. In some magic cultures names have meaning and power. I think our collection of mages qualifies as a magic culture. So I'm going to hold off on stating my given name for a little while longer, just in case Alan put this angle in the game. Nothing in the rules to suggest he did, but the theme certainly supports this notion.

[LoneStarGirl]

I think I am going to wait and see how the revealing names and items works out for y'all before I do it.

[RendeR]

Hello my fellow students! My name is Morang (is it ok to announce names?) I love this place and will do whatever I can to assist us in routing the eeeevil from the school =)

I agree with the transfer of informaion, but we really ought to be careful about WHAT we share openly..as someone said, it gives the bad guys a real edge there.

If a majority thinks its a good idea I will share with you the items I have.


*DOH I need to refresh the page before I post!!*

[ntndeacon]

I got my role and I am on the side of good. I am going to wait at least a little while on divulging my item.

[DaddyTorgo]

VOTE HOOPSGUY

he's come out strongly against revealing pretty much anything.

First-level analysis suggests that this is because he's a wolf
second-level suggests that that's too obvious a play for a wolf so he's a villager
third-level suggests that he'd know that and could be playing it as a wolf

if he isn't a wolf it's at least a reason to put a d1 vote on someone and see, maybe it will attract some wolves.

if he is a wolf (which I don't think honestly) then booya.

vote subject to change of course, and likely will. But wanted to get the ball rolling.

[Lathum]

VOTE NO KILL

[path12]

Student checking in. Will read the rules in the morning.

[Chief Rum]

You know, the last time Alan trapped us all in a room, we were almost all wolves.

I am...a student of good. :)

There is too much going on here, IMO, to further screw us all up by keeping secrets that are unlikely to hurt us if revealed. Like Swaggs, I have mushrooms. Not sure what that means. Is it just a common ingredient? Or some sort of curious throw by random.org?

The good news is that both of us need not go into the library to figure out what they co do or be used in. Swaggs, we may want to coordinate our info-gathering efforts, at least on Day One. What say you?

Now, as to the Day One vote, I'm going to say something unpopular that could get me killed, because it cuts against conventional wisdom. And that wisdom says we should never let a day go by without a lynch. That said, I would advocate going with a No Kill today, even at the expense of giving the wolves an automatic head start.

Fact is, we almost always kill a villager on too little information or bad gut calls on Day One. Every now and then we get lucky and catch a wolf, but without doing an analysis, I would guess that is maybe a 20% shot in any given game, and that might be overstating the odds a bit.

Since it is clear we do get new information as the days pass, I would suggest we take the opportunity to not needlessly kill a villager for a day and see what we can turn up from a night of information and ingredient gathering and study.

I do NOT recommend we do this more than once, because we need the voting records. But I think we can do this for a day and not lose too much to sect members.

Anyone with me? Or am I signing my death warrant?

[Chief Rum]

Might as well put my money where my mouth is...

VOTE NO KILL

[Lathum]

as you can see above CR I agree with you

[st.cronin]

Vote No Kill

[st.cronin]

Eldwar checking in, sworn to uphold good. I've got beeswax.

[Alan T]

Just a reminder, please do not edit your posts. If you make a mistake, simply make a new post correcting it.

[st.cronin]

So as far as I can tell, passing items today would just be a wild guess? Might it be a good idea to consolidate some of these items, anyway?

[Passacaglia]

I'm not sure I like the idea of revealing items at this point. Only wolves know the recipes, right? If we try to combine things publicly, don't we play into the wolves hands?

[Passacaglia]

But I do like the idea of revealing names. Mine is Englther.

[st.cronin]

I'm not sure I like the idea of revealing items at this point. Only wolves know the recipes, right? If we try to combine things publicly, don't we play into the wolves hands?

What makes you think that?

[Chief Rum]

I'm heading out for the day, just so you all know. Two day job day, as usual, on Tuesdays. Good luck, everyone.

[Passacaglia]

This:

Those whom are sect members (evil players) will receive a different PM including who else is a member of the sect, the sect's winning condition (listed above), and what recipes they know at the start of the game.

[Barkeep49]

We learn very little if we do not lynch. In the long run people regret not lynching. While I think hoops has been suspicous I'm going to go with Lathum because he knows it's to the wolves advantage to no lynch.

Vote Lathum

[Swaggs]

We learn very little if we do not lynch. In the long run people regret not lynching. While I think hoops has been suspicous I'm going to go with Lathum because he knows it's to the wolves advantage to no lynch.

Vote Lathum

I go back and forth on this school of thought, but with veteran players, I feel like wolves know how to split their votes well enough without tipping their hands this early. When I consider that, along with the fact that we will probably lynch one of our own and lessen our numbers, I am pushing for a no vote today, as well.

Vote No Vote

[Passacaglia]

I'm leaning toward a no kill vote, too. I'm not sure what there is to regret, anyway. Do we ever learn anything from Day 1 votes?

[Lathum]

We learn very little if we do not lynch. In the long run people regret not lynching. While I think hoops has been suspicous I'm going to go with Lathum because he knows it's to the wolves advantage to no lynch.

Vote Lathum

of course I know that which is why if I was a wolf I would never make that suggestion.

Go back through old games, I am usualy very vocal about needing to lynch someone everyday. If I was a wolf there would be no way I would go this far out of charectuer.

[st.cronin]

No lynch on day 1 is actually worse for the wolves than for the village. I'm surprised Barkeep doesn't realize this.

[RendeR]

A NO VOTE on day 1 is definitely bad for the wolves as it almost always nabs a villager. I'm torn now because I don't want to lose a villager so I prefer a NO VOTE today, but barkeep's pressing for a lynching makes me want to vote for him.

What to do what to do....

[Lathum]

If I was going to vote it would be for Barkeep the Pass. Barkeep for pushing a lynch ( me!) and Pass for playing the "helpfull" villager role.

I also would consider hoops but if he is alive after night 2 he is likely a wolf.

[path12]

I also would consider hoops but if he is alive after night 2 he is likely a wolf.

Laying the groundwork early, I see. ;)

Not sure what I think about the no lynch idea. I usually prefer getting a record started. Also think I'll keep my name/ingredient private for now since as Pass pointed out the wolves apparently do have some recipes from the beginning. I will say it's an ingredient that hasn't been mentioned yet though.

