I hate Frank MacCourt

[MrBug708]

And probable Depodesta. Dodgers trade LoDuca, Encarnation, and Mota for Brad Penny, Heep-See Choi, and a Double A pitcher.

We trade the second most popular Dodgers, a 23 year old future closers, and a starting OF for a pitcher who wasn't even the Fins 2 best pitchers, a first basemen whose not bad and a minor leaguer.

Fine, so you don't want to trade LoDuca, whatever, but trading Mota? We didn't trade Mota for Beltran and he's better then anyone in this deal....

[MrBug708]

This is also the same owner who owes the IRS some 30 million dollars in back taxes on a vacation Home.

[SackAttack]

I'm going to give DePodesta the benefit of the doubt on this move until season's end, if only because it's his first major move as GM.

I fucking hate losing LoDuca. I think, from a chemistry perspective, that's the worst thing the Dodgers could have done, and moving Mota is going to seriously hurt the bullpen.

At first blush, I hate this trade, but if the Dodgers win the NL pennant and/or World Series...then I won't be quite so upset in six months.

[MrBug708]

If Penny nails Bonds in his first game vs the Giants, I won't be so sad

[JonInMiddleGA]

I had to go look at ESPN to see this one for myself, it sounded so asinine that I really thought you might be joking, or passing along a rumor or something like that.

Their take, FWIW, says this might be a domino move that sets them up to get Randy Johnson and/or Steve Finley. They don't explain that any further, but I'm guessing the suggestion would be the package of players from Florida to Arizona. At that point, it becomes LoDuca, Encarnacion & Mota for Unit/Finley and Charles Johnson (who they say the Dodgers got from the Rockies late this afternoon).

Well, I still don't think I'd have made the deal, but it doesn't sound quite as ridiculous as the straight LA-Fla trade.

[cschex]

Well, they've traded for Charles Johnson to replace Lo Duca. A net downgrade, but not too much of one, plus Lo Duca is an FA after this year. The key is obviously getting rid of Encarnacion, who has been putrid this year.
Brad Penny certainly was either the Marlins #1 or #1A pitcher, depending on how you rate Pavano, and Choi is having a very nice season. This weakens the bullpen, but overall the Dodgers by far got the better end of this deal.

[Philliesfan980]

When Penny's on, he can be very very good.

Oh wait, I'm a Phillies fan and he only pitches lights out against us.

Not a bad trade, although its surprising on the Marlins end. They're getting back into the divisional race and I think trading one of your better starting pitchers is a good way to get out of it quickly.

[SackAttack]

Jon, that's partly why I'm reserving judgment. I think getting rid of LoDuca was a terrible move, and getting Charles Johnson again? Shades of 1996, doncha think? "Hey, let's trade our popular catcher and bring Charles Johnson in to catch."

We'll see what we're left with after the dust settles, but for a team that's won 18 of their last 23, or something insane like that, moving a team leader like LoDuca and one of the best arms in our bullpen for Penny and Choi looks terrible on the surface.

[MrBug708]

*sigh*

Anyway to get cheaper, eh Frank?

[Danny]

MrBug, come on. I like Loduca as well, but from a talent stand point this is a great move by the Dodgers. Loduca is a 32 year old catcher who is known to have bad second halves. Encarnacion sucks, bad. Mota is a great setup man, but he's still someone who will only give you 90 innings in a season. Penny is a very talented 26 year old starter with an ERA close to 3. Hee Seop Choi is a talented young 1B who has a higher OBP than anybody currently on the Dodgers and that prospect (who is a very good one) will likely be used in another deal.

[SackAttack]

Well, they've traded for Charles Johnson to replace Lo Duca. A net downgrade, but not too much of one, plus Lo Duca is an FA after this year. The key is obviously getting rid of Encarnacion, who has been putrid this year.
Brad Penny certainly was either the Marlins #1 or #1A pitcher, depending on how you rate Pavano, and Choi is having a very nice season. This weakens the bullpen, but overall the Dodgers by far got the better end of this deal.

I'm not buying it. As a situational hitter, LoDuca ranked among the best we had. He's not a power guy, but he hits very well with men in scoring position, he doesn't strike out, and he's an excellent defensive catcher.