[path12]

Dola, I think Barkeep gets way too much grief for his pushing for information early. He's entirely consistent on that stand and I think it is usually wrong to read anything else into it than the fact that is his approach and style.

[Passacaglia]

Damn you, helpful villager!!!!

[Lathum]

Damn you, helpful villager!!!!

damn you right to hell!!!

[hoopsguy]

It's very quiet today - wonder if it is the holiday or just people don't have a lot to say?

Personally, I hate giving away a day to the wolves with a no vote. However, I don't understand the rules of this game well enough to understand what would be a good defense for someone. "Don't kill me, I have the mushrooms?"

We don't have any context right now for making good decisions, so the move to vote would only be to try and establish voting patterns for later. Well, there is obviously the chance that we get lucky, but it is less than 20% when the wolves have a block and everyone else is operating with incomplete info. I would put it more like 10%, assuming that there are three wolves out there right now.

[hoopsguy]

My initial thought is that this would have been a fine game to introduce a Night 0. Obviously I'll have more perspective after the game on whether that would have been a good idea, but it feels like it right now.

[DaddyTorgo]

the play of hoopsguy is still interesting to me, but i shall bow to seeming conventional wisdom

UNVOTE HOOPS
VOTE NO LYNCH

[Lathum]

I am off to drive to NJ in a few minutes. With such limited information I see no reason not to hold off for now.

The drive is about 10 hours so I'll be out untill well past the deadline. I will also be quieter then usual since I'll be at the inlaws with no wireless.

For now I say no lynch for one night.

[LoneStarGirl]

I am with Barkeep. I never have thought a tie or a no vote was a good thing for the villagers. And I dont know what good it is to say our ingredent yet, but my name is Taick.

[Barkeep49]

No lynch on day 1 is actually worse for the wolves than for the village. I'm surprised Barkeep doesn't realize this.
Really? I'd love to hear more on this as it's not been my experience. In games where I've offered a no lynch option, Spawn and To Crown a King, the wolves have benefited from the no lynch, and the villagers from lynching, on the whole. I believe this to be true in other games which have offered no lynch options as well.

As path points out I think information is the key to Werewolf. Information is gained in multiple ways, and lynching someone is an important way. But it seems as though I am going to be once again in the minority on this one, so not much I can do. But I would support virtually any lynch.

[Barkeep49]

BTW I am of the opinion, along with Alan, that revealing one's name is potentially dangerous and this is why I have not encouraged those reveals or done so myself.

[Barkeep49]

DOLA -- Correction, err not with Alan, with hoops.

[ntndeacon]

I never can decide whether it is or is not better to go No Lynch. And although we will have to share info eventually to make the big items wonders if that info is more to the sect's advantage than ours. Remember as Pass said (I think) They are the only ones that knows any spells at the moment. and might be coveting some of the items we have mentioned.

[Passacaglia]

BTW I am of the opinion, along with Alan, that revealing one's name is potentially dangerous and this is why I have not encouraged those reveals or done so myself.

But..your post right before this said information is the key to werewolf. I can understand not revealing items, but names? What do you think can happen from revealing names?

[Barkeep49]

But..your post right before this said information is the key to werewolf. I can understand not revealing items, but names? What do you think can happen from revealing names?
Names in many magically based worlds have special meaning and significance. By knowing someone's true name you're able to gain control and power over that person. The fact that we were each given a name, but this was not revealed publicly, leads me to believe this might be true here. I see no potential upside to stating my name, unlike with items where I think it will allow us to coordinate.

[Passacaglia]

I doubt that people will be able to gain control and power over someone -- I just don't see that kind of thing happening here. On the other hand, my hunch is that some patterns can be seen in these names -- maybe something will be different about the names of the sect members, or maybe they won't even have names, and we'll be able to spot their fake names.

[LoneStarGirl]

I agree that I dont think revealing names will benefit the wolves in any way. But I do feel that if we say no lynch we are just prolonging a day one vote. I do not see the benefit in saying no vote, so if somebody can tell me how a no vote helps the villagers, then I will also no vote.... but I think right now I am going to have to vote with whoever Barkeep votes for, just to ensure a lynch tonight.

[path12]

On the other hand, my hunch is that some patterns can be seen in these names -- maybe something will be different about the names of the sect members, or maybe they won't even have names, and we'll be able to spot their fake names.


IMO, if the wolves do not have names and the rest of us do, or if there is an easy pattern to determine who is who by name only, the game is broken.

I can easily buy into the idea of names = opportunity for control though.

[Barkeep49]

I doubt that people will be able to gain control and power over someone -- I just don't see that kind of thing happening here. On the other hand, my hunch is that some patterns can be seen in these names -- maybe something will be different about the names of the sect members, or maybe they won't even have names, and we'll be able to spot their fake names.
Really? You don't think there is opportunity for someone to control another person when one of the spell's name is Command? Either you haven't spent much time with the rules (and I admit I'm still VERY fuzzy on them) or you're trying to hide something.

[Barkeep49]

Dola -- We also shouldn't forget about the potion that is Mind Control.

I mean you can argue that knowing someone's name isn't important to those spells, but I don't think you can argue that there isn't the potential for harm, and I have still yet to hear any potential positive.

I maintain, AGAIN, that while there IS potential harm with the items there is upside as well and we're going to need the trust at some point in order to start crafting the spells/potions that we want.

[Passacaglia]

Also in the ingredients listed in the rules, Holy water has been renamed to Spring water. The properties of the ingredient or any recipe it is in has remained unchanged, only the name was changed.

This post has confused me for a while -- were the ingredients actually listed in the rules?

Anyway, I hadn't noticed the mind control potion. I guess there has to be something of that sort going on here. Too late, anyway -- my name is out there.

[Barkeep49]

Ok, I still think we should go after someone. In the past two games Pass has been ON TOP of his game as a villager in both games. He's just so off here I think he might be a wolf. I realize we're clearly headed down the no lynch way, but let me get my suspicion of Pass on the record.

Unvote Lathum
Vote Pass

[RendeR]

The thing i see is this, if we lynch someone, anyone, we gain the knowledge of that one identity, but probably VERY little else. The second problem with a Lynching is that the odds are its going to be one of us good guys, and again, thats not beneficial.