We ditch Encarnacion, which makes me happy, but we move Green (who hasn't been much better) out to right field, and Choi plays first. I don't see an upgrade to the offense here.

HOLY SHIT.

AM 1150 out here is reporting that LA is trying to send CJ to the Marlins instead of LoDuca.

Ohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohplease

[cschex]

Whatever your feelings on this trade for the Dodgers, be glad you're not a Mets fan right now. They apparently traded Scott Kazmir, theit top pitching prospect and one of the best in the game, for Victor Zambrano.

[Philliesfan980]

Penny is a poor man's Jason Schmidt. Nice big game pitcher. I love the trade. Anything to get Choi (very solid) and Penny out of my division is great.

[Philliesfan980]

I'm not buying it. As a situational hitter, LoDuca ranked among the best we had. He's not a power guy, but he hits very well with men in scoring position, he doesn't strike out, and he's an excellent defensive catcher.

We ditch Encarnacion, which makes me happy, but we move Green (who hasn't been much better) out to right field, and Choi plays first. I don't see an upgrade to the offense here.

HOLY SHIT.

AM 1150 out here is reporting that LA is trying to send CJ to the Marlins instead of LoDuca.

Ohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohplease

Choi is better than Green at this stage of his career.

[SackAttack]

But we're not replacing Green. He's simply shifting out to right field. We're losing a very good offensive catcher, if AM 1150 is wrong about CJ going instead of LoDuca, and we're getting Choi in place of Encarnacion, basically. CJ is declining defensively, hasn't been much offensively in a while, and we've impacted our bullpen.

Choi better than Green? Perhaps. But is our offense better for it overall? Not a chance.

[rexallllsc]

And probable Depodesta. Dodgers trade LoDuca, Encarnation, and Mota for Brad Penny, Heep-See Choi, and a Double A pitcher.

We trade the second most popular Dodgers, a 23 year old future closers, and a starting OF for a pitcher who wasn't even the Fins 2 best pitchers, a first basemen whose not bad and a minor leaguer.

Who is the 23 year-old future closer?

[Danny]

Probably the 31 year old Mota

[cschex]

Which is 3 years older than Gagne. I have a hunch they're going to hang onto Gagne for a while as well.

[Arles]

Consolidated threads here. Here's the ESPN story, it appears it's a done deal:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=1849414

The double A pitcher (Bill Murphy) is one of the top pitching prospects in baseball. As much as I like LoDuca and Mota, getting Penny, Choi and a top pitching prospect is a nice move.

Here's hoping Arizona can get Murphy, Penny, Werth and maybe a catching prospect from LA for Johnson and Finley.

[Danny]

Id love to get Johnson, but if there is a way I would much rather keep Penny to go along with RJ in the rotation.

[SackAttack]

I don't know that LA's going to move either of their catching prospects, Arles. With LoDuca gone, CJ is a short-term option at best, which suggests that either Koyie Hill or David Ross will be the starting catcher next season.

[Danny]

Ross is 27 and not much of a prospect. I dont see Arizona really wanting him.

[pennywisesb]

Id love to get Johnson, but if there is a way I would much rather keep Penny to go along with RJ in the rotation.
I feel the same way. Brad Penny is a good pitcher with the potential to be great. He's only 26 years old, and could pitch for a long time in LA (RJ probably has maybe 2 years left if they even keep him). But those two together, along with the Odalis Perez and Kaz Ishii is pretty formidable. Now if the Dodgers could just get rid of Nomo.......

[SackAttack]

Ross is 27 and not much of a prospect. I dont see Arizona really wanting him.

LoDuca was the same way when he finally broke in with the Dodgers. He got stuck for years behind Angel "Fatass" Pena and Mike Piazza, but blossomed in 2001. Was never much of a power guy despite his 25 HR year (and the 10 or so he's got this year), but he was routinely our most reliable hitter. I look for good things from Ross, 27 or not.

That isn't the point, though; the point is that the Dodgers at this point don't have much in the way of young catching that they're likely to spin off for RJ. If LoDuca is FA after this season, hopefully LA brings him back.

[Danny]

UPDATE- Encarnacion and Mota received word that they have been traded and are not with the Dodgers in San Diego. Loduca is with the Dodgers and has not been imformed he has been traded YET. Stay tuned.