I don't like fighting long odds trying to get a lucky break on day 1, HOWEVER, if you or a number of people can convince me its really worth it or that we have someone pretty solid as a wolf already (somehow?) then I would be inclined to join a lynch vote.

[DaddyTorgo]

been AWOL. busy day.

[Passacaglia]

Ok, I still think we should go after someone. In the past two games Pass has been ON TOP of his game as a villager in both games. He's just so off here I think he might be a wolf. I realize we're clearly headed down the no lynch way, but let me get my suspicion of Pass on the record.

Unvote Lathum
Vote Pass

Sounds like a backhanded compliment to me, but I see where you're coming from. I think we've managed to disagree on all three of the main issues going around today. You've got me a little more convinced about the names, but I just don't see us making any headway by trying to figure out recipes as a team -- I figure it just gives the wolves too much room to push us in bad directions. I'm of the same mind regarding lynching -- the wolves will be able to affect the vote while still flying under the radar.

VOTE NO KILL

[DaddyTorgo]

bout to head out of work. won't be on till ~7 or 7:30 EDT.

but it seems fairly quiet anyways (likely due to the holiday i'd presume)

[Barkeep49]

The thing i see is this, if we lynch someone, anyone, we gain the knowledge of that one identity, but probably VERY little else. The second problem with a Lynching is that the odds are its going to be one of us good guys, and again, thats not beneficial.

I don't like fighting long odds trying to get a lucky break on day 1, HOWEVER, if you or a number of people can convince me its really worth it or that we have someone pretty solid as a wolf already (somehow?) then I would be inclined to join a lynch vote.
See that's what's so alluring about the no kill option. On each individual day this is almost always true. However, we don't get anywhere by taking this position everyday. We need information and lynching someone not only gets us information about that person but also about how people react to voting for that person, or not voting. I guess what I'm saying is that even though tomorrow we'll know more about how to use our ingredients it is unlikely we will know any more that will justify a lynch. And each day without a lynch is an opportunity forever wasted.

[path12]

I'm not going to vote no kill, and since it's pretty much a futile gesture anyway

VOTE PASS

Personally, I'd rather divulge my ingredient than my name.......but until we get an idea of what goes together to make what, that it's better off keeping everything quiet.

[Poli]

Good lord, I typed out my vote some 30 minutes ago. My brother just popped in. He just popped out.

I don't like helping the wolves any more than I have to.

Vote No Kill

[Poli]

Weird. I appear offline.

[Poli]

Anyhow, I'm not comfortable sharing either. I mean, I'll do it if pressed, but I'd rather not.

[Poli]

All I want is my little light for the online thing to come on.

[Passacaglia]

See that's what's so alluring about the no kill option. On each individual day this is almost always true. However, we don't get anywhere by taking this position everyday. We need information and lynching someone not only gets us information about that person but also about how people react to voting for that person, or not voting. I guess what I'm saying is that even though tomorrow we'll know more about how to use our ingredients it is unlikely we will know any more that will justify a lynch. And each day without a lynch is an opportunity forever wasted.

I don't think anything has said anything about doing it every day. But a Day 1 vote is filled with people voting for pretty lame reasons -- something like being mad at someone from the last game, or hitting up random.org, and the like. Usually on Day 2, we at least have something to go on.

[st.cronin]

See that's what's so alluring about the no kill option. On each individual day this is almost always true. However, we don't get anywhere by taking this position everyday.

Pass beat me to it, but I'm not advocating taking this position everyday. I'm advocating taking this position on day 1.

[LoneStarGirl]

vote pass

Although I bet it doesn't matter

[Poli]

By the sounds of it, I'm going to be heading to town to return some "bed in a box" that we never put together and picking up a stove for the house. Not sure when I'll be back.

I hate day 1's.

[RendeR]

I'm still walking the fence on the day 1 vote, anyone keeping a tally of how the votes are right now?

[path12]

I'm still walking the fence on the day 1 vote, anyone keeping a tally of how the votes are right now?

3 Pass and a bunch of no kills.

[Barkeep49]

Pass beat me to it, but I'm not advocating taking this position everyday. I'm advocating taking this position on day 1.
I'm glad your so optimistic, but I frankly think it's unlikely we'll have any more information, especially since people don't want to share info, tomorrow. My question is what will be different tomorrow than today?

[st.cronin]

I'm glad your so optimistic, but I frankly think it's unlikely we'll have any more information, especially since people don't want to share info, tomorrow. My question is what will be different tomorrow than today?

:confused:

Weren't you, earlier, complaining that people were being too free with info??? Now you're saying people aren't sharing info? I don't understand your point of view, at all.

Anyway, it seems like everybody has at least some limited night action, so I expect that at least some of us will have more information tomorrow.

[st.cronin]

dola, at any rate I've shared everything I know to this point

[Barkeep49]

:confused:

Weren't you, earlier, complaining that people were being too free with info??? Now you're saying people aren't sharing info? I don't understand your point of view, at all.

Anyway, it seems like everybody has at least some limited night action, so I expect that at least some of us will have more information tomorrow.
Oh I have NO doubt there will be more information tomorrow, in terms of spells and such. I don't think people will share it, but it'll be out there.

But that's sort of irrelevant towards finding a wolf, isn't it? I mean in the long run it's not but are people really proposing we hold off lynching until we've got spells together to assist us? Seems like an awful risky strategy to me.

My point is the information out there tomorrow, which might or might not be publicly shared, does NOT help us find a wolf. Therefore we'll either have people suggesting another no lynch day (see my comments about how on any individual day we're more likely to find a villager than wolf) or we'll make an uninformed lynch when we could have had SOME information from today.

Actually that's kind of my point. Lynching provides us with information. Guaranteed. Why are we rejecting that?

[st.cronin]

Barkeep, I believe that a lynch on day 1 almost NEVER provides the village with any useful information, and almost always results in a villager being lynched - usually an important villager.

[Barkeep49]

Barkeep, I believe that a lynch on day 1 almost NEVER provides the village with any useful information, and almost always results in a villager being lynched - usually an important villager.
Are you sure it's a D1 lynch or the first lynch? I frankly think the first lynch isn't of great value myself, but some day has to be the first one. Even if we get a guaranteed wolf tomorrow then we'll have gathered little usable info.