[SackAttack]

ohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohpleaseohplease

[Arles]

Maybe they're saving LoDuca for Arizona, to go along with Werth and Penny for Johnson and Finley ;)

[cschex]

If the Dodgers can convince the Fish to take Johnson instead of Lo Duca this will be the most lopsided trade in the past few years.

[Danny]

Now I guess 1150 said he was just notifed of the trade. Maybe they failed in attemps to get another catcher to go to Florida instead.

[SackAttack]

*cries*

[rexallllsc]

Which is 3 years older than Gagne. I have a hunch they're going to hang onto Gagne for a while as well.

Exactly. This was prob. a move to free up a tad of salary to keep Gagne.

[Arles]

Gammons just came on and said a source close to Johnson said he would probably agree to a trade to LA. That deal would probably include Penny, Werth and possible two more prospects for Johnson.

He also said it may be up to Finley to decide whether he goes to SD or LA. Both teams appear to be offering two nice prospects for Finley and Arizona is inclined to take either deal (although they are a little wary of trading him to SD as they will probably lose the ability to resign him).

Should be an interesting night with Johnson slated to start in a few hours in Colorado.

[Chief Rum]

My brother is a huge Dodgers fan, and I just had to be the guy to break the news to him. :(

He was not happy. LoDuca is his favorite player. His wife's too. He even threatened to become an Angels fan. I told him he would think better when he calmed down. ;)

I really feel for Dodgers fans. Even if they end up with Randy Johnson.

CR

[rexallllsc]

Gammons just came on and said a source close to Johnson said he would probably agree to a trade to LA. That deal would probably include Penny, Werth and possible two more prospects for Johnson.

He also said it may be up to Finley to decide whether he goes to SD or LA. Both teams appear to be offering two nice prospects for Finley and Arizona is inclined to take either deal (although they are a little wary of trading him to SD as they will probably lose the ability to resign him).

Should be an interesting night with Johnson slated to start in a few hours in Colorado.

Werth isn't getting PT here anyways, so I don't mind...but I'd hate to lose Penny. Johnson is prob. done after this year.

[pennywisesb]

CR, whatever you do, DO NOT let him become an Angels fan. That's just gonna cause him more heartbreak this year when the A's win the West. ;)

[SunDevil]

Nothing like trading your good players away to your division rival, if the trade with LA and AZ go down.

[Arles]

Another interesting comment on Phoenix radio. A source close to Randy said that he is considering the Dodgers because it would allow him to vie for the Cy Young still. He figures to get another 11-12 starts. And, with Gagne, he thinks he can win 8-9 which puts him at 19 wins and maybe gets the Cy Young.

[cschex]

Wait, I though Johnson only wanted to go to the Yankees because he wanted a "real World Series contender." Now he just wants another Cy Young. Thats a great atitude. What total BS.

[Arles]

Nothing like trading your good players away to your division rival, if the trade with LA and AZ go down.
I would guess the fact that Arizona is currently 27.5 games behind the Dodgers makes this a little moot with Finley (since he's a FA). For Johnson, Arizona would only face him 3-4 times next year max.

I think if LA or San Diego offers a good deal you take it - esp for two 40-year old guys.

[Franklinnoble]

Sheesh... Johnson already has a ring and a Cy Young... what's the point?

[Bad-example]

If Penny nails Bonds in his first game vs the Giants, I won't be so sad
:rolleyes:

[Buccaneer]

The Pads message board and I are just sitting back watching the fireworks around us. As of right now, it appears the Duds have degraded themselves (esp with Mota and Loduca gone). Finley will be an upgrade for Payton in the OF so we're seeing what happens but if nothing does, the Pads are still in good shape as they are.

[Ksyrup]

I think the Marlins gave up too much. LoDuca is OK, but nothing special (although a huge upgrade over NOTHING!), but giving up Choi (who's on first, Conine?!), Penny, and a good prospect for Mota (they don't need a closer, so he'll play the same role) and Encarnacion, a guy the Dodgers gave a relatively big contract to when he could have been signed for much less (and has played like it)? I don't like this deal for Florida at ALL.

[Arles]

I don't know, I kind of liked the deal for both teams. Florida already has Pavano and Willis as nice starters, plus Beckett is coming off the DL on Monday and should take up where Penny left off. Their top three holes were catcher, middle relief and a third OF. So, by getting LoDuca, Mota and Encarnacion they filled all their holes. And, if you consider Beckett for Penny a fair swap, all they really lost was Choi.

For the Dodgers, they get a nice starter in Penny and someone with some pop at first in Choi. They also picked up Johnson to fill the catcher hole.

I think both teams improved themselves with this deal.

[Ksyrup]

Encarnacion sucks, and Pavano is a free agent after the season. With Penny, at least they could have kept him for another year, albeit an arbitration year. I don't think they have a shot at keeping Pavano.

[SunDevil]

I can not imagine the Marlins have much depth at first base. They have now traded two of them in the last two years. First Derek Lee to the Cubs, now Choi to LA.

[Vaj]

Leave it to Dodger fans to bitch and moan when their team fleeces another...

[SackAttack]

didn't they wait until the offseason to offload Lee?

[JonInMiddleGA]

At first base, for the Marlins ... Damian Easley

[Ksyrup]

At first base, for the Marlins ... Damian Easley
He's still being paid by the Tigers to NOT play, isn't he?

[Arles]

breakdown by ESPN, they think the Marlins got the best of LA if the Dodgers don't end up with Johnson and Finley:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=1846812

Buster Olney on the Marlins: 4/4
Why they did it: The Marlins needed upgrades in their offense and their bullpen, adding protection to closer Armando Benitez, and they picked up a solid hitter in Lo Duca (.301 average, .351 on-base percentage), a proven run-producer in Encarnacion, and one of baseball's best set-up men in Mota.

The potential risk: In dealing Penny, the Marlins are gambling that the depth in their rotation will hold up -- that Josh Beckett's blister problem won't resurface, that Dontrelle Willis will pitch with greater consistency, that A.J. Burnett's command will improve as he continues to recover from surgery. Murphy has allowed 59 walks and 17 homers in 103 2/3 innings in Double A this season, while generating 113 strikeouts and a 4.08 ERA, but scouts believe he's better than those numbers.

The potential reward: They strengthened their lineup markedly and got Mota, against whom opponents are hitting .228. He's 8-4 with a power arm, and has generated 52 strikeouts in 63 innings.

Conclusion: Great trade for the Marlins, a deal that will give them a chance to win the NL East and perhaps defend their world title.

Buster Olney on the Dodgers: 2/4
Why they did it: The Dodgers are looking to upgrade their starting rotation, and there could be more dealing to come -- perhaps for Arizona's Steve Finley or Randy Johnson.

The potential risk: L.A. effectively broke up what was the heart of the team --- the Dodgers' exceptional bullpen. Between closer Eric Gagne and setup men Mota and Darren Dreifort, the Dodgers had a chance to go into the postseason with some Nasty Boys-type clones: That trio had amassed 181 strikeouts in 155 innings. Mota was a huge part of this team, and Lo Duca was the heart and soul of the club, a guy who always played hard. Penny upgrades the rotation, if he stays in L.A., and his postseason experience will help, but he is not a dominant pitcher. Choi hits homers and draws walks, but he had 78 whiffs in 281 at-bats this year, and he was hitting .238 with runners in scoring position; part of the reason the Marlins needed to make this trade was because rallies tended to die with Choi. The reported acquisition of Charles Johnson would bring another high punchout guy, with 69 in 240 at-bats. In some ways, it's as if the Dodgers forgot they had accumulated one of the best records in the game, at 59-42 -- and 35-20 since May 28.

The potential reward: If they get Johnson and Finley, in the end, the Marlins' deal makes more sense. Both are postseason tested, and Johnson would be the anchor for the staff.

Conclusion: Strange. They've messed with success

[SackAttack]

If the Dodgers get Johnson, it's easier to swallow. If they only end up with Finley (or neither), then the game I'm going to next Saturday will very likely be my last visit to Dodger Stadium this season. LoDuca's been my favorite Dodger the last three years, even with Gagne's emergence. The only Dodger t-shirt I've got in my closet? LoDuca's.

[Ksyrup]

a proven run-producer in Encarnacion

I hate it when writers throw around meaningless terms like this. A "proven run-producer?!" The guy's had 2 decent RBI years - never even reaching 100 once, and only getting beyond 75 twice - and, he's having a bad year this year. He's only had an OPS above .800 once - and that was .804! Unless he suddenly regains last year's form, this guy is no improvement in the lineup.