[st.cronin]

Are you sure it's a D1 lynch or the first lynch? I frankly think the first lynch isn't of great value myself, but some day has to be the first one. Even if we get a guaranteed wolf tomorrow then we'll have gathered little usable info.

I'm talking about D1. If we had had a night 0, I would be pushing people to lynch somebody.

[ntndeacon]

Vote Pass

I am going to lean with Barkeep here. If for no other reason than to give us a choice. I also tend to think there is a time that sharing info is a good idea, but day one is NOT it. at least tomorrow some of us will have SOME idea of what these ingredients can make. Until then it is just giving the sect a reason to go after certain ones of us.

[Alan T]

Current vote count:


(7) No kill - Lathum (71), Chief Rum (74), St.cronin (76), swaggs (86), Daddytorgo (98), Passacaglia (116), ardent (120)
(4) Pass - Barkeep (113), Path (119), Lonestargirl (126), ntndeacon (137)
(0) Hoopsguy - Daddytorgo (70)XXX
(0) Lathum - Barkeep (85)XXX

Keep in mind that because of the 4th of july we will have an extended night tonight until 11am EST tommorrow morning. The rules originally stated noon, but I need to do it by 11 instead.

Also remember, everyone should send in a PM to me with which room they wish to spend time in tonight (Great hall, library, kitchen or store room). This can be done now if you want to make sure to get it in on time. Tommorrow's Day period will be extended from 11am EST until July 5th at 10pm EST because of the holiday.

[DaddyTorgo]

i's have returned.

[Alan T]

Your first day in the school sparks all kinds of discussion. While some discuss going forward with what the late school master left you with in the way of crafting magic, others discussed the pros and cons of proceeding to try to remove the threat right away.

After discussion goes back and forth, the final decision from the majority is to let everyone live in hopes that the night might produce some form of further clues to how to combat this great threat.

Final vote:

(4) Passacaglia - Barkeep (113), Path (119), Lonestargirl (126), ntndeacon (137)
(7) No kill - Lathum (71), Chief Rum (74), St.cronin (76), swaggs (86), Daddytorgo (98), Passacaglia (116), ardent (120)

Didnt vote: Hoopsguy, Render, Izulde

It is now Night 1. Deadline is 11am EST tommorrow morning (july 4th). Please submit which room you choose to spend the night in, as well as any other evening actions that you may have by that time.

[RendeR]

DOH! I was still running on the last games deadline of 10:30, my bad!

[hoopsguy]

Consider my "no vote" to be supporting the no lynch, if someone wants to track it. My hope is that when it comes time to vote tomorrow I'll understand if I'm playing chess or checkers. I understand the position that someone has to be first, but I don't believe that making a guess without any meaningful shared understanding of the rules of this game helps our cause.

[Swaggs]

So, do we have to do anything special for night actions?

I'm not super clear on whether or not we just acquire additional items or have to do some type of searching for them.

[Alan T]

So, do we have to do anything special for night actions?

I'm not super clear on whether or not we just acquire additional items or have to do some type of searching for them.


Just state in PM to me which room you wish to spend the night in. As part of your being there, you will spend a bit of time searching through to see what you can find, and the remainder of your time sleeping/resting. (Unless you have some other special night action).

As you spend more time in various parts of the school, you will likely learn what to expect from spending a night in each area.

[Alan T]

Each of you spend the night in various parts of the schoolhouse searching for various things that might prove useful in the future. Eventually all of you grow tired and sucumb to sleep.

Once the morning appears and light begins to shine once again into the great hall, you all gather together once again to discuss the previous day's events. One of you notices that Daddytorgo has not joined you. Scrambling through the entire area, someone finally finds his now dead body in the library, his neck cleanly snapped. One of you decide to search his belongings, but find he has been cleaned out already.


Day two has now begun. Because of the extended July 4th play the deadline for this day is tommorrow (july 5th) night at 10pm EST.

During this day you may do the following:

1) Vote for a player that you feel is a sect member to kill. (post in the thread)
2) Vote for no kill at all. (Post in the thread)
3) Pass an item, ingredient, potion or magical item to another player (PM me with the information.)
4) Attempt to create a new potion or magical item (PM me with the ingredients and/or items you wish to use in your recipe)
5) Drink a potion (PM me)
6) Throw a potion at someone else (PM me, results will be publically shown in the thread at the end of the day.)

[Passacaglia]

I'll get things started. I spent the night in the library, and learned a recipe.

[Poli]

Storeroom.

[Lathum]

lol, been a bad run for DT

[Lathum]

I stayed in the storeroom as well and didn't find shit.

[hoopsguy]

I stayed in the kitchen and had similar results to the ones reported by Lathum.

Pass, do you need items to get value out of the recipe? If so, is that something you think makes sense to disclose publicly?

[ntndeacon]

I was in the library but Idid not find anything

[Passacaglia]

I stayed in the kitchen and had similar results to the ones reported by Lathum.

Pass, do you need items to get value out of the recipe? If so, is that something you think makes sense to disclose publicly?

I was a bit reluctant this morning, since I was the only person that got any votes yesterday. But thinking about it more, I can't see why not to reveal it. To make an eternal bond potion, we need vine and newt tail. However, I have neither of these things.

[DaddyTorgo]

damm the wolves! guess I got my "respect."

good luck villagers

[RendeR]

I spent the night in the Kitchen and found nada, zippo, zilch.

Anyone have a clue what an eternal Bond potion does?

[Passacaglia]

I'm thinking maybe it turns two people into one, in a way. When one gets killed, the other dies as well? I'm not sure that's worthwhile to us. Though someone else might read it differently.

[Lathum]

I'm thinking maybe it turns two people into one, in a way. When one gets killed, the other dies as well? I'm not sure that's worthwhile to us. Though someone else might read it differently.

unless that person gets linked with a wolf.

[Lathum]

so did anyone else learn a recipe?

[hoopsguy]

I was a bit reluctant this morning, since I was the only person that got any votes yesterday. But thinking about it more, I can't see why not to reveal it. To make an eternal bond potion, we need vine and newt tail. However, I have neither of these things.