[SunDevil]

On that topic, can Dodger fans explain to me what is so special about Adrian Beltre? And if there is, does it just refer to what he has done this season?

[Arles]

I hate it when writers throw around meaningless terms like this. A "proven run-producer?!" The guy's had 2 decent RBI years - never even reaching 100 once, and only getting beyond 75 twice - and, he's having a bad year this year. He's only had an OPS above .800 once - and that was .804! Unless he suddenly regains last year's form, this guy is no improvement in the lineup.
I agree, I didn't want to comment initially and just let this guy's comments sink in. But, he certainly has a high value of Encarnacion and a low value of Choi. It almost seems that he would prefer Encarnacion over Choi, which is silly considering Choi has more HRs and the same number of RBIs in 100 fewer ABs - not to mention an average 35 points higher as well.

I still stand by the comment that, on talent, this was a fair deal. But, I do see the point on clubhouse chemistry with LoDuca.

Also, as someone that follows the DBacks (although my heart is still in St. Louis), I'll gladly trade the Dodgers Randy if Arizona doesn't have to face LoDuca anymore. That guy wore the DBacks out.

[Philliesfan980]

Beltre's in a contract year. Next year when he gets paid way more than he's worth, he'll be back to his old, lazy self.

[Ksyrup]

And Johnson's got a 1-hitter, 1-0 lead in the 7th. I'd really prefer him to stay in Arizona, but it wouldn't kill me to see him in LA. At this point, it's anywhere but NY.

[Ksyrup]

The other thing about Encarnacion is that the Marlins could have resigned him after last year, and likely for less than the Dodgers are paying him. So in one respect, he can almost be erased from this deal, since the Marlins screwed up by not keeping him at a lesser salary.

[Crapshoot]

I cannot bellieve this deal- I think the Dodgers got a steal. Hee Seep Choi has a VOPR of 27.7 and has 40 HR power- too many idiots (aka Olney) see 78 K's and whine- instead, they forget the .275/.385/.495. Murphy is a very good prospect, and is probably a useful chip to acquire other things. Penny has a VORP of 33.3 - a 3.15 ERA.


They gave up Encarnacion, who the Marlins traded for crap this off season because they werent going to offer arb- now they picked him up, and the 4 million he's owed next year ? WTF ? Mota has a VORP of 24.2, put he's a goddamn MR- he's not worth Penny and Choi. Loduca is a 32 year old FA to be catcher with a VORP of 22.2 (Encarnacion is at 0.7). So The Dodgers significantly improved their major league team, dealt two older players who are liable to have had their best seasons, for a stud pitcher, 40 HR potential 880 OPS 1b, and a top prospect. How anyone can call this a win for the Florida is beyond me- but Buster Olney at ESPN has always proved to be an idiot.
Hell, I think Penny for Mota would have been a steal for the Dodgers.

[Ksyrup]

I agree, Aadik. Choi being in this deal at all is curious.

FYI, the Fullmer deal to SD was called off because Fullmer's injury is worse than expected. SD traded for Dave Hansen instead.

[Chief Rum]

Okay, I'll bite. What's VORP?

CR

[Crapshoot]

CR, VORP is Value OVer replacement player- how much runs a player is worth more than your average "replacement player" (generally defined as about 75-80 of league average at that positin) . In either case, the media acts like Choi was not part of this deal- he was. He's a damn good player, and its a shame that idiots like Olney or Rosenthal can't notice this. In effect, the Dodgers got younger, cheaper, and better in one move- and they got a higher potential upside. as a Giants fan, I cry tonight.

[MrBug708]

Beltre's in a contract year. Next year when he gets paid way more than he's worth, he'll be back to his old, lazy self.

And yet, this is the potential he was supposed to show....

[Crapshoot]

Ksyrup, as I recall, you are a Dodgers fan right ? you should be dancing in the streets- you guys clinched the West tonight.

[Ksyrup]

No, I'm not. Phillies fan. Thanks for Rodriguez!

[cschex]

Yeah, it's not just ESPN. FoxSports, Sportsline,...it seems like all the majors think the Marlins just pulled off a great trade. I believe Harold Reynolds said on BBTN that the Dodgers "handed the Marlins the pennant."