If people want to help out Passacaglia with creating this potion they probably don't need to post that in the thread - just pass him the ingredient.

As far as the eternal bond, I can think of some devious ways to use for either side. For our side, take a shot at binding a couple of suspected wolves together - hopefully get at least one of the two guesses right. I also wouldn't publish who you bond ... keep the wolves guessing if they are bonded or who they should avoid killing in the event that they are bonded.

Of course, if it doesn't work as "lovers" but instead as "PM rights" then this strategy is just semi-amusing conjecture.

[Barkeep49]

Alan: does a person find out who passed them an item? I ask because it would seem like a shame if Pass got too many ingredients.

[Chief Rum]

I also spent the night in the library and found nothing. It was suggested though that I came away with the impression I could find something useful there with more study.

[Swaggs]

I'll get things started. I spent the night in the library, and learned a recipe.

Same here.

This may have already been known/assumed by others, but I think it is now fairly clear to me that certain rooms produce certain items.

Library = recipe
Kitchen = containers
storeroom = items

We are going to need to establish some CoTs or wait three (at least) days before we have anything to work with, unless folks can actually find or begin with potions/spells/etc.

[st.cronin]

I spent the night in the Great Hall. I don't have much to report, although my pm was ... enigmatic.

[Alan T]

Alan: does a person find out who passed them an item? I ask because it would seem like a shame if Pass got too many ingredients.

You are fully aware of any item handed over to you during the day time and who the person that gave it to you was. For the most part any day time action between you and someone else is generally known, while in general unless said otherwise most nighttime interactions are not known.

[st.cronin]

Vote LoneStarGirl

Not much of a reason for this. She was the third vote on pass, and is one of the players who most scares me as a potential wolf.

[st.cronin]

Darn, just realized deadline isn't til tomorrow.

[LoneStarGirl]

Okay, Last night was my last day in Houston with my mom for awhile so I didn't find time to get online to tell Alant where I would be staying last night. So I didn't stay anywhere. I flew back to Little Rock earlier today and am home for the rest of the month so nothing else should interfere with my WW games for awhile.

[Barkeep49]

Vote LoneStarGirl

Not much of a reason for this. She was the third vote on pass, and is one of the players who most scares me as a potential wolf.
What has changed that makes you think we should lynch someone today?

[hoopsguy]

IIt was suggested though that I came away with the impression I could find something useful there with more study.

Same detail here for my foray into the kitchen.

[st.cronin]

What has changed that makes you think we should lynch someone today?

Because today it's possible that some villagers will have some information.

[Barkeep49]

Because today it's possible that some villagers will have some information.
You're right it is possible. But why vote now? There's been no information presented, at least from my perspective, that makes it any easier or harder to figure out who is a villager.

[st.cronin]

You're right it is possible. But why vote now? There's been no information presented, at least from my perspective, that makes it any easier or harder to figure out who is a villager.

That's also true for me. I'll point out two things: One, when I made the vote I thought the deadline was tonight, and was alarmed that there were no votes. So, I was just trying to get something started where some information might come out. Two, I reserve the right to change my vote if some information does come out.

[Barkeep49]

Thanks for the clarifications, cronin.

I will be voting to lynch again, though based on the analysis I worked through with cronin, question whether we'll get a lynch AGAIN as the underlying reasons for not lynching yesterday are still present, as I feared. This lynch vote, however, is less likely to be on Pass. Though I think you can easily construct a scenario where he does this reveal as a wolf, I think we should be giving out info and don't want to punish someone who has done that based on little more than an inclination.

[Barkeep49]

Also anyone want to offer speculation about why DT?

[Swaggs]

This may not be a popular suggestion, but I'll put it out there anyway.

If anyone is interested, I have acquired the recipe for a potion. I would like to lobby for anyone with a container of some sort and a liquid of any sort to consider passing it to me before the deadline.

I haven't really thought through the pros and cons of this real well, but I figured I would put it out there for discussion. If you disagree with my proposal, I'd like some ideas on what should be done with my recipe (do I make it public, pass it to someone, etc.)?

[Izulde]

Nothing to report unfortunately, as I received no information of any sort. My guess is I spent all evening sleeping in my room.

[Izulde]

dola,

I do think we should organize a lynch, as lynching gives us information, while not lynching gives baddies a free shot.

[Chief Rum]

Thanks for the clarifications, cronin.

I will be voting to lynch again, though based on the analysis I worked through with cronin, question whether we'll get a lynch AGAIN as the underlying reasons for not lynching yesterday are still present, as I feared. This lynch vote, however, is less likely to be on Pass. Though I think you can easily construct a scenario where he does this reveal as a wolf, I think we should be giving out info and don't want to punish someone who has done that based on little more than an inclination.

I'm not sure why you think nothing has changed. When I suggested this path two days ago, it was always with the intent it only go through one vote. I can't speak for others, but I will be voting to lynch someone today. We can afford to go a day without a lynch. We can't go two. And I think that was the feeling conveyed by a number of us no-lynch voters. So I'm not sure why you think we would go back on that.

I am going to vote closer to deadline after work, in the hopes more information or viable candidates are brought forth. I will be at my job most of the day until then.

[Passacaglia]

This may not be a popular suggestion, but I'll put it out there anyway.

If anyone is interested, I have acquired the recipe for a potion. I would like to lobby for anyone with a container of some sort and a liquid of any sort to consider passing it to me before the deadline.

I haven't really thought through the pros and cons of this real well, but I figured I would put it out there for discussion. If you disagree with my proposal, I'd like some ideas on what should be done with my recipe (do I make it public, pass it to someone, etc.)?

From what I understand, you don't need to worry about a container -- they're just laying around, or somesuch. That said, I am skeptical of a plan where several folks hand whatever ingredients they have to one person, just because they have a recipe.

[Alan T]

From what I understand, you don't need to worry about a container -- they're just laying around, or somesuch. That said, I am skeptical of a plan where several folks hand whatever ingredients they have to one person, just because they have a recipe.

Just so confusion of game mechanics doesn't get in the way of actually playing the game. Without confirming or denying anything that either of you or others may or may not have or know.. the way the potions work are:

Normal potions = 1 or 2 ingredients mixed in any old beaker you can find lying around (assumed anyone can find a beaker or some tube to mix a potion in when the time comes).