WTF?

Trading your second best starter and third best hitter does not equal NL title unless the player you get back is named Bonds or Alex Rodriguez.

[MrBug708]

LoDuca was an all-star....

[cschex]

So was Joe Girardi.

Sorry, that was too flippant. Look, I'm not saying Lo Duca isn't a good player, he certainly is, but he's a 32 yr old catcher who will be a free agent, and it is well-documented that catchers break down around this age. Not to mention that the Dodgers significantly upgraded their pitching staff and their offense (yes, losing Lo Duca is a blow but C Johnson+Choi>Lo Duca+Encarnacion, plus Werth gets more AB's if he isn't traded to AZ)

I know Dodgers fans love Lo Duca and he's a fun guy to watch play, but he isn't the second coming of Mike Piazza, and it seems like this trade is being decried as much as that one was. I just don't see it.

[Crapshoot]

No, I'm not. Phillies fan. Thanks for Rodriguez!

I dont really get this. Ledee is a useful LH bat, and will probably start against Rh- while Simon was your no 6 prospect according to BA, and has improved even more this year (read Ba's feature on him this year- Im not their biggest fans , but they do their research). Rodriguez is good, but not 3.15 million good- which is what they will pay him next year if he picks up his option (the team option is worth 5 mil if he doest pick his up). I think the Giants got the better end of the deal by far, but it makes no sense right now- the Giants biggest problem right now is not the fact that their offense (no 3 in the NL by EQA, just behind the dodgers) but the "blowpen" - and this seems to work against it. Its the kind of deal where I think we won in value, but not in need.

[Crapshoot]

LoDuca was an all-star....

so was Mike Williams. the point being that the same idiots who think Encarnacion is a "run-producer" help hype these things.

[Crapshoot]

Yeah, it's not just ESPN. FoxSports, Sportsline,...it seems like all the majors think the Marlins just pulled off a great trade. I believe Harold Reynolds said on BBTN that the Dodgers "handed the Marlins the pennant."

WTF?

Trading your second best starter and third best hitter does not equal NL title unless the player you get back is named Bonds or Alex Rodriguez.

but he's a proven veteran man - think about the chemistry!!!

:D

[Danny]

I knew it was only a matter of time before Aadik would be heralding the Dodgers for this trade :).

[SackAttack]

Bleh.

Yahoo MLB is reporting that the Rockies and Dodgers did, in fact, agree to a trade involving Charles Johnson (who then would have gone to Florida, I guess, leaving LoDuca in LA), but CJ hasn't approved it yet because he hasn't decided whether to waive his no-trade clause.

All I can say is, he better stay the fuck out of LA. He is most definitely not welcome, as far as I'm concerned.

[cuervo72]

Hmm, CJ has a better OBP, and a better SLG (ok, he does play in COL) than LoDuca (and RSIP be damned....unless you believe in "clutch" hitting). Does CJ still have his great defense/arm? Encarnacion has been choaderrific - a .289 OBP?? Choi is a major upgrade here. And sure Mota is a good setup guy, but you're getting a very solid SP.

What the hell is all the bitching about?

[Crapshoot]

The bitching is about perception as opposed to reality.

And EE, you know me too well then... Ive just about conceded the division now- the wild card is the goal.

[lynchjm24]

This trade is absolutly brilliant for Los Angeles. I don't see any logic to the contrary. Hell the fact that Harold Reynolds loves it so much only makes me think it's an even better deal for the Dodgers.

They unloaded a 32 year old catcher who has miserable (MISERABLE) second halves and got back either the guys they will turn into Randy Johnson or a very capable starter and a bopper to play first base. They also unloaded the useless Encarnacion, which is addition by subtraction. Mota's a good pitcher, but he's replaceable.

[Ksyrup]

CJ's defense has dropped dramatically in the past few years. It used to be that teams would take him even with a .230 BA, because of his D. Now, that's not the case.

And I was going to point out what lynchjm24 just did - i don't know too much about LoDuca, but the ony constant I'm always hearing about is how badly he tanks in the 2nd half.

[SackAttack]

LoDuca's second halves are because in the past the dude has usually played just about every game behind the plate. It wears on him.

Tracy was using him more sparingly this year, but...now that he's in Florida, we're not going to get a chance to see if that would have made a difference.