Special potions = 1 or 2 ingredients mixed in a specific type of item or items that might be findable in one of the rooms at night.

[Barkeep49]

I'm not sure why you think nothing has changed. When I suggested this path two days ago, it was always with the intent it only go through one vote. I can't speak for others, but I will be voting to lynch someone today. We can afford to go a day without a lynch. We can't go two. And I think that was the feeling conveyed by a number of us no-lynch voters. So I'm not sure why you think we would go back on that.

I am going to vote closer to deadline after work, in the hopes more information or viable candidates are brought forth. I will be at my job most of the day until then.
CR, this frankly doesn't make a lot of sense. Why is no lynching good for one day but not two in your opinion?

[st.cronin]

I'm not sure I believe Izulde.

[Passacaglia]

I'm not sure I believe Izulde.

You think he's playing dumb? It seems like he doesn't realize that he was supposed to choose a spot to sleep in at night...

[Passacaglia]

I feel like we should get things started early today. I guess it depends on how you look at this day -- things were probably slow because of the holiday, so you could say it's like the day is beginning now, but also you could say that the day is half over. I don't usually vote early, so this vote is made with my usual timidity, meaning that I'm not averse to changing it. But after campaigning for people to pass him all their stuff, Swaggs is on my radar, so he gets my vote.

VOTE SWAGGS

[st.cronin]

You think he's playing dumb? It seems like he doesn't realize that he was supposed to choose a spot to sleep in at night...

I suppose that's possible.

[Swaggs]

I feel like we should get things started early today. I guess it depends on how you look at this day -- things were probably slow because of the holiday, so you could say it's like the day is beginning now, but also you could say that the day is half over. I don't usually vote early, so this vote is made with my usual timidity, meaning that I'm not averse to changing it. But after campaigning for people to pass him all their stuff, Swaggs is on my radar, so he gets my vote.

VOTE SWAGGS

I was just trying to put an idea out there. I'm willing to be transparent with what happens and even pass or "throw" the potion at someone that we can all agree on during the day.

If you have any better ideas, let them rip. You didn't really offer an alternative or critique of my proposal, so I think me putting an idea out there and you finding it suspicious is pretty weak.

BTW, if you all decide to vote for me, please try to mention who you find trustworthy, as early as it is, so that I can pass my recipe to someone that can help us with it.

[Barkeep49]

I'm not sure I believe Izulde.
I agree. Seems to me people have a default sleeping place, in this case the great room, if they don't submit. I feel like he'd still have gotten a "you didn't get anything" PM.

[Swaggs]

I'm out till after work.

[st.cronin]

Swaggs, is your recipe one that is equally useful for good or evil?

[Passacaglia]

I was just trying to put an idea out there. I'm willing to be transparent with what happens and even pass or "throw" the potion at someone that we can all agree on during the day.

If you have any better ideas, let them rip. You didn't really offer an alternative or critique of my proposal, so I think me putting an idea out there and you finding it suspicious is pretty weak.

BTW, if you all decide to vote for me, please try to mention who you find trustworthy, as early as it is, so that I can pass my recipe to someone that can help us with it.

Didn't offer an alternative? I performed the alternative! I was in the exact same situation as you claim to be. You can see my proposed alternative in what I did. I came out with what the recipe was, and let the village know. You could say this was more important for me to do than for you, because I was the only person to get votes on Day 1, so in case I get lynched today, I needed to get that info out to the village. You could also say that was a more dangerous move, since I was already in danger of being lynched, and came out with some info that we know wolves have, but either way, as a villager, the right move is to let the village know what you've got. I could be wrong on this, but I figure that the wolves already know the recipe you have (but it might just be the case that the wolves know some, but not all of the recipes).

Didn't critique? I may not have come out and said it, but having several of us passing items to one person can be very dangerous, if that person is a wolf. Statisitically, the odds are in favor of you being a villager, but if you're not, we're screwed. And if you are, we get a potion, and we don't even know what it does. There's way too much risk, and not enough reward, in my opinion.

[hoopsguy]

BK, I can understand the line of questioning about no lynch on Day 1, but it feels like you are being intentionally obtuse with questions about why people would move forward with a lynch on Day 2. Clearly we cannot grant a kill each and every day while trying to compile more information.

Hindsight being 20/20, did we learn enough on Night 1 to justify the "no lynch" line of action? Based on what I've read so far, probably not. If you are trying to raise a point for future games, message received loud and clear. But it isn't really helping us ferret out wolves this game.

[Lathum]

No way am I voting Swaggs, I just don't see a wolf putting himself out there like that.

[hoopsguy]

Also, this is probably a case of me just missing something but ...

Does recipe = potion or magic item? I would assume the former, I didn't find this information with a quick re-read of the rules.

[Passacaglia]

Here's another alternative -- we can have Swaggs pass the recipe to someone else, who can verify what the recipe was. This might help us build a little bit of trust in a couple people, but I think there's a lot of problems with that -- I'd rather that the whole village just knows the recipes.

[Passacaglia]

Also, this is probably a case of me just missing something but ...

Does recipe = potion or magic item? I would assume the former, I didn't find this information with a quick re-read of the rules.

From how I understand it, a recipe is used to make a potion. A magic item is made by combining a potion with a non-magic item.

[Poli]

I assumed potion...but I admit I haven't read the rules closely.

[st.cronin]

Has anybody had any indication that they might become aware of other player's night actions based on what room they're in?

[Lathum]

I'd rather that the whole village just knows the recipes.

why, it seems to me if we let the wolves know everything we have we are giving them a huge advantage.

[Passacaglia]

Those whom are sect members (evil players) will receive a different PM including who else is a member of the sect, the sect's winning condition (listed above), and what recipes they know at the start of the game.

Seems to me like the wolves already know multiple recipes each. They might not know all of them, but there's a good chance that any recipes an individual villager knows, the wolves know, too.

[st.cronin]

I'd rather that the whole village just knows the recipes.

It depends on what the recipes are, no? I'm guessing there are some recipes we would prefer to destroy if possible.

[LoneStarGirl]

Seems to me something about Pass just isn't sitting well. First he jumps on Swaggs and then seems to be highly knowledgeable about what the wolves might or might not know

And Cronin, did you give a good reason for voting me?

[st.cronin]

And Cronin, did you give a good reason for voting me?

No, and I don't really have one. I may move my vote if something develops.

[Barkeep49]

Hindsight being 20/20, did we learn enough on Night 1 to justify the "no lynch" line of action? Based on what I've read so far, probably not. If you are trying to raise a point for future games, message received loud and clear. But it isn't really helping us ferret out wolves this game.
That sort of was my point, and so I will pursue it no further.

[Passacaglia]

It depends on what the recipes are, no? I'm guessing there are some recipes we would prefer to destroy if possible.

I'd agree with that. If a recipe can do nothing but harm for the village, though, I'd rather the owner of the recipe keep quiet about it and destroy it without us knowing.

[Passacaglia]

Seems to me something about Pass just isn't sitting well. First he jumps on Swaggs and then seems to be highly knowledgeable about what the wolves might or might not know

And Cronin, did you give a good reason for voting me?

You saw my reasoning for "jumping on" Swaggs. I think they're valid. As for my knowledge...I'm just working with what we've got in the rules. It's all part of helping the village.

[Passacaglia]

Anyway, I passed my recipe. Hopefully whoever I passed it to can verify that it was what I said it was, if that helps any.

[st.cronin]

I actually like the way Pass is playing, I don't have a bad feeling about him at all.

[Barkeep49]

Why destroy it without letting us know it? I would guess there are limited quantities of a recipe in the game. Seems to me that would be good info to have.

[LoneStarGirl]

I wasn't saying I was going to vote for you Pass, just expressing some concern.
It definitely feels like we are on day one all over again though.

[st.cronin]

Is it even possible to destroy a recipe? I brought that up, but I wasn't really being serious.

[Passacaglia]

I didn't see anything in the rules about destroying a recipe. Alan could probably answer that here or via PM, but I didn't feel it was worth bugging him about, at least for me.

[Alan T]

I didn't see anything in the rules about destroying a recipe. Alan could probably answer that here or via PM, but I didn't feel it was worth bugging him about, at least for me.

Sure, a recipe is just a piece of paper, I'm pretty sure you could destroy it beyond all belief. However that doesn't mean that information dies with the recipe being destroyed, or there isn't another copy of that recipe available somewhere, or that you would even want to destroy a recipe for some magic that is far beyond what you as a student would understand just yet.

[Passacaglia]

Sure, a recipe is just a piece of paper, I'm pretty sure you could destroy it beyond all belief. However that doesn't mean that information dies with the recipe being destroyed, or there isn't another copy of that recipe available somewhere, or that you would even want to destroy a recipe for some magic that is far beyond what you as a student would understand just yet.

Right, it just means that it wouldn't get passed when you die?

[Barkeep49]

Ok I just read over DT's posts.

There are two things that could get him killed:
1. He stated he had mercury
2. He voted against hoopsguy (though later he retracted this vote)

As I don't know anything about mercury and its usefulness, I'm going to think that perhaps his suspicion of hoops is what got him killed and go in that direction for my vote at the moment.

Vote hoopsguy

[Alan T]

Right, it just means that it wouldn't get passed when you die?

Correct, it would no longer be passable

[hoopsguy]

In regards to me/DT, what is more likely?
1. He voices concerns about me as a wolf and I as a wolf decide to kill him on Night 1?
2. He voices concerns about me as a wolf and the wolves (knowing that I'm a villager) think that may provide a distraction for today?

This is leaving out anything to do with mercury, with trying to randomize their actions, or whatever else the wolves would try to accomplish with their kill. My point here is that I know, and hope others will believe, that this is a red herring.

[path12]

Catching up. I spent the night in the kitchen.

[path12]

Has anybody had any indication that they might become aware of other player's night actions based on what room they're in?

Nobody else was mentioned in my PM.

[ntndeacon]

In regards to me/DT, what is more likely?
1. He voices concerns about me as a wolf and I as a wolf decide to kill him on Night 1?
2. He voices concerns about me as a wolf and the wolves (knowing that I'm a villager) think that may provide a distraction for today?

This is leaving out anything to do with mercury, with trying to randomize their actions, or whatever else the wolves would try to accomplish with their kill. My point here is that I know, and hope others will believe, that this is a red herring.

I could see #1 being true and using #2 as a reason to give to all of us that it wasn't me. Of course the problem with that is in most games the 1st dead has voted for someone.

[path12]

I want clarification from Izulde about where he was last night.

VOTE IZULDE

[Poli]

I didn't get anything like that either, path.

[Poli]

I wonder if we can track the wolves by locations at night.

[Barkeep49]

I wonder if we can track the wolves by locations at night.
I'm skeptical considering no one has come forward stating that they saw another person with them last night and I know someone was in the same place as I was (the storeroom).

[ntndeacon]

Has anybody had any indication that they might become aware of other player's night actions based on what room they're in?

no, there was nothing in my post of anything except that I did not understand what iwas looking at. I might with more study though.

[hoopsguy]

I didn't get any location info either - sounds like both Path and I have to take each other at their word that they were in the kitchen.

[hoopsguy]

FWIW, DaddyTorgo was found in the library - his location is included in the PM (post #145) so I'm guessing that location is important in some way, even if it isn't spelled out for us in the PMs.

[Poli]

I'm skeptical considering no one has come forward stating that they saw another person with them last night and I know someone was in the same place as I was (the storeroom).
Me too.

[Barkeep49]

In regards to me/DT, what is more likely?
1. He voices concerns about me as a wolf and I as a wolf decide to kill him on Night 1?
2. He voices concerns about me as a wolf and the wolves (knowing that I'm a villager) think that may provide a distraction for today?

This is leaving out anything to do with mercury, with trying to randomize their actions, or whatever else the wolves would try to accomplish with their kill. My point here is that I know, and hope others will believe, that this is a red herring.
I've found that many times the simplest explanation is the best one. We can debate whether the simplest explanation has to do with his item or with his vote against you but you're a smart enough player to know that claiming to be a smart player is a great defense against doing an action that is simply explained :).

[Poli]

Heh. I missed posts 201 through about 210 initially.