[SackAttack]

(and RSIP be damned....unless you believe in "clutch" hitting)

It's hard to argue. The last three years, with men in scoring position, LoDuca's hit .326. If that man is on third, he's hit .444. First and third, .514. Scoring position with two out, he's hitting .328.

Charles Johnson, in those same situations:

RISP: .238
Runner on 3rd: .162
First and third: .290
RISP, 2 out: .213

In both cases, those are their respective performances over three years, and as you pointed out, that's with CJ in Denver. I'm not terribly interested in seeing his limp noodle bat back in LA, particularly since his defense no longer terrifies baserunners the way it once did. Plus, y'know, CJ makes twice as much as LoDuca does.

[McSweeny]

It's hard to argue. The last three years, with men in scoring position, LoDuca's hit .326. If that man is on third, he's hit .444. First and third, .514. Scoring position with two out, he's hitting .328.

Charles Johnson, in those same situations:

RISP: .238
Runner on 3rd: .162
First and third: .290
RISP, 2 out: .213

In both cases, those are their respective performances over three years, and as you pointed out, that's with CJ in Denver. I'm not terribly interested in seeing his limp noodle bat back in LA, particularly since his defense no longer terrifies baserunners the way it once did. Plus, y'know, CJ makes twice as much as LoDuca does.

couple of things... over the past 3 years how many ABs has LoDuca had with RISP? This screams small sample size. And in regard to the money CJ is making, the Rockies were going to be picking up the majority of the money he was owed

[Arles]

ESPN is reporting Finley went to the Dodgers for Werth and prospects.

[Danny]

Dodgers wont be getting Charles Johnson. They wont get Randy Johnson either. They did get Steve Finley, but as of now it's not reported who they gave up although it was that Jason Werth and Edwin Jackson were not involved (thank goodness).

[Arles]

That's a bit of a bummer for DBack fans, they were prett high on Werth. Hopefully, Arizona got some kind of pitching prospect for Finley though.

[JonInMiddleGA]

That's a bit of a bummer for DBack fans, they were prett high on Werth. Hopefully, Arizona got some kind of pitching prospect for Finley though.

They get LHP Bill Murphy that the Dodgers acquired yesterday.

[Arles]

Yeah, they got the catcher (Hill) and the SP (Murphy) they needed for Finley. I don't know much about the young OF, but he looks like he will need some time to see if he amounts to anything. Considering Finley and Mayne would have been FAs at seasons end, getting two good prospects (Hill will probably join the team now) for them in key areas of need is about all you can ask for.

Plus, the team didn't have to give up RJ. And don't forget, the DBacks will have Finley (7 mil), Mantei (7 mil), Batista (4 mil), Dessens (4 mil) and Alomar (1 mil) all off the books at season's end. That gives them about $23 mil to play with. Figure it will cost about an extra 4 mill a year to resign Sexson (over what he's making now), leaving 19 million with which to add another pitcher, bullpen arm and OF.

Not all that bad a situation for a team knocking at 100 losses right now.

[Crapshoot]

umm Sexson is making 8.5 mil right now- he's not getting 12.5 million next year. Thats not exactly true, because the D-backs have truckloads of deferred money- from the Schilling contract, to the first Johnson contract, to the Luis Gonzales contract, to the Matt Williams deal.

[cschex]

The Diamondbacks have been in a precarious money situation for years. I applaud them for sticking to their guns on Randy Johnson, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're going to be able to spend the money they shed from the payroll in the offseason. I wouldn't be that surprised to see Unit traded in the offseason, either.

[Arles]

umm Sexson is making 8.5 mil right now- he's not getting 12.5 million next year. Thats not exactly true, because the D-backs have truckloads of deferred money- from the Schilling contract, to the first Johnson contract, to the Luis Gonzales contract, to the Matt Williams deal.
There was a story in the Phoenix paper yesterday that Sexson is looking for a 4-5 year deal from Arizona at 12-13 mil a season. So, that will be an extra 4 mil for next season. The deferred money has already been budgeted as well (and will be about $4.5 mil in 2005). So, instead of $19 mil, maybe they will spend 15. The point is that is still enough money to get a No. 2 pitcher, bullpen arm and OF.

[Arles]

The Diamondbacks have been in a precarious money situation for years. I applaud them for sticking to their guns on Randy Johnson, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're going to be able to spend the money they shed from the payroll in the offseason. I wouldn't be that surprised to see Unit traded in the offseason, either.
I wouldn't either, to be honest. But Joe jr. just said that even if they keep Johnson for 2005, that they figure to be a player in FA for a pitcher and OF depth next offseason. You can get a nice pitcher for 5-7 mil, resign Sexson, bring in a OF for $4 mil and still be 7-8 million less than you were in 2004.

[Crapshoot]

There was a story in the Phoenix paper yesterday that Sexson is looking for a 4-5 year deal from Arizona at 12-13 mil a season. So, that will be an extra 4 mil for next season. The deferred money has already been budgeted as well (and will be about $4.5 mil in 2005). So, instead of $19 mil, maybe they will spend 15. The point is that is still enough money to get a No. 2 pitcher, bullpen arm and OF.

And if that's what sexson wants, they should let him walk. 12 million can get a lot more than Sexson. the prospects for him are a sunk cost and should not be a consideration.

[bhlloy]

Dodgers make themselves contenders with this move, you have to have a good 1-2-3 rotation to be in with a chance against the likes of the Yankees. I don't see what's not to like although they do have a hole at C now. But with Green surely improving (can't get any worse?), Beltre in a contract year and Choi's added power in the lineup it's by no means a bad offense.

I'm slightly worried about losing Mota (would much rather have seen Dreifort gone - what a steal the trade would have been then) because quality setup men are hard to come by, but a quality number 3 pitcher is more valuable than a setup man anyday. In the playoffs I think Gagne can easily go an extra inning if needed - the guy used to be a starter and has made a few inning plus outings over the last couple of years

[Arles]

And if that's what sexson wants, they should let him walk. 12 million can get a lot more than Sexson. the prospects for him are a sunk cost and should not be a consideration.
In the four years prior to 2004, Sexson had been a .275 - 38 HR - 110 RBI guy. In free agency, that's going to set you back atleast 11-13 million. If they can get him for 12, I say do it. Remember, before he went out, Arizona was close to a .500 team (9-11). When he went out, Arizona lost 12 of their next 17 games.

He's a respected threat that hits cleanup with good run production. He's also one of only about 8-10 guys that can get you 40 HRs on a consistent basis. I would pay 12 a year for him.

[lynchjm24]

In the four years prior to 2004, Sexson had been a .275 - 38 HR - 110 RBI guy. In free agency, that's going to set you back atleast 11-13 million.

Not anymore it doesn't. Throw Delgado into the free agent mix and a limited number of bidders and I can't see either one getting into 8 figures on any deal that is 3 years or longer.

Edit: By 8 figures, I mean yearly - not total...

[Arles]

Then I hope AZ gets him for 10 mil.

[Chief Rum]

BS...my impression is even with limited bidders, respected power hitters get the cash. Delgado and Sexson will both get eight figures per year. Mark it down and call me on it later if you like. But if they hit the open market, they will get those figures in free agency.

CR

[lynchjm24]

BS...my impression is even with limited bidders, respected power hitters get the cash. Delgado and Sexson will both get eight figures per year. Mark it down and call me on it later if you like. But if they hit the open market, they will get those figures in free agency.

CR

Over how many years? If you think it's more then 3 then you've got yourself a bet.

How'd that Mighty Duck bet work out for you by the way? :)

[Chief Rum]

Over how many years? If you think it's more then 3 then you've got yourself a bet.

How'd that Mighty Duck bet work out for you by the way? :)

Good point. I'm not sure they will get longer than three, and missed that qualification the first time around. It wouldn't surprise me if they did get longer than three-year deals, but I'm not as certain of that as I am the eight-figure amount.

As for the Ducks bet, I was wondering when you were going to call me on that. If I recall correctly, you almost didn't take it, because making the playoffs is so "easy", so I can't really give you too much credit for being talked into this one.

That said, I have been thinking about how to ante up on that one. The pic I was going to use is in film paper form (not on a computer), and I don't have a scanner. I have been avoiding taking the picture to a place with a scanner to load up. :)

CR

[Driftwood]

Isnt Frank McCourt the guy who wrote Angelas Ashes, or something?

[SackAttack]

Yep, but it's a different Frank McCourt. ;)