[st.cronin]

FWIW, DaddyTorgo was found in the library - his location is included in the PM (post #145) so I'm guessing that location is important in some way, even if it isn't spelled out for us in the PMs.

Exactly what I'm thinking. I suspect there are some players/potions/magical items that will be able to make use of location in some way useful to the village.

For the record, I saw nothing last night, and got no indication that I could in the future. I'm planning on staying in the Great Hall again tonight.

[ntndeacon]

my guess is that is where DT was going for the evening. I don't think that means that the sect member that killed him stayed in the kitchen. I have visions of the Jack the Ripper game in my head...when thinking of that.

[ntndeacon]

Also I have something that I think is important. (Mind I have no proof of this yet.) I started the game with the artificial lens. There is a jump in reasoning ihave made regarding it, but it is not something i havelearned from any source, but it makes sense. I do not plan to keep this, as I dont want the wolves to end up with it.

[Barkeep49]

Also I have something that I think is important. (Mind I have no proof of this yet.) I started the game with the artificial lens. There is a jump in reasoning ihave made regarding it, but it is not something i havelearned from any source, but it makes sense. I do not plan to keep this, as I dont want the wolves to end up with it.
I don't understand this post and it seems important, beyond the fact that you have the artificial lens but are planning on sending it to someone else.

[ntndeacon]

I think the lens is used for something important. My guess would be Crystal Ball.

[Passacaglia]

Seems like an odd play. Do you see yourself as being a possible lynch or night kill candidate for some reason?

[ntndeacon]

I was trying to share info. Once I had shared it I thought it would be something the wolves eould like to keep us from having. So I figured telling what Ihave then passing it would be a better use to everyone.

[hoopsguy]

Alan, are actions involving passing an item processed right away, or at the end of the day? So if I wanted to pass an item to NTN, for example, and sent you the PM, would you then send him a PM as soon as you read it or would he find out at the end of the day?

If it is real-time, then there is potential for multiple passes of an item - for example from Player A to Player B and back to Player A after validating, or on to Player C to see if we can find a point where the item stops moving (someone - a wolf? - wants it for their own devices).

[Passacaglia]

I think the heat is off Swaggs a little bit here. I didn't exactly suspect him of being a wolf, but I just wanted to place a vote as a point that I didn't like the idea of everyone passing him ingredients. Since we don't seem to be exploring that much, I'll lay off him.

UNVOTE SWAGGS

[st.cronin]

Pass, I have no intention of giving Swaggs anything. I neither trust him, nor distrust him.

[Alan T]

Alan, are actions involving passing an item processed right away, or at the end of the day? So if I wanted to pass an item to NTN, for example, and sent you the PM, would you then send him a PM as soon as you read it or would he find out at the end of the day?

If it is real-time, then there is potential for multiple passes of an item - for example from Player A to Player B and back to Player A after validating, or on to Player C to see if we can find a point where the item stops moving (someone - a wolf? - wants it for their own devices).

The passes are performed real time within reason. The intent is to allow someone to be passed an ingredient or item, plus be able to make a potion or magical item , plus be able to use it all within the same day cycle.

I don't have it in the rules, but I probably should limit 2 passes per day for any particular ingredient or item as mass validation isn't really the intention of this rule.

[Alan T]

Also in the ingredients listed in the rules, Holy water has been renamed to Spring water. The properties of the ingredient or any recipe it is in has remained unchanged, only the name was changed.


Sorry to add confusion.. This post I previously made was incorrect and due to a mess up on my part. I changed back Spring water -> Holy water in the potion list like it was previously.

In order to clear any further confusion, I have potions and magical items listed in the rules, but I don't have the ingredients listed in the rules for a reason. Since I messed up here, I'll try to explain fully so there isn't further confusion.

Holy Water = Potion with some unknown function or usage.
Spring Water = an ingredient that can be used in something.

If there are any other questions regarding this, feel free to drop me a PM. Once again sorry for any confusion caused here. :)

[ntndeacon]

Nice catch Hoops. I was under the impression that we would see the results of passing away stuff at the end of the day instead of real time.

[hoopsguy]

Alan, what happens to the items of the person who is lynched? Do they exit the game, are they randomly assigned, or something else?

[Barkeep49]

Ingredients and items of players who are killed by the daily vote will be randomly given out to those whom voted for them. Any potions or finished magical items will be given to the "deciding" vote on the player.
Here ya go hoops.

[hoopsguy]

Day 1 start (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/showthread.php?p=1492711#post1492711)
Day 1 end (http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/showthread.php?p=1493589#post1493589)

Game roster:
...
3) Daddytorgo - Killed night 1


No role listed, no formal name listed.
Was DT one of the people who listed his formal name in the thread? I am beginning to think it is less likely that this is important (based on the lack of that info in the post above) but am not willing to 100% abandon it until finding that DT kept that info to himself.

[hoopsguy]

Thanks, BK. I would suggest then that if a "villager" is going down to the vote that they strongly consider passing their items rather than going with a random dispersal among those voting for the person.

If they want to give the item to a person who voted for them, more power to them. But they might as well pick their fate rather than having random.org make the decision for them.

[ntndeacon]

Hoops, DT did not ever mention what his name was.

[hoopsguy]

OK, where did everyone go? I'm sneaking away from my meeting to see what is going on and the answer is nothing.

[st.cronin]

Dunno whats up, hoops, but I only count 3 votes so far:

1 - LoneStarGirl - st.cronin (164)
1 - hoopsguy - Barkeep49 (213)
1 - Izulde - path12 (219)

[st.cronin]

Everybody has checked in at some point, as well.

[hoopsguy]

Confirmed, Cronin. I just went through that same exercise as well. So it sounds like only a few people got meaningful information last night in terms of recipes/potions/etc.

OK, so if you were a wolf and didn't want to give away info how would you have played today?
1.) Not be the first to report info - you may or may not have PMs that are similar to what villagers received
2.) When you do report, don't report that you have info. Not at this point - there are enough people saying they have nothing

I would expect the wolves to change gears after today, but the plan above is how I expect they would have acted given the info we have seen so far. So, that is going to govern my voting behavior tonight unless someone can come up with what they consider a significant flaw here or a better approach